Bronze drive shaft needs to be replaced. Replacing with stainless steel. Deliberating over installation of either new dripless stuffing box vs. current drip type stuffing box. Any ideas or experience appreciated.
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DRIPLESS SHAFT SEAL
Frank,for what it is worth here is my thoughts,I would (did on my boat)install the pss dripless type packing box. I think they are great and most poeple who install them like them.Here is is the best,after you install new shaft, cutlass bearing,(do anyway even is the old one is good)and a pss shaft seal you will have a maintance free prop shaft(except zinc replacement) for five to ten years (maintance on the shaft seal is to "burp" it when you launch the boat- ten second job) Good Luck !
Frank,for what it is worth here is my thoughts,I would (did on my boat)install the pss dripless type packing box. I think they are great and most poeple who install them like them.Here is is the best,after you install new shaft, cutlass bearing,(do anyway even is the old one is good)and a pss shaft seal you will have a maintance free prop shaft(except zinc replacement) for five to ten years (maintance on the shaft seal is to "burp" it when you launch the boat- ten second job) Good Luck !
Flexible Shaft Coupling
would be my first choice as to what to install. I recently installed one on my H34 and I have never had such a smooth running shaft. As to the dripless shaft seal I removed mine when I installed the flex coupling. As the previous post said "from five to ten years". Problem is you don't know when and you can't repair(in my humble opinion) in the water. I had to wait six months for the availability of a trailer large enough to remove. I reinstalled old stuffing box and used the new "green" type flax. No runs, no drips, no errors. I can now repair in the water when necessary and save alot of money. Bottom line-You should definitely consider the Flex coupler from PYI. As to the dripless there are many opinions pro and con.
would be my first choice as to what to install. I recently installed one on my H34 and I have never had such a smooth running shaft. As to the dripless shaft seal I removed mine when I installed the flex coupling. As the previous post said "from five to ten years". Problem is you don't know when and you can't repair(in my humble opinion) in the water. I had to wait six months for the availability of a trailer large enough to remove. I reinstalled old stuffing box and used the new "green" type flax. No runs, no drips, no errors. I can now repair in the water when necessary and save alot of money. Bottom line-You should definitely consider the Flex coupler from PYI. As to the dripless there are many opinions pro and con.
Question to drip or not
I have an 86 c34 and i get a constant drip on my shaft. I just bought the boat and not sure how much it is suppose to drip if any. What would be the best solution to this propblem. I am planning on hauling the boat when i move so i would fix it then unless i need to do it right away. Thanks ~/)~~
I have an 86 c34 and i get a constant drip on my shaft. I just bought the boat and not sure how much it is suppose to drip if any. What would be the best solution to this propblem. I am planning on hauling the boat when i move so i would fix it then unless i need to do it right away. Thanks ~/)~~
Rich: Packing Gland Should Drip
only when shaft is turning. Most authorities recommend (there’s some variance) between 2 to 4 drips per minute, when turning, and none at all at rest. The key is to provide the minimum sufficient lubrication to prevent overheating; while limiting water intrusion. On "Southbound", I've found that as little as 1 drip per minute keeps the shaft/gland cool. Err on the side of 'wet', until you're certain. Angle cut (30 - 45 degrees) separate rings of packing to length, so that the beveled ends meet exactly [err (very slightly) on the side of too long]. Locate the joints at about 120 degree offsets (for 3 rings) around the perimeter, so that the joints do NOT line up. Tighten the re-packed gland just until no water leaks through. If re-packing on the dry, start with about ½ wrench turn past hand tight. In any case, make certain yopur bilge pump is working prior to starting the job. Run the engine (in gear) for about 5 minutes, expecting to see between 2 - 4 drips per minute. Shut down and check the gland for warmth. It’s not unusual for a newly re-packed gland to warm up at first, but there should be no continued warmth. Restart, and retest for warmth. Still warm, loosen gland slightly. More than 4 drops/minute, tighten gland 1/4 turn. Regards, Gord
