This question came up while sitting with friends at coffee this morning. Is it "Dead Reckoning" or "Ded Reckoning"? Don't shrug and blow this off as a stupid question, there are very strong opinions on both sides. Or maybe it is a stupid question. To have any credibility, you should furnish sources for your opinion.
This could be fun
- Thread starter Bill C320 Papillon
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Well...
If it is "dead" reckoning, the you'd be "dead" wrong if you errored. However, if it was "deduced" reckoning, or "ded" for a short form of deduced, then you'd still be dead if you errored.
I suspect the correct form would be "ded" as a short form of deduced. I could also be ded-wrong. But then, dead could refer to the centerof the target, such as dead-on. But deduced is meaning "to trace the course of".
If it is "dead" reckoning, the you'd be "dead" wrong if you errored. However, if it was "deduced" reckoning, or "ded" for a short form of deduced, then you'd still be dead if you errored.
I suspect the correct form would be "ded" as a short form of deduced. I could also be ded-wrong. But then, dead could refer to the centerof the target, such as dead-on. But deduced is meaning "to trace the course of".
Dead Reckoning
Bill- I would love to hear the opinions or evidence that it's Ded Reckoning. I think ded is'nt a real word. Possibly it could be called Dedused Reckoning?
Bill- I would love to hear the opinions or evidence that it's Ded Reckoning. I think ded is'nt a real word. Possibly it could be called Dedused Reckoning?
Dead Reckoning
Dead Reckoning - Oxford English Dictionary 1631 Ded (as in deduced) reckoning - 20th century twist Paul
Dead Reckoning - Oxford English Dictionary 1631 Ded (as in deduced) reckoning - 20th century twist Paul
etymology of the term
"There is disagreement about the derivation of the phrase. It is popularly thought to come from deduced reckoning and is sometimes given in modern sources as an alternatively spelled ded reckoning; however, according to the Oxford English Dictionary, the phrase dead reckoning dates from Elizabethan times (1605-1615). The popular etymology from deduced is not documented in the Oxford English Dictionary or any other historical dictionary. Dead reckoning is navigation without stellar observation. With stellar observation, you are "live," working with the stars and the movement of the planet. With logs, compasses, clocks, but no sky, you are working "dead."
"There is disagreement about the derivation of the phrase. It is popularly thought to come from deduced reckoning and is sometimes given in modern sources as an alternatively spelled ded reckoning; however, according to the Oxford English Dictionary, the phrase dead reckoning dates from Elizabethan times (1605-1615). The popular etymology from deduced is not documented in the Oxford English Dictionary or any other historical dictionary. Dead reckoning is navigation without stellar observation. With stellar observation, you are "live," working with the stars and the movement of the planet. With logs, compasses, clocks, but no sky, you are working "dead."
The American Practical Navigator (Bowditch)
Pub. No. 9, 1995 Edition dead reckoning. Determining the position of a vessel by adding to the last fix the ship’s course and speed for a given time. The position so obtained is called a DEAD RECKONING POSITION. Comparison of the dead reckoning position with the fix for the same time indicates the sum of currents, winds, and other forces acting on the vessel during the intervening period. So... what came first, Bowditch or Chapmans? I think Bowditch is senior since it was first published in 1802. Not sure when Chapmans was first published, but I think 1917?
Pub. No. 9, 1995 Edition dead reckoning. Determining the position of a vessel by adding to the last fix the ship’s course and speed for a given time. The position so obtained is called a DEAD RECKONING POSITION. Comparison of the dead reckoning position with the fix for the same time indicates the sum of currents, winds, and other forces acting on the vessel during the intervening period. So... what came first, Bowditch or Chapmans? I think Bowditch is senior since it was first published in 1802. Not sure when Chapmans was first published, but I think 1917?
I already blew it off as nonsense.
"Ded" comes from an illiterate 20th century sailor who thought the word "dead" had to be incorrect when combined with reckoning.
"Ded" comes from an illiterate 20th century sailor who thought the word "dead" had to be incorrect when combined with reckoning.
I think we're safe..
I think we're safe if we use the term DR! Of course, if you look in my many past posts where I reference DR, I always spell it both ways as in "Dead/Ded Reckoning".. Some feel the urge to publicly "scold" people who use "dead" and not "ded." Obviously, I don't believe they should. I find it interesting though that neither the FAA nor the Coast Guard use the term "Ded". Their websites show no references to "ded" or "deduced" reckoning, but quite a few references to "dead reckoning." The term is usually abbreviated DR, which is probably safe for all so I propose a third option beyond "Dead" & "Ded" and that is DR !!!!!!
