The 800 Pound Gorilla .....

[Maine Sail]

The 800 Pound Gorilla of our industry (basically Marinco) just gained another few hundred pounds.

For those not paying attention to industry inside news Power Products LLC., the parent company, has recently acquired BEP, Mastervolt, Czone & ProMariner. On Nov 4th it was announced that they had also acquired Blue Sea Systems. They already had Ancor Products, Guest, Marinco, Nicro and AFI.

Power Products also owns Gardner Bender, Sperry Instruments, ACME Electric and others....

While I try to think positively it is hard. This is troubling to me because Blue Sea and ProMariner have been great companies to deal with. I can no longer get in touch with anyone at Mastervolt who knows how to do anything but quote from a scrip. Hell just yesterday I could not get answers to a Mastervolt query that should have been pretty easy. I bounced to three people and none could give me the answer. Sad really. One guy finally admitted he has only been with "Mastervolt" a short while having previously answered the yellow phone and saying "Marinco, how may I help you?". If this rubbish is what the future looks like for Blue Sea Systems, yes, I am very scared...

As a marine electrician seeing a great company, BSS is one of the best in the industry, swallowed up by a large corporation scares the hell out of me. I have yet to see this go well. I hope to be proven wrong... So is the trend..

Now that they literally OWN the marine electrical market I would not expect to see prices go anywhere but up. I already know, from multiple direct experiences, Mastervolt's tech support has gone in the tank since this acquisition, to the point that I no longer install much of it...ProMariner is still pretty good but this acquisition for them was not that long ago so time will tell.

BTW Balmar was also recently sold and the growing pains there have directly impacted me as well. When you move from small to big something often gets lost in the transition...:cussing:

I would like to think, with that much buying power, prices may actually come down but when you control an entire aisle, or more, of a marine chandler, that is not the way I think it will roll. For me the biggest fear, as always, is what will happen to tech support, R&D & quality.

Next time you walk down the electrical aisle at a marine store, and see all those brands, remember it is really just one 1400 pound gorilla behind them all.......

Rant off....

 

[Jackdaw]

Thx for the heads-up Maine. BSS is one of my favorite companies. Innovative, quality gear and the best guarantees in the marine space. I hope that does not change.

 

[TENACITY CS36T]

Sad, and more than likely another negative, hope we're wrong.

 

[Maine Sail]

Sad, and more than likely another negative, hope we're wrong.

I hope I am wrong too!! The problem with a company like Blue Sea is they excelled at everything they did. From selling and designing quality products to standing behind them and being accessible, they excelled. I could pick up the phone and get Wayne Kelsoe the BSS CTO just about any time I needed to. Now that is accessible! Great folks, great products and they had passion for the business.

IMHO the companies under the Marinco umbrella have not really excelled at anything. They also seem to be dragging Mastervolt into the round file.

*I mean come on the old Nicro vents lasted 15+ years and the new ones are lucky to go 6 months.

*Ancor products can't even sell the same crimp terminals consistently. Hell some of their male fast-on's don't even fit the female fast-on's they sell because they ARE NOT THE SAME.....

*Guest makes a terribly poor excuse for a charger.

*The Marinco twist lock shore power cords are flat out dangerous....

I could go on but I won't bore......

 

[gettinthere]

And did I read somewhere that one of the lead people at ABYC is also one of the lead people of Marinco?
So a company that has a large chunk of the marine electrical market also has a strong inside influence at the standards writing organization??

Wouldnt that be a conflict of interest?

 

[Stu Jackson]

No, it would indicate, first, that the people in the know in the industry are active in codes & standards. You don't run an electrical company without electricians.

How they run their businesses, or how the guys who bought their businesses treat them and tell them what to do, is an entirely different issue.

The logical end result of unbridled and unregulated capitalism is the eventual demise of the very consumer they started out to serve.

 

[gettinthere]

Active in manipulating codes and standards to their own benefit, perhaps? Nah that wouldn't happen in America.

 

[Allez Yukon]

Unfortunately in large companies that are run by people with accounting degrees and MBAs, who live by the balance sheet, the concept of customer support has been lost because it is virtually impossible to quantify the return on investment (ROI) that results from funding the free customer support activities that we have become used to and that differentiates them from others. Therefore, these activities are first to suffer from corporate short term methodology to reduce operating costs and improve profits. It isn't until the company slides so far downhill that it is no longer viable that they realize, if at all, the significance of customer support and the relationships this builds with the customers. That may or not happen here, it all depends on the long term plans and the realization of the intangible benefits of customer support. Just my 2 cents worth.

 

[Maine Sail]

Active in manipulating codes and standards to their own benefit, perhaps? Nah that wouldn't happen in America.

There are folks from lots of companies that help form the standards but they are in no way dictated or swayed by any one company. Change takes time, lots of meetings, lots of comments, lots of evidence, lots of input from lots of people and even then some changes that should be made might get tabled for further investigation..

There are some individuals involved who do twist things and interpret things to suit their cause but in the end they have no more power than I do to get changes made..

 

[IStream]

Unfortunately in large companies that are run by people with accounting degrees and MBAs, who live by the balance sheet, the concept of customer support has been lost because it is virtually impossible to quantify the return on investment (ROI) that results from funding the free customer support activities that we have become used to and that differentiates them from others. Therefore, these activities are first to suffer from corporate short term methodology to reduce operating costs and improve profits. It isn't until the company slides so far downhill that it is no longer viable that they realize, if at all, the significance of customer support and the relationships this builds with the customers. That may or not happen here, it all depends on the long term plans and the realization of the intangible benefits of customer support. Just my 2 cents worth.