only when shaft is turning. Most authorities recommend (there’s some variance) between 2 to 4 drips per minute, when turning, and none at all at rest. The key is to provide the minimum sufficient lubrication to prevent overheating; while limiting water intrusion. On "Southbound", I've found that as little as 1 drip per minute keeps the shaft/gland cool. Err on the side of 'wet', until you're certain. Angle cut (30 - 45 degrees) separate rings of packing to length, so that the beveled ends meet exactly [err (very slightly) on the side of too long]. Locate the joints at about 120 degree offsets (for 3 rings) around the perimeter, so that the joints do NOT line up. Tighten the re-packed gland just until no water leaks through. If re-packing on the dry, start with about ½ wrench turn past hand tight. In any case, make certain yopur bilge pump is working prior to starting the job. Run the engine (in gear) for about 5 minutes, expecting to see between 2 - 4 drips per minute. Shut down and check the gland for warmth. It’s not unusual for a newly re-packed gland to warm up at first, but there should be no continued warmth. Restart, and retest for warmth. Still warm, loosen gland slightly. More than 4 drops/minute, tighten gland 1/4 turn. Regards, Gord
Stuffing??Yeah, I'll have an extra helpin of that.
I agree with Gord, and Rich... Gord's tips are spot on, and I actually removed my dripless and went to a standard stuffing box before I left cruising, and I would never go offshore with a dripless design...Dripless Boxes can suffer catastrophic failure that would be very difficult to repair, and open up to the point where your electric pump probably wouldn't keep up. Though it probably doesn't happen often, what if it did? Regular stuffing boxes might leak, but it would be very difficult for it to reach a point that endanger the vessel, and repair is very simple really, even in the water once you get over the wierded out feeling of a bunch of water pouring in you boat!( You'll learn that feeling the first time someone pulls your log spinner out while your boat is in the water to clean the growth off it
) Just follow Gord's advise, and use a lubricant recommended for the type of stuffing material you use...By an extra roll to keep on board too...I mean, why not? It's only a few bucks. Drippless are also very expensive compared to a roll of stuffing!
I agree with Gord, and Rich... Gord's tips are spot on, and I actually removed my dripless and went to a standard stuffing box before I left cruising, and I would never go offshore with a dripless design...Dripless Boxes can suffer catastrophic failure that would be very difficult to repair, and open up to the point where your electric pump probably wouldn't keep up. Though it probably doesn't happen often, what if it did? Regular stuffing boxes might leak, but it would be very difficult for it to reach a point that endanger the vessel, and repair is very simple really, even in the water once you get over the wierded out feeling of a bunch of water pouring in you boat!( You'll learn that feeling the first time someone pulls your log spinner out while your boat is in the water to clean the growth off it
) Just follow Gord's advise, and use a lubricant recommended for the type of stuffing material you use...By an extra roll to keep on board too...I mean, why not? It's only a few bucks. Drippless are also very expensive compared to a roll of stuffing!
Dripless or Clueless???
Gentlemen The related link has 320 hits for dripless. Why is this still as subject for discussion? Asked and answered. In addition to the link, here's another: http://c34.infopop.cc/6/ubb.x?a=srch&s=329609511&findw=dripless Stu
Gentlemen The related link has 320 hits for dripless. Why is this still as subject for discussion? Asked and answered. In addition to the link, here's another: http://c34.infopop.cc/6/ubb.x?a=srch&s=329609511&findw=dripless Stu
Stu & the archive re "Careless"
Tnx for the site and link. When searched, 18 responses to the words "stuffing box" appeared. When searched, 11 responses to the word "dripless" appeared. On another search for "dripless" no responses appeared! Tell me, what is the crime in asking a question even though it has been brought up in the past? Does your information appear in the archives? It does now, so there should be no more "CARELESS" questions concerning stuffing boxes or dripless stuffing boxes.
