To Kill a Hurricane

Jan 19, 2010
12,925
Hobie 16 & Rhodes 22 Skeeter Charleston
Yesterday at lunch, I was musing with some of my colleagues on the feasibility of using liquid nitrogen (LN2) to short circuit a hurricane’s thermal feedback loop. I did a few calculations on what volume of LN2 would you need to completely displace the air in the eye of a hurricane with cold nitrogen gas.


Here is some data to work with,

d(LN2) = 0.807g/ml = 807 g/L

A typical dewar of liquid nitrogen is 160 Liters or (807 g/L X 160L) = 129,120 g


Total moles of N2 in a 160L dewar of LN2 is (129,120 g ÷ 28 g/mol) = 4,611 moles

Solving for V in the equation PV = nRT.....If 160 L of liquid nitrogen were allowed to expand to room temperature it would occupy a volume of
upload_2017-9-8_18-28-35.png

What is the volume of a typical hurricane eye? Typical height of a hurricane is 45,000 ft and the typical diameter is 20 miles = 105,600 feet or a typical radius is 52,800 ft. Plug those into

upload_2017-9-8_18-30-1.png


Convert the volume to liters and you get 1.116E14 L.
So to completely displace all of the air in the eye of a typical hurricane with expanding nitrogen from a liquid nitrogen dewar, you would need 989 dewars of liquid nitrogen.
Call it a 1,000 to keep it simple.
SEEMS DOABLE!​
I did a little more research on the mechanics of a hurricane’s eye. Turns out that the strongest updraft is at the eye wall. On either side of the eye wall is a down draft. I think you would want to dissipate the liquid nitrogen near the surface just to the outside of the eye.

A fleet of C-140 cargo planes filled with LN2 dewars, each with a brick of C4 and an altitude detonator switch should do the trick. Fly in circles over the top of the hurricane's eye sprinkling these dewars into the hurricane.... ?????
 
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Feb 20, 2011
8,062
Island Packet 35 Tucson, AZ/San Carlos, MX
Except for the service and absolute altitude limits of the aircraft, that's very exciting work!
 
Jan 18, 2016
782
Catalina 387 Dana Point
C-140 would be a bit small, heavy, underpowered, and there weren't all that many made (as C-140s rather than a JetStar)

C-130 OTOH, would be a good choice. :)

Those folks that fly through hurricanes in C-130s to get windspeed info are just badass IMHO.

What happens if I'm in the eye and you drop 160K liters of nitrogen on me? Do I freeze? What do I breathe?
 

JamesG161

SBO Weather and Forecasting Forum Jim & John
Feb 14, 2014
8,019
Hunter 430 Waveland, MS
Call it a 1,000 to keep it simple.
I applaud your science. You were a bit off on your calculator.
Number of Dewars is more like.
Eye volume / expanded volume of 1 Dewar =
9,890,986,439.7767 or 9.89 Billion Dewars.:yikes:

I can't resist...:pimp:
You would need an non adiabatic expansion of liquid Nitrogen, in addition the lack of Oxygen to the people below the eye would asphyxiate them.

I take the New Orleans famous drink... hic.. Hurricane.
Jim...
 

JamesG161

SBO Weather and Forecasting Forum Jim & John
Feb 14, 2014
8,019
Hunter 430 Waveland, MS
You got me thinking [a dangerous thing:pimp:]. I quickly went to my Star Truk reference Library.

I seems Mr Spook and Captain Kerd were trying to stop a Killer Storm that was heading to destroy the mating grounds for the great white Shurks that are borderline extinct.

Mr Spooks tri-corder recording...
"One star class battle cruiser at near warp 1, flying clockwise and opposing the Storms winds =10.8 giga joules"
"The stored, dying Sun's, solar energy at Storms Center = 100 giga Tera joules"
"Using my hand solar calculator.... hmmmm?!"
"Captain, we would need to enlist our entire Fleet plus 55 ClingGun war birds, but it will work!!"

Captain Kerd could be heard faintly in background...
" Poor Shurks. Mr ChekUP set course for Beta Vargus 4, Warp 4...please..."

Jim...
 
Sep 30, 2013
3,683
1988 Catalina 22 North Florida
You got me thinking [a dangerous thing:pimp:]. I quickly went to my Star Truk reference Library.

I seems Mr Spook and Captain Kerd were trying to stop a Killer Storm that was heading to destroy the mating grounds for the great white Shurks that are borderline extinct.

Mr Spooks tri-corder recording...
"One star class battle cruiser at near warp 1, flying clockwise and opposing the Storms winds =10.8 giga joules"
"The stored, dying Sun's, solar energy at Storms Center = 100 giga Tera joules"
"Using my hand solar calculator.... hmmmm?!"
"Captain, we would need to enlist our entire Fleet plus 55 ClingGun war birds, but it will work!!"

Captain Kerd could be heard faintly in background...
" Poor Shurks. Mr ChekUP set course for Beta Vargus 4, Warp 4...please..."

Jim...

This is the answer. I know because Superman once stopped a tornado the exact same way. :clap:
 
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JamesG161

SBO Weather and Forecasting Forum Jim & John
Feb 14, 2014
8,019
Hunter 430 Waveland, MS
Stardate 2314:
Medical Officer Dr Zones notes:
"Sent Nurse Stari Ayezz with a bottle of Ancient Dewar's Scotch and Clear Rum and Punch for Ancient Cajun cure.. Hurricanes, to the Officer's Ward Room. Depression had been noted. Ordered all Bridge Officers at time of the sad Shurks decision to recover in Ward Room."

"Opening my personal library of Superman comics to relax. Rushed to show Mr. Spook, Superman's idea for tornadoes."

Jim...
 
Aug 22, 2017
1,609
Hunter 26.5 West Palm Beach
The E14 had me thinking that you might be off by a few orders of magnitude, but someone else already caught that that little detail.

My next question would be - why do the combined gas law calculation for room temperature? Isn't the idea to get things cold? Would not the more important calculation involve the latent heat of vaporization & thermal transfer to the surrounding humid air?

Its an interesting concept
(says the man sitting in the path of hurricane Irma as he types)
 
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May 24, 2004
7,213
CC 30 South Florida
Why wait until we have a Cat 5 at our doorstep. When this was just a disturbance leaving Africa and had been identified as having more than 90% chance of becoming a tropical storm that would be the time to kill these things. It would be out in no man's land and would be relatively small in size. How about a nuclear device delivered by a submarine to blow that formation to pieces; at the same time we would be conducting arms testing. It seems like we are leading into a cycle of stronger naturals disasters so something needs to be done worldwide. The global warming agreements do not work.