This is exactly right. My small company was acquired a few years ago and our customer support has been strangled because it doesn't generate revenue directly. We're paying the price now. I don't plan to hang around to watch it reach its logical conclusion.

Any cost reductions that are realized due to increased scale will go right to the bottom line, not to lower prices, until and unless a competitor comes along with a better product that they can't compete with except on the basis of price.

EDIT: typos, inconsistent tense...B-

 

[Paul Mermelstein]

Hey, Allez Yukon, not all MBAs are bloodsuckers. I have an MBA and I agree with Maine Sail and everything that's been said here. (I'm not pissed; I actually got a chuckle out of it). Truthfully, I agree that the short term perspective that most larger companies embody, especially publically traded ones that need to please stockholders, is not only bad management, but can lead to longer term loss of customer loyalty and ultimately lower market share. In both the short term and longer term, it's bad for customers and bad business. I almost always prefer to buy from smaller companies.

 

[Mark Maulden]

And did I read somewhere that one of the lead people at ABYC is also one of the lead people of Marinco? So a company that has a large chunk of the marine electrical market also has a strong inside influence at the standards writing organization?? Wouldnt that be a conflict of interest?

Just be glad the industry isn't regulatory like any part of the aerospace industry. Speaking of customer service, I needed a larger pulley for my balmar alt and balmar stated they had none. On a whim I called Electromaax and they fixed me up. It was sourced from Balmar and it shipped from Balmar to Electromaax and then to me. These two companies are west coast and east coast. I live only 20 min from Balmar.....

 

[Paul Mermelstein]

Speaking of customer service, I needed a larger pulley for my balmar alt and balmar stated they had none. On a whim I called Electromaax and they fixed me up. It was sourced from Balmar and it shipped from Balmar to Electromaax and then to me. These two companies are west coast and east coast. I live only 20 min from Balmar.....

That's why I like smaller companies. I recently did a complete upgrade of my 12v charging system through Electromaax and was completely happy with their customer service.

 

[Chief RA]

I have read all posts for the general views expressed. While I find corporate buy up a sad state for America it likely won't get changed. Especially with our current federal and state lack of leadership. As an old soldier I could say much more but I won't. Chief

 

[Benny17441]

It is part of the changing face of business in America. A virtual monopoly has no need for customer support as their product will be practically the only one available to the majority of consumers. Also the practice of a manufacturer having to offer two or three products as options for the same task will likely disappear. Advertising will be limited to product bulletins to keep service technicians and retailers abreast of available products and their uses. Small and new manufacturers will have no alternative but to adopt the business practices of the industry leader that controls the market. They will become kind of a virtual franchise of that industry leader. These small manufacturers may even be supported by the leader to keep away government antitrust legislation. It seems to be the way we are going and we better get used to it.

 

[Allez Yukon]

Hey, Allez Yukon, not all MBAs are bloodsuckers. I have an MBA and I agree with Maine Sail and everything that's been said here. (I'm not pissed; I actually got a chuckle out of it). Truthfully, I agree that the short term perspective that most larger companies embody, especially publically traded ones that need to please stockholders, is not only bad management, but can lead to longer term loss of customer loyalty and ultimately lower market share. In both the short term and longer term, it's bad for customers and bad business. I almost always prefer to buy from smaller companies.

Paul,

Sorry bout that, I didn't intend it to be a diatribe on the evils of MBAs ? . It just seems the concept of customer support has been overlooked by some of the new management in many companies.

 

[dlochner]

I guess we should all buy Smartplug cord sets before Marinco buys them too!

VTE Warehouse is a small company that manufactures many of Blue Seas Systems connectors. You can buy the unbranded parts for less direct from them.

https://www.vtewarehouse.com/index.php

And I agree with the sentiments that in Corporate America the loyalty is to share holders at the expense of the consumer and employee. A sad state of affairs.

 

[Maine Sail]

I guess we should all buy Smartplug cord sets before Marinco buys them too!

VTE Warehouse is a small company that manufactures many of Blue Seas Systems connectors. You can buy the unbranded parts for less direct from them.

https://www.vtewarehouse.com/index.php

And I agree with the sentiments that in Corporate America the loyalty is to share holders at the expense of the consumer and employee. A sad state of affairs.

I buy some stuff from VTE but Blue Sea uses many companies to make their products, Carling, Cole Hersee, Cooper-Bussman etc. plus they manufacture a lot of their own product too not just spec it and have others build it.. I am not a huge fan of VTE's bussbars or Class T or ANL fuse holders for example when compared to the Blue Sea product. Their battery boots are great though...

 

[waternwaves]

Looky, looky
,
Now there is room for another new marine electric, electronic component manufacturer.

Maybe starting with terminations, controls, and power regulation/switching products.



Sailing electrical engineers have to do something between employers

 

[tcwaltz]

I like wise worked for a small company for 16 years that was acquired at Christmas of 2013. Within 6 months the Warehouse and 16 employees were gone and the product line essentially gutted. They owners and employees were told that we'd be a subsidiary of the main company but that quickly changed after everything was sold.
Its a shame that this is the way things are going in the US. Competition is what creates lower pricing and innovation.