I would like to know how the tack of the mainsail is normally attached to the boom and if anyone has improved on this attach point by using some clever piece that I don't know what to call, but I am looking to have on my boom. John S
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tack attachments
I've seen several configurations, I guess it depends on your preference and the way your sail is cut. You could have a hook on or near the gooseneck (where the boom attaches to the mast) that goes through a grommet in the tack, or you could loop a line through the grommet and bring it down to some sort of cleat (the line would then be called a downhaul). Another option is to have a U-shaped bracket surround the grommet in the tack and then have a clevis pin pass through a hole in the bracket and then through the tack and through the hole on the other arm of the bracket. Then again, if the foot of the main is not loose (that is, it's fed through a slot in the boom), it might not even have any way to attach the tack; the sail would be kept in position by tension on the foot with the outhaul and on the luff with the halyard. My personal preference is to have the clevis pin or hook method... that way the tack stays put and it's easier to adjust just the luff or just the foot with the halyard or outhaul respectively.
I've seen several configurations, I guess it depends on your preference and the way your sail is cut. You could have a hook on or near the gooseneck (where the boom attaches to the mast) that goes through a grommet in the tack, or you could loop a line through the grommet and bring it down to some sort of cleat (the line would then be called a downhaul). Another option is to have a U-shaped bracket surround the grommet in the tack and then have a clevis pin pass through a hole in the bracket and then through the tack and through the hole on the other arm of the bracket. Then again, if the foot of the main is not loose (that is, it's fed through a slot in the boom), it might not even have any way to attach the tack; the sail would be kept in position by tension on the foot with the outhaul and on the luff with the halyard. My personal preference is to have the clevis pin or hook method... that way the tack stays put and it's easier to adjust just the luff or just the foot with the halyard or outhaul respectively.
What???
The way the tack is "normally" attached to the boom on a 26C is with a #10 bolt that goes through the bolt rope gate (and btw, every sail I've ever bent on has a ring at the tack, not a grommet). I don't have a clew as to all that Cal Poly jibberish. The tack is not exactly a control point on the sail...you attach it and leave it alone. I slip my boat, so I only bend the main on once a year...if I trailered it, I'd probably switch to a pin instead of the bolt.
The way the tack is "normally" attached to the boom on a 26C is with a #10 bolt that goes through the bolt rope gate (and btw, every sail I've ever bent on has a ring at the tack, not a grommet). I don't have a clew as to all that Cal Poly jibberish. The tack is not exactly a control point on the sail...you attach it and leave it alone. I slip my boat, so I only bend the main on once a year...if I trailered it, I'd probably switch to a pin instead of the bolt.
Tack Attach
Right now I have a piece of line that ties the sail to the boom by going around the gooseneck. This is unsatisfactory because it holds that portion of the sail rigid, so it interferes with the sail shape on my loose footed sail for a few inches. However, it removes a lot of bagginess in that area. There is a hole through the boom channel where I could use a bolt, but that seems crude and inelegant. Every other place on a sailboat there is some sort of attachment piece that can deal with any angle a sail would want to bend. Since I am having a new set of sails cut, I can have the tack attach point placed anywhere I want. Now is the time to come up with a solution. John S
Right now I have a piece of line that ties the sail to the boom by going around the gooseneck. This is unsatisfactory because it holds that portion of the sail rigid, so it interferes with the sail shape on my loose footed sail for a few inches. However, it removes a lot of bagginess in that area. There is a hole through the boom channel where I could use a bolt, but that seems crude and inelegant. Every other place on a sailboat there is some sort of attachment piece that can deal with any angle a sail would want to bend. Since I am having a new set of sails cut, I can have the tack attach point placed anywhere I want. Now is the time to come up with a solution. John S
A different tack with the tack.
I'll tell you what I'm doing lately and ya-all can throw rocks at it if it's wrong. With a new loose footed main, instead of the stock main with the boltrope at the bottom, I hoisted the sail and tied off the halyard with the tack-ring just slightly higher than where I want it to ride. Then run a line through the tack-ring and around the gooseneck several times to give me a purchase of 2 or 3:1 and snug it up. It snugs the sail up both directions, down and in toward the mast. If I continue with that method I guess I would add a clamcleat or something, right now I just tie it off to itself with a hitch or two, or go to the jib halyard cleat. Probably not correct, but I never claimed to know what I was doing. I'm sure the serious sailors, especially those that have run all their lines aft, adjust luff tension with the halyard and I'm doing it all bass-ackwards, but it worked; I can snug it up a lot tighter than I can pulling on the halyard.
I'll tell you what I'm doing lately and ya-all can throw rocks at it if it's wrong. With a new loose footed main, instead of the stock main with the boltrope at the bottom, I hoisted the sail and tied off the halyard with the tack-ring just slightly higher than where I want it to ride. Then run a line through the tack-ring and around the gooseneck several times to give me a purchase of 2 or 3:1 and snug it up. It snugs the sail up both directions, down and in toward the mast. If I continue with that method I guess I would add a clamcleat or something, right now I just tie it off to itself with a hitch or two, or go to the jib halyard cleat. Probably not correct, but I never claimed to know what I was doing. I'm sure the serious sailors, especially those that have run all their lines aft, adjust luff tension with the halyard and I'm doing it all bass-ackwards, but it worked; I can snug it up a lot tighter than I can pulling on the halyard.
interesting
Dave, I can't believe you've never seen a main with a grommet at the tack. Other than on big boats (30'+), the majority I've sailed on had grommets on the tack. Marshall, what you're doing is no less correct than any other method. That's pretty interesting that you adjust the halyard and then the downhaul. I'll have to try that some time.