Tnx for the site and link. When searched, 18 responses to the words "stuffing box" appeared. When searched, 11 responses to the word "dripless" appeared. On another search for "dripless" no responses appeared! Tell me, what is the crime in asking a question even though it has been brought up in the past? Does your information appear in the archives? It does now, so there should be no more "CARELESS" questions concerning stuffing boxes or dripless stuffing boxes.
Negative PSS story
Frank, I also liked the simplicity of the PSS and have thought about it, but earlier this summer a CS33 owner on Lake Ontario posted on the CS owners user group his story of hitting a log and having the PSS seal go out of alignment. Needless to say I am sticking with the conventional system. Here is the post: Hi All, I know there was a discussion about dripless shaft seals awhile back. We had an interesting episode on the weekend. We hit some debris with the propeller. No vibration, still driving along. In a few minutes, the high water alarm went off (very loud). Water was coming into the bilge from aft at about the same rate that the electric pump could empty it. My crew climbed into the emptied locker and checked for broken shafts, holes in the hull, etc. About that time, the water stopped coming in. (In the meantime our cruising companions and indirectly, the Coast Guard had been activated. Our thanks to all for standing by). We motored home at 5 knots, then had a friend dive on the prop, etc. Just one insignificant mark, and no damage or increased play. It would appear that the shock of the prop hitting the log whipped the shaft and unseated the PSS. It is in the right place, with the recommended hose clamp backup to the set screws. The flow of water must have held the seal open for a while then closed itself or was pushed by the crew checking it out. Has anybody with a dripless seal had a similar transient situation? Made a tremendous impression on all aboard, boats for miles around, as well as the US and Canadian Coast Guard. Also stimulated a major rush to purchase backup bilge pumps, pump handles and secondary radios. I can highly recommend a good audible high water alarm. An incidental finding was that the Canadian Coast Guard sometimes wants to use channel 65 to work an emergency, and your VHF has to be set on the US settings before you can receive 65. Also very hard to manage a crisis in the cockpit when the only radio is below. David David Groves, Lady of Shallot, CS33
Frank, I also liked the simplicity of the PSS and have thought about it, but earlier this summer a CS33 owner on Lake Ontario posted on the CS owners user group his story of hitting a log and having the PSS seal go out of alignment. Needless to say I am sticking with the conventional system. Here is the post: Hi All, I know there was a discussion about dripless shaft seals awhile back. We had an interesting episode on the weekend. We hit some debris with the propeller. No vibration, still driving along. In a few minutes, the high water alarm went off (very loud). Water was coming into the bilge from aft at about the same rate that the electric pump could empty it. My crew climbed into the emptied locker and checked for broken shafts, holes in the hull, etc. About that time, the water stopped coming in. (In the meantime our cruising companions and indirectly, the Coast Guard had been activated. Our thanks to all for standing by). We motored home at 5 knots, then had a friend dive on the prop, etc. Just one insignificant mark, and no damage or increased play. It would appear that the shock of the prop hitting the log whipped the shaft and unseated the PSS. It is in the right place, with the recommended hose clamp backup to the set screws. The flow of water must have held the seal open for a while then closed itself or was pushed by the crew checking it out. Has anybody with a dripless seal had a similar transient situation? Made a tremendous impression on all aboard, boats for miles around, as well as the US and Canadian Coast Guard. Also stimulated a major rush to purchase backup bilge pumps, pump handles and secondary radios. I can highly recommend a good audible high water alarm. An incidental finding was that the Canadian Coast Guard sometimes wants to use channel 65 to work an emergency, and your VHF has to be set on the US settings before you can receive 65. Also very hard to manage a crisis in the cockpit when the only radio is below. David David Groves, Lady of Shallot, CS33
Agree with Frank
It seems like there's a drive by some on this site to stifle new discussion. There are those who will respond to nearly every question with almost a scolding for bringing up a topic that was discussed a year ago. Let's let this thing open up, there's nothing wrong with re-hashing old topics. Someone new may be able to add something to the conversation.
