There is always one

Stu Jackson · Jul 11, 2012

Nope, he wasn't correct unless you were really in his way. 100 feet is a mile when you're racing.

Gail R · Jul 11, 2012

Seriously? A J/24 skipper thought 100 feet was too close? That's more than four of his boat lengths -- plenty of room. The guy needs to turn in his man card as he clearly does not understand that the personal space around the typical J/24 is something along the lines of half a boat length (that would be 12 feet).

At least that is how the local J/24 fleet sails up here. Fun to watch.

Scott T-Bird · Jul 11, 2012

Just to be argumentative ...

I haven't quite figured out the specifics, but if you were on port beam reach heading s-sw then the wind would be from the e-se. The j-boat, heading west would also be on port tack, but on more of a broad reach or run. But you would be leeward, so what's his problem?

But something tells me that your prevailing wind is normally a westerly and maybe a northwesterly. So where you on stbd tack but to windward? With you going SW and the j-boat going W, it seems like it would be an odd occurence for one of you to be on port and the other on stbd. So assuming both are on the same side, it depends which is leeward.

But still, a chill pill could be prescribed!

kloudie1 · Jul 11, 2012

The other argumentative observation is: Did you miss by 100 feet because he altered course? or because you did? If the former, I agree with him.. if the latter, I agree with you.

Ross · Jul 11, 2012

I think that this involved two stubborn skippers. A one degree course change would have widened the gap by a couple of hundred yards when either skipper recognized a constant bearing.

Indysailor · Jul 11, 2012

Personally, I like altering course to maneuver around people because it's something to do; and in Indiana the state law actually says the boat on the right ALWAYS is the stand on vessel regardless of tack, so no one really knows what to do, anyway. Therefore, I always take the initiative and alter course if we are within waving distance and seem to be converging.
That said, I suppose to each his or her own, but sailing is supposed to be relaxing and I personally admire people who rather than yelling at others, simply take care of business and move on. Being right should be personally satisfying enough that a person shouldn't have to broadcast it to the world.

Winkfish · Jul 11, 2012

Did he yell a simple "starboard" and did you respond with a simple "hold your course"? That's how I've seen it normally done.

LuzSD · Jul 11, 2012

This does not sound like any J24 sailors I know! Most are perfectly comfortable with far less distance between, but who knows.

I agree, just a small alteration of either's course would have made for a non-issue. And sometimes it just fun to pass at a closer but safe distance..... It all depends on each skippers perspective doesn't it.

jviss · Jul 11, 2012

Scott T-Bird said:
I haven't quite figured out the specifics, but if you were on port beam reach heading s-sw then the wind would be from the e-se. The j-boat, heading west would also be on port tack, but on more of a broad reach or run.

That's right. The J-24 could not have been on a stbd. tack heading West.

kenn · Jul 11, 2012

Having a small sailboat, it's almost routine that we get run down alot, right of way or not. Particularly disappointing is when a motoring sailboat doesn't deign to make way for us with all our sails out, motor up... :cry: It happens more often than it should.

wflowe2 said:
He was certainly correct....

Of course, we weren't there to judge... but if he had right of way, and you didn't yield, and he had to alter course... then I'm sorry but I think you were "the one". Right of way rules aren't just for racing.

sailormanbigd · Jul 11, 2012

"There Can Only Be One"

Maybe that should be the title to your post. Its from the "Highlander" movie/series. Slice his head off! Seriously, next time just smile real big and wave! That'll get his goat.

Victory · Jul 11, 2012

Damn.... Scott's totally right.... the first boat is beam reaching on port... the a-hole J-24 is broad reaching or running on port.... making him the windward vessel in a same tack crossing situation.... which means he's gotta give way.

You should have yelled back at him........"you don't know squat!"

MrBill_FLL · Jul 11, 2012

depends when he yelled starboard. if he did it a lot earlier, and you didn't respond then maybe.

but as others said 3 boat lengths is a huge distance. -& hes a weenie!

Stu Jackson · Jul 11, 2012

wflowe2 said:
I guess my point is, what in the hell is the point of worrying about right of way on an empty body of water, no racing going on, not even informally because the other 2 boats were far away and not heading in either of our directions.

I probably made this more confusing now.

Actually that cleared up a lot of confusion.

Except for that way-stupid Indiana rule, which makes NO sense whatsoever for sailboats and is a recipe for disaster, a leeward boat should give way to a an upwind boat, regardless of tack. If there was no imminent issue of collision, then yelling "starboard" also makes no sense, because that is only used when two boats tacking upwind are converging.

It sure sounds like you were clear. Hence, no need for him yelling. Maybe he was practicing for his racing this weekend. Glad I'm not on his crew!

Scott T-Bird · Jul 11, 2012

Just because he's on stbd tack doesn't mean that every boat on port has to duck behind. In racing, how would any boat on port tack ever maintain a lead over a stbd tack boat? (In other words, every boat is going to be on port tack eventually during a race and when port is crossing ahead of stbd, there is no obligation to duck behind if the passing does not cause the stbd boat to duck).

If he passed 100' behind you, he has absolutely no right to complain about your passing ahead of him. If he wanted to maintain a higher course, he could have easily aimed his boat at yours, or just ahead of you until it was clear that he intended to pass ahead and that you would need to alter.

As it was, you did nothing wrong (it sounds like you were well clear), either formally or informally. Maybe he just didn't like your dirty air!

Benny17441 · Jul 11, 2012

Sorry, I side with the guy on the J-24. It seems he may have been practicing race moves and going for speed and you were just loafing around. Common courtesy would have dictated you should have yielded the right of way so both could have continued your activities in peace and safety. It seems likely the other skipper did not feel comfortable, not knowing your intentions, your expertise or level of awareness. In a lake where boaters are bound to run into each other time after time it pays to be friendly.

kloudie1 · Jul 11, 2012

paraphrasing: What in the hell is the point of driving on the right side of the highway when there is only one other car on the road coming this way?
The point is to avoid chaos and guessing..

kenn · Jul 11, 2012

wflowe2 said:
why I saw no need to change course because there was no chance of us meeting each other as long as we both held our respective courses.

If this was indeed the case, and you held your course... I'd side with you.

I guess my point is, what in the hell is the point of worrying about right of way on an empty body of water, no racing going on, not even informally

Because
1) This is how we've all agreed to behave to avoid collisions, and
2) You're sort of saying that there's no point in worrying about right of way as long as no one harshed YOUR mellow and you got your way

(we end up yielding to big yachts all the time. It's no fun)