I think we're safe if we use the term DR! Of course, if you look in my many past posts where I reference DR, I always spell it both ways as in "Dead/Ded Reckoning".. Some feel the urge to publicly "scold" people who use "dead" and not "ded." Obviously, I don't believe they should. I find it interesting though that neither the FAA nor the Coast Guard use the term "Ded". Their websites show no references to "ded" or "deduced" reckoning, but quite a few references to "dead reckoning." The term is usually abbreviated DR, which is probably safe for all so I propose a third option beyond "Dead" & "Ded" and that is DR !!!!!!
Guys, we're back to 1613
1613 M. RIDLEY - "Keeping a true, not a dead reckoning of his course." From the OED: Dead reckoning. _Naut._ [DEAD a. IV.] The estimation of a ship's position from the distance run by the log and the courses steered by the compass, with corrections for current, leeway, etc., but without astronomical observations. Hence _dead_ LATITUDE (q.v.), that computed by dead reckoning. 1613 M. RIDLEY _Magn. Bodies_ 147 Keeping a true, not a dead reckoning of his course. 1760 PEMBERTON in _Phil. Trans._ LI. 911 The latitude exhibited by the dead reckoning of the ship. 1840 R. H. DANA _Bef. Mast_ xxxii. 124 We had drifted too much to allow of our dead reckoning being anywhere near the mark. Thanks to Google.
1613 M. RIDLEY - "Keeping a true, not a dead reckoning of his course." From the OED: Dead reckoning. _Naut._ [DEAD a. IV.] The estimation of a ship's position from the distance run by the log and the courses steered by the compass, with corrections for current, leeway, etc., but without astronomical observations. Hence _dead_ LATITUDE (q.v.), that computed by dead reckoning. 1613 M. RIDLEY _Magn. Bodies_ 147 Keeping a true, not a dead reckoning of his course. 1760 PEMBERTON in _Phil. Trans._ LI. 911 The latitude exhibited by the dead reckoning of the ship. 1840 R. H. DANA _Bef. Mast_ xxxii. 124 We had drifted too much to allow of our dead reckoning being anywhere near the mark. Thanks to Google.
dead mellow
Hey guys, instead of getting all tied up in knots over "dead" v. "ded," keep in mind that the term is very old, as in from a time when "correct" spelling was more a matter of opinion than established usage. That having been said, you can now focus on the notion that you're trying to communicate. If your audience understands "dead reckoning" and is puzzled by "ded reckoning," you just have to live with it. Jim Kolstoe, h23 Kara's Boo
Hey guys, instead of getting all tied up in knots over "dead" v. "ded," keep in mind that the term is very old, as in from a time when "correct" spelling was more a matter of opinion than established usage. That having been said, you can now focus on the notion that you're trying to communicate. If your audience understands "dead reckoning" and is puzzled by "ded reckoning," you just have to live with it. Jim Kolstoe, h23 Kara's Boo
My 1984 Bowditch differentiates DED reckoning
From DEAD reckoning as follows. Dead reckoning is speed through water times time equals distance. DED reckoning factors in currents and drift to allow deduced reckoning for position.
From DEAD reckoning as follows. Dead reckoning is speed through water times time equals distance. DED reckoning factors in currents and drift to allow deduced reckoning for position.
Boy, am I glad
I got my boat back together so that I can be sailing like this past sunday, instead of playing the waiting game! But, sure glad some of you were hear to help me along in my project when I needed it. Wait a minute, why am I hear now? Oh well, it give me something to do while I try to get through another work week so I can get back in the big pond this weekend.
I got my boat back together so that I can be sailing like this past sunday, instead of playing the waiting game! But, sure glad some of you were hear to help me along in my project when I needed it. Wait a minute, why am I hear now? Oh well, it give me something to do while I try to get through another work week so I can get back in the big pond this weekend.
dead reckoning is the correct term.
This is what happen with too much time on your hands. For example: The animal is the Llama, and the Tibetan deity is the Dalai Lama. The road kill animals are Opossums not Possums. Not to mention a gathering of Ravens is, an Unkindness of Ravens. Now if only I could remember to use the spell checker all the time.
This is what happen with too much time on your hands. For example: The animal is the Llama, and the Tibetan deity is the Dalai Lama. The road kill animals are Opossums not Possums. Not to mention a gathering of Ravens is, an Unkindness of Ravens. Now if only I could remember to use the spell checker all the time.
Landsend , you're dead right.
this morning Nancy and I were talking about American english and jargon. I don't understand how anyone can learn english as a second language. After you have completed your dead reckoning position you need to get a fix to confirm your position in order to be sure that you don't need to fix your log so that you may record your position in the ships log. Then when you get home you will be in a fix if you don't cut a log for the fire.
this morning Nancy and I were talking about American english and jargon. I don't understand how anyone can learn english as a second language. After you have completed your dead reckoning position you need to get a fix to confirm your position in order to be sure that you don't need to fix your log so that you may record your position in the ships log. Then when you get home you will be in a fix if you don't cut a log for the fire.
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