It seems like there's a drive by some on this site to stifle new discussion. There are those who will respond to nearly every question with almost a scolding for bringing up a topic that was discussed a year ago. Let's let this thing open up, there's nothing wrong with re-hashing old topics. Someone new may be able to add something to the conversation.
Searching the archives for stuffing box
If you check the box that will show "all" results about stuffing box, you will get nearly 400 postings.
If you check the box that will show "all" results about stuffing box, you will get nearly 400 postings.
Archives & Research
Steve and Frank, et al I'm not trying to stifle any discussion, merely trying to get people to do some research before they ask the same question that's been asked and answered. In most cases, nothing new has been manufacturered by the boating industry that would modify the reponses. And my suggestion certainly doesn't stop anyone from answering a question. It would be great if someone sarted with "I've read the archives material, but have another question...or I need some clarification." The repetition of similar questions has encouraged many others to suggest using the archives as well, on this and other quality, detailed technical 'boards that have good archives and search engines. I'm just trying to help people learn that there is a vast amount of information already there, and encourage people to read before they simply expect an instant answer. An example of what I mean is the link below. Stu
Steve and Frank, et al I'm not trying to stifle any discussion, merely trying to get people to do some research before they ask the same question that's been asked and answered. In most cases, nothing new has been manufacturered by the boating industry that would modify the reponses. And my suggestion certainly doesn't stop anyone from answering a question. It would be great if someone sarted with "I've read the archives material, but have another question...or I need some clarification." The repetition of similar questions has encouraged many others to suggest using the archives as well, on this and other quality, detailed technical 'boards that have good archives and search engines. I'm just trying to help people learn that there is a vast amount of information already there, and encourage people to read before they simply expect an instant answer. An example of what I mean is the link below. Stu
Agree with Frank....
and others...With all due respect, Why do you care Stu???...I've read you do this many times on many different posts... It is like saying because others have discussed aerodynamics, and there are hundreds of pieces of research material, no one should ever ask a question about it unless "substantial changes" have happened....Discussion, even of the same thing, is what I come to board such as this for....and there maybe someone new with input on a previously discussed subject...My Two Cents Worth....
and others...With all due respect, Why do you care Stu???...I've read you do this many times on many different posts... It is like saying because others have discussed aerodynamics, and there are hundreds of pieces of research material, no one should ever ask a question about it unless "substantial changes" have happened....Discussion, even of the same thing, is what I come to board such as this for....and there maybe someone new with input on a previously discussed subject...My Two Cents Worth....
My experience with PSS is in the archives
and one of them nearly sank our boat. We found that the face seal would not stay seated on our installation. (H34) We sent it back. I installed Drip Free packing. That was 13 years ago. Not a drip since. I'm on my second shaft. No wear on either one. The factory bronze shaft was bent. I replaced it with monel.
and one of them nearly sank our boat. We found that the face seal would not stay seated on our installation. (H34) We sent it back. I installed Drip Free packing. That was 13 years ago. Not a drip since. I'm on my second shaft. No wear on either one. The factory bronze shaft was bent. I replaced it with monel.
yeah, but mentioning that this has already been
discussed thoroughly allows the poster to get a much greater input from all the archives than what he might find from just the people reading and responding this week. He might miss some very important points that, as was mentioned, was previuosly said
discussed thoroughly allows the poster to get a much greater input from all the archives than what he might find from just the people reading and responding this week. He might miss some very important points that, as was mentioned, was previuosly said
Maybe It's The Tone...
I think it's maybe the tone that Stu chooses to use when pointing to the archives. As barret states, this is typical of Stu's posts. I mean come on, titling the response as "Dripless or Clueless", the implication being that the poster being replied to is "clueless". Pointing to archived information is good, as long as it isn't treated as the only answer the poster needs. Again, there is nothing wrong with a new discussion on an old topic.
