This is disturbing

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Jun 12, 2010
936
Oday 22 Orleans Marina, NOLA
"...the captain, who claims that he believed the fisherman were waving at him as a thank you for avoiding their nets..."

Are all cruise line captains idiots? If the captain was worried about making time or even piracy, he should have at least notified the appropriate nation's coast guard, and coordinated with them on a rescue.
 

Joe

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Jun 1, 2004
8,007
Catalina 27 Mission Bay, San Diego
Can't miss happy hour.... he might lose his job.
 
Apr 8, 2010
1,606
Frers 33 41426 Westport, CT
did he realisticly think that a vessel of that size would have enough fuel to make it 260 miles round trip? that's a lot of fuel for an outboard engine, and not a lot of boat to store it in...
 
Oct 6, 2011
678
CM 32 USA
The weight rests on two people, the captain, and the bird watching lady for not making the captain do something.
 
Apr 16, 2008
17
Hunter 23.5 Miami
The weight rests on two people, the captain, and the bird watching lady for not making the captain do something.
She e-mailed the US Coast Guard, which was all she realistically could do. She couldn't really make the captain do anything.
 
Oct 6, 2011
678
CM 32 USA
Pete17858 said:
She e-mailed the US Coast Guard, which was all she realistically could do. She couldn't really make the captain do anything.
If I see a crime and report it to a police officer that I witness does nothing and blows off the report, I am not discharged from the responsibility to again report it.

It would be odious to any rational mind no food, water or fuel could be stored on such a tiny boat so far out to sea. Any right mind would see a problem. If the captain failed to stop and think, that does not lesson the responsibility of other reporting parties. At the point the woman and her friends spotted the distressed people trying to signal the ship, they stopped being vacationers and became principal parties involved. Notifying a crew member or sending an email would not negate that responsibility to get someone in a position to render aid. She was aware the ship continued on, and did not help. That assuming others would act is as criminal as what the crew of the ocean liner did.

Now, it is possible no fault rests on any outside parties. If I see fifty people walking with climbing gear towards the worlds tallest mountain, and I do not try to stop them and people die, am I guilty of sending people wrongly to their deaths?

I can tell you this, had I spotted those people with my camera, the captain would have gotten involved.
 
Apr 8, 2010
1,606
Frers 33 41426 Westport, CT
I understand she was told that everything was OK, she would have no way of knowing that the captain did not have a radio exchange with the fishing boat, and that he lied about them just being happy he avoided them.

Notifying the coast guard was a step above and beyond her level of responsibility as a passenger, but I'm sure everyone would agree that it was the right thing to do.
 

RAD

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Jun 3, 2004
2,330
Catalina 30 Bay Shore, N.Y.
Two things come to mind.....I'm sure the captain saw the boat and he might of thought they were pirates and I'm thinking the same and the other thought is although they were so far away from shore you would think to move the ship a little closer to investigate would of been the right thing to do .....I'm sure they see small sail boats all the time out there but a small power boat is odd
 
Sep 25, 2008
7,098
Alden 50 Sarasota, Florida
Pirates typically don't wave to attract attention from their target.

Also, Gary states: "I can tell you this, had I spotted those people with my camera, the captain would have gotten involved." Easy to say but the woman was reportedly told the Captain WAS informed.

I'd venture to say you would do just as she and others did.
 
May 24, 2004
470
Hunter 33.5 Portsmouth, RI
According to this mornings newspaper, the cruise line stated that the Captain or the Watch Officer did not see the boat and were not informed about it. So much for competent watch standing on the bridge. The boat should have been seen on radar and by visual observation, even if they didn't have a designated Lookout. Crew members working among the passengers should have at least heard about it and reported it up the line.
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
The captain of a ship is as impossible to influence as the governor of your state and almost as hard to reach, and both have access to lock-ups for unruly people.
 
May 11, 2005
3,431
Seidelman S37 Slidell, La.
Lawyer speak

The captain should be hung out to dry. On that ship, in international waters he is God. There is not a sole in the world who can " make" him do anything. Gary sounds like a lawyer who is lining up clients.
 
May 28, 2009
764
Hunter 376 Pensacola, FL
Since none of us were there and don't really know what happened, here's my take just for grins.

A cruise ship underway doesn't have lookouts posted like some WWII destroyer in a Victory at Sea film, with grim faced determined men continously scanning the horizon with high powered binoculars. There is usually one bridge officer on watch, who has to keep a look out, monitor the ship's systems, handle communications, and deal with everything from adjusting the stabilizers to keep the passengers from losing their lunches to making sure the pools are kept full for the kiddies to swim in.

The Captain doesn't sit in a tall swivel chair in the corner of the bridge all day scanning the sea lanes. He's efffectively the Chief Operating Officer of a huge floating corporation, and his days are filled with meetings with department heads, from engineering to hotel services to human resources.

The radar return on a small, probably fiberglass boat with an outboard is negligible at best. It would most likely be invisible on radar unless the seas were completely flat and the radar gain had been turned way up.

