The Devil Within ................................

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Jan 4, 2006
7,299
Hunter 310 West Vancouver, B.C.
....................... finally revealed.

Ever since we purchased the boat new, I've worried about leaking water back into the cylinders of the Yanmar 2GM20F. The reason for the worry is the location of the mixing elbow situated ABOVE the engine :eek:. All we'd need to have is the separation wall between the cooling sea water and the hot exhaust gasses spring a leak, and it's all over. Just need the fat lady to sing. Cold sea water is bad enough (corrosively speaking), but heat it up ........... I don't even want to think about it :doh:. I know cast iron is more corrosion resistant than mild steel, but the consequences of a perforation in the separation wall would be of biblical proportions indeed.

The below picture shows how the elbow sits above the engine.






This next picture shows a new mixing elbow attached to the riser piece which is in turn attached to the exhaust manifold. You can see how a pin hole perforation could allow sea water to dribble down through the riser and into the exhaust manifold and then ........................ well, you just don't want to go there :cry:.






For that reason, I remove the elbow every two years to inspect and clean and every four years, replace it . Perhaps a tad expensive at $382.35 (with taxes) for the last one, but better than the alternatives.

This time, in order to see how closely I was courting disaster, I decided to section the last elbow removed and a previous elbow which was laying around.

The below picture shows an earlier elbow which had been cleaned and then tossed to the rear of a shelf rather than put it back into service. It was sectioned using my favorite cutting oil, straight liquid soap detergent. Makes for an easier clean up and no, the red rust colour on the hot exhaust side is not due to water leakage into the exhaust passage. Just the result of washing the elbow in water and letting it dry. Notice the thickness of the wall separating the water from the gas passage. This is after about four years of service. Lots of metal remaining.







On to the most recent elbow removed, still in the original dirty condition. This was cleaned two years ago and is again REALLY dirty. Notice the carbon buildup restricting the gas passage. Notice the carbon buildup just where the sea water mixes with the hot exhaust gasses. Notice that it's a miracle the engine can still run. I didn't notice any problem with the engine running full throttle (3600 RPM) last season nor was there any sign of overheating displayed on the VDO engine temperature guage. And it certainly isn't the result of clean living on my part.







The one thing I do know for sure, the carbon has got to be due to the 138 F air inlet to the engine. It's the result of storing the engine in a shoe box as shown below.







So, after this little excercise, I find myself with one less thing to worry about on the boat. Now, to replace it with something else to worry about.
 
Feb 26, 2004
23,081
Catalina 34 224 Maple Bay, BC, Canada
Ralph, do you also have a vented loop on the cooling water hose into that riser?

Very, very nice report, thanks.
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,711
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
Excellent! You saved me some time because I have an exhaust elbow on my bench I have been meaning to cut open to show how they work..
 
Nov 6, 2006
10,107
Hunter 34 Mandeville Louisiana
Devil Within

Nicely done, Ralph.. I see your anti siphon loop on the side of the heatex.. so the only water that could get in there when not running is a little bit in the hose between the loop and the elbow.. When the engine is running, the exhaust would keep it out.. Thanks again for the cut-away
 
Oct 14, 2005
2,191
1983 Hunter H34 North East, MD
Ralph...

I'm impressed with how pristine your engine and surround appears to be. That "shoebox" must collect all the crud inside as none is visible on the glasswork! There's even silver paint still on the raw water pump belt!

Great cut-away illustrations!
 
Jun 4, 2004
287
Beneteau Oceanis 352 NYC
Mixing Elbow Cleaner

Have you ever used any of the flush/cleaners on your mixing elbow?

After your post, I am now nervous about my elbow.
 
Dec 2, 2003
1,637
Hunter 376 Warsash, England --
Our Thanks To You Ralph

Have often wondered what the innards look like and, like you, I used to worry about pinhole leaks and carbon build up.
Our local Yanmar service agent/dealer says he never needs to change the elbows.
Mine is now 18 years old and I used to take it off regularly every couple of years or so but haven't done so this last ten.
Engine has about 1500 hours on it.
I take some comfort that water is only present when the engine runs and the heat will? evaporate anything in the little water trap at the top.

You have got me worrying again - but thanks anyway.
 
Jan 4, 2006
7,299
Hunter 310 West Vancouver, B.C.
Replies to Your Replies .......................

.................. in no particular order:

Stu - The first photo in this post was taken a little over two years ago. Two years ago the vacuum breaker on the stbrd side of the engine decided it was going to leak. Salt water dribbled down the side of the engine. Stripped everything off that side of the engine, cleaned with Q-tips, and repainted. Needless to say, I ripped the damn thing out of there and have been looking at the situation on an ongoing basis ever since. As shown below in this more recent photo, the vacuum breaker is gone and the discharge hose form the HEX goes directly to the mixing elbow.



If you'll notice, the black lamacoid tag behind the engine is the water level when fully loaded. It is 4-1/2" below the mixing elbow which is not bad, but not the recommended 6" as per ABYC. So far, I've not seen any rise in water level when under sail (using plastic tubing as a sensor from the cooling water inlet line). The level actually seems to drop at higher speeds. Venturi effect I imagine. The thru hull is always closed when finished with the engine. Not the best arangement but I'm still contemplating.

Don - a very rough guess is about 150 hrs/year so this would be about 600 running engine hours.

kloudie1 - yes, I agree that very little water SHOULD get through the hypothetical leak. When the engine is shut down, any water in the water passage of the mixing elbow should immediately drain back through the water pump which does not have a check valve and does leak slowly. It's just not a situation I could live with.

robfmcc - never found anything that would soften the carbon deposits. Gasoline, acetone, lacquer thinner, sodium hydroxide have no effect. I think they're half way to becoming diamonds they're so bloody hard. The only thing that had a slight effect on it was an oven cleaner which contained potassium hydroxide amongst other green ingredients :D. Elbow grease on the mixing elbow is the only thing I've found that works. I know one thing I've got to do is cool the air to the engine as I believe that is what is causing the heavy carbon deposits in my mixing elbow.

Donalex - I guess different Yanmar service agents have different opinions. The rep who robs, I mean sells me the mixing elbows advises that it be replaced every five years. He could recommend every year so I tend to half believe him. Just for peace of mind, I'll continue to replace every four years as I don't have anything else to spend my money on. I'm very interested in your mixing elbow which is 18 years old. Either you've found the elixer of life for mixing elbows or you're very close to a perforation.

If you do remove it, I'd love to see it sectioned. If you don't have the time, send it along and I'll gladly section it and post it here.
 

WayneH

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Jan 22, 2008
1,097
Tartan 37 287 Pensacola, FL
.................. in no particular order:

Donalex - I guess different Yanmar service agents have different opinions. The rep who robs, I mean sells me the mixing elbows advises that it be replaced every five years.
On the my motorcycle forum, we call them "Stealerships". But not to their faces as it adds to the price. :D
 
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