I think it's maybe the tone that Stu chooses to use when pointing to the archives. As barret states, this is typical of Stu's posts. I mean come on, titling the response as "Dripless or Clueless", the implication being that the poster being replied to is "clueless". Pointing to archived information is good, as long as it isn't treated as the only answer the poster needs. Again, there is nothing wrong with a new discussion on an old topic.
Maybe it's the "tone"????
Can there be any doubt??? Newcomers to sailing and newcomers to this website certainly wouldn't feel at ease knowing that in the shoals of this waterway, there lurks the battleship belonging to self appointed forum judges that will strike at the violation of their own self-appointed rules and regulations. Just how do these seers of the sixth sense determine that the, "repeated question" hasn't been archive researched and that additional new input can't possibly have the answer to the posters need? Perhaps an encouragement, incorporated into the forum header, to archive AND inquire would decrease the repetition of questions and at the same time not douse the flame for the quest of assistance. One motive for asking questions on this or any forum is to experience the camaraderie, that though limited here at Internet Marina and Boat Yard, is nevertheless very satisfying to those who may not be down at the dock.
Can there be any doubt??? Newcomers to sailing and newcomers to this website certainly wouldn't feel at ease knowing that in the shoals of this waterway, there lurks the battleship belonging to self appointed forum judges that will strike at the violation of their own self-appointed rules and regulations. Just how do these seers of the sixth sense determine that the, "repeated question" hasn't been archive researched and that additional new input can't possibly have the answer to the posters need? Perhaps an encouragement, incorporated into the forum header, to archive AND inquire would decrease the repetition of questions and at the same time not douse the flame for the quest of assistance. One motive for asking questions on this or any forum is to experience the camaraderie, that though limited here at Internet Marina and Boat Yard, is nevertheless very satisfying to those who may not be down at the dock.
Thanks, Guys
I'll just tone it down. Frank and Steve are right, of course. Fred's story is also pertinent. Previous detailed discussions on this fun subject have repeatedly pointed out the discrepancies between people's understanding and, perhaps, misunderstandings, of dripless and dripless. There's the Standard non-dripless packing, West Marine's green goop, E-marine's Gore, and the mechanical types, like PSS. Seems a lot of time people JUMP to the conclusion that dripless IS mechanical, when that's simply not the case. Reminds me of a conversation that I had recently with an encyclopedia editor. I understand his frustration at people continuing to ask him questions, and he replies, "Please, at least just try and start to look it up, that's why we wrote the book. If you still have questions, we'd love to hear from you." Good luck. Stu
I'll just tone it down. Frank and Steve are right, of course. Fred's story is also pertinent. Previous detailed discussions on this fun subject have repeatedly pointed out the discrepancies between people's understanding and, perhaps, misunderstandings, of dripless and dripless. There's the Standard non-dripless packing, West Marine's green goop, E-marine's Gore, and the mechanical types, like PSS. Seems a lot of time people JUMP to the conclusion that dripless IS mechanical, when that's simply not the case. Reminds me of a conversation that I had recently with an encyclopedia editor. I understand his frustration at people continuing to ask him questions, and he replies, "Please, at least just try and start to look it up, that's why we wrote the book. If you still have questions, we'd love to hear from you." Good luck. Stu
Stu, You Have CLASS
It is never easy to accept critical feedback. You did with grace and style. Congratulations you have set a very good example for the rest in your last post. Ward
It is never easy to accept critical feedback. You did with grace and style. Congratulations you have set a very good example for the rest in your last post. Ward
One more resource
Another source. Since I wrote this a few years ago, the newer Gore material has also been aded to the "dripless-but-regular-packing-gland" resources, from E-marine. Stu
Another source. Since I wrote this a few years ago, the newer Gore material has also been aded to the "dripless-but-regular-packing-gland" resources, from E-marine. Stu
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