On a cruise ship, there are very sharp class distinctions. Hotel staff do not associate with ships officers, any more than an Army private can go hang out in the flag officer's lounge at the Pentagon. Attempts to do so are probably not responded to pleasantly.

The birdwatchers were in fact playing the part of lookouts, and spotted the vessel in distress. They probably grabbed the closest crew member they could find, who was most likely someone from the hotel staff - a beverage server, the gal handing out towels at the pool, etc. You can find them everywhere and quickly, while you could hunt in vain for hours to find an officer.

That person probably tried to find someone who could communicate with the bridge, because they were not allowed to. Giving them the benefit of the doubt, they probalby thought that had succeeded. Apparantly they didn't.

An article I read said the crew member told a member of the onboard sales staff. This would be someone who lived in both worlds. They could be approached by someone from hotel services, but would be able to connect at some level with the ship's command. They would still be pretty junior though, and couldn't just call up the Captain. This would be the equivalent of the deputy assistant parking lot manager trying to get into the CEO's office.

It's unfortunate. But I'm pretty sure we probably didn't have a case here of "whatever, I'm too busy" on the part of the Captain.

But who knows. Maybe he was trained on the Costa Concordia.
 
Oct 6, 2011
678
CM 32 USA
Nice N Easy said:
The captain should be hung out to dry. On that ship, in international waters he is God. There is not a sole in the world who can " make" him do anything. Gary sounds like a lawyer who is lining up clients.
Lol. I am NOT a lawyer but I am a business man swimming in their shark tank. Make me king and I would outlaw lawyers.
 
Oct 6, 2011
678
CM 32 USA
Ships at sea have emergency procedures for passengers, hotel employes, and ships operations. Any one of these groups can find a way to get the attention of persons on the bridge.

What about MOB? You are telling me if grandma falls off the ship playing shuffle board, no one can alert the bridge in a timely manor? Nonsense.

I think the suggestion about pirates is a valid one. I know I would not stop my car and pick up stranded motorists in every case. Sometimes you weight the risk and do what is safe for your family. Was this a place infested with pirates? I do not think that was the case.
 

RichH

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Feb 14, 2005
4,773
Tayana 37 cutter; I20/M20 SCOWS Worton Creek, MD
This is not surprising nor unexpected as Ive found when far out at sea probably HALF of especially 'cruise' boats will even respond to a Ch16 VHF call... leading me to believe that either there is no one 'attentive' at the helm/watch or simply doesnt speak english. Probably those that dont answer are either 'distracted' or are doing nothing but waiting for a radar or AIS proximity alarm to sound... and not much more.

At night, Ive used up several white SOLAS 'parachute' flares over the years to get their attention when they sometimes turn directly towards me, and more than just a few times with absolutely NO response at all.
The crowded Florida Straights seem to be the worst for this 'inattentiveness'. Makes a good case for having an AIS transponder as that should set off an alarm on the ships bridge when in close proximity or 'head on'.
Ive also suggested to one of the 'flare' manufacturers to make available a 'chafe' flare to be fired off and to present a sudden LARGE 'radar target' to set off the radar proximity alarm on a ship's bridge, etc.
 
Oct 26, 2008
6,081
Catalina 320 Barnegat, NJ
I'm with Nice & Easy ... first of all, the article says that the passengers weren't satisfied with the responses from the Bridge and they took the only action that they thought could be helpful ... e-mailing the USCG.

Secondly, does anybody honestly think that there isn't a protocol in place for any crew member to report up the ladder on any situation which might require an emergency response? How many people actually believe that a crew member wouldn't know what to do? The article says that the desk personnel went on deck to observe and saw the stranded boaters. Doesn't that make you believe that he did that under direction from the Bridge? These people are trained to report up the ladder and respond exactly as directed. They don't exactly have autonomous responsibilities.

Lastly, the article makes a statement that indicates that the Captain saw the stranded boaters himself. You have to be nuts to think that the Captain isn't informed about a circumstance such as this.

Pirates?!?!? not likely the concern ... Some of these Captains are just plain callous because a rescue effort costs the corporation lots of money under some circumstances. Anybody read 66 Days Adrift? The author claims that at least one ship captain purposely "missed" sighting their raft, probably because a rescue effort would cost the ship lost time which means critical penalties for missing sheduled transits through the Canal. Some of these ships just don't have flexible schedules and losing time can be a huge cost. It's simply a callous attitude for some of these guys to come up with a "convenient" excuse.

We've also learned from recent events that a few Captains, no matter how great their responsibility, have the capacity to react reprehensibly.
 

Gunni

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Mar 16, 2010
5,937
Beneteau 411 Oceanis Annapolis
More info, photos, and an interview with the good samaritan, Judy Meredith.

Terrible outcome and more common than you would want to believe.

We came up on a 18ft runabout adrift 10 miles south of St. John in the Caribbean a few years ago (like 20). A whole family aboard, mom, dad, the kids, grandma. Must have been 7 people. Once we got over the shock of seeing such a small boat, so far out, it became clear that they were waving for assistance. Turned out their single outboard had died. I wasn't happy about having to tow them in, but there was no way I was going to leave them. No way.
 
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