Dave, I can't believe you've never seen a main with a grommet at the tack. Other than on big boats (30'+), the majority I've sailed on had grommets on the tack. Marshall, what you're doing is no less correct than any other method. That's pretty interesting that you adjust the halyard and then the downhaul. I'll have to try that some time.
Well...
after I retired I worked at a marina for a couple of years...guess what they stuck me with? Rigging. So, I have had the dubious pleasure of rigging around 200 different boats, and none of them had a grommet at the mainsail tack...but then again, I'm on this side of the divide.
after I retired I worked at a marina for a couple of years...guess what they stuck me with? Rigging. So, I have had the dubious pleasure of rigging around 200 different boats, and none of them had a grommet at the mainsail tack...but then again, I'm on this side of the divide.
Whatcha been smokin' Dave?
If you've rigged 200 boats and never seen a tack cringle, well, ya must've had your eyes closed. Most sails I have seen have a cringle (grommet) inside the bolt rope, vs a D-ring held on outside the bolt rope by nylon webbing. But further to the real discussion, it makes sense that one can get more luff tension using a 2:1 downhaul than 1:1 halyard (unlesss it's run back to a winch) but I would suggest that if one needs this much luff tension, something else is wrong. Even a lightweight like Ondine can put a 100 pounds force on the luff, sweating on the halyard at the mast. 100 pounds of luff tension is enough for either the lightest airs or the heaviest conditions.
If you've rigged 200 boats and never seen a tack cringle, well, ya must've had your eyes closed. Most sails I have seen have a cringle (grommet) inside the bolt rope, vs a D-ring held on outside the bolt rope by nylon webbing. But further to the real discussion, it makes sense that one can get more luff tension using a 2:1 downhaul than 1:1 halyard (unlesss it's run back to a winch) but I would suggest that if one needs this much luff tension, something else is wrong. Even a lightweight like Ondine can put a 100 pounds force on the luff, sweating on the halyard at the mast. 100 pounds of luff tension is enough for either the lightest airs or the heaviest conditions.
Attaching Tack
Well I have noticed that the ring at the tack of the sail kind of restricts the pivoting of the sail and creates a flat area right there by it. Joel at Idasailor suggested two SS fingers bolted to the sides of the boom with a bolt through them. If I measure for that arrangment, I think that the sailmaker will put a grommet in the sail, but if I attack to the booms bolt rope slide, the sailmaker will probably put a ring in it. By the way, I emailed for a new estimate for a 135 genoa instaed of a 100 working jib and that alone increased the cost about $200 or two marine units. John S
Well I have noticed that the ring at the tack of the sail kind of restricts the pivoting of the sail and creates a flat area right there by it. Joel at Idasailor suggested two SS fingers bolted to the sides of the boom with a bolt through them. If I measure for that arrangment, I think that the sailmaker will put a grommet in the sail, but if I attack to the booms bolt rope slide, the sailmaker will probably put a ring in it. By the way, I emailed for a new estimate for a 135 genoa instaed of a 100 working jib and that alone increased the cost about $200 or two marine units. John S
Downhaul vs. hanging by the halyard.
Rod: you're a brain man, you know your sailing sh--, (most of the time), I always like reading your posts, and I love the area you get to sail (still want to make a road trip up your way someday); but how do you manage to sound so condescending everytime you open your mouth to type? Good point, I can get the luff tension tight enough by pulling on the halyard too. Sure, you can even send your wife up to do it. But isn't that stupid if you could do it easier with an added purchase on a downhaul? It's easy to try; no blocks, no mods, just run a short length of line around the gooseneck a couple of times and you can SNUG (that term doesn't necessarily imply too much tension does it?) the luff. Question: your reasoning is so convincing, you gonna pull all the blocks that have purchase off of your boat, just because you think you have the brute strength (or Ondine does) to pull it directly and set it? Why make anything easier if you can do the same thing by hanging your weight on it, right Rodney? I appreciate your point about not going overboard with luff tension. Thanks. Next time your tugging on that halyard, putting 100 lbs of tension on it, with the line wrapped around your bony little fingers, while you hold on to it and wrap it to set it on the halyard cleat, (or alternatively just send Ondine up to do it), IF YOU EVEN THINK ABOUT THE POSSIBILITY of setting the halyard first and then snugging the luff using a any form of downhaul, I expect an apology buddy. To everyone else, including John S: just give the idea a try; you might like it and see that Rodney is full of . . . . . well let's just say . . . himself. Rod, buddy: you're always fun or funny to read, even when you're not trying to be. And no hard feelings, I do want to come up and sail your neck of the woods before this life is over; if you're still around I'll have to look you up.
Rod: you're a brain man, you know your sailing sh--, (most of the time), I always like reading your posts, and I love the area you get to sail (still want to make a road trip up your way someday); but how do you manage to sound so condescending everytime you open your mouth to type? Good point, I can get the luff tension tight enough by pulling on the halyard too. Sure, you can even send your wife up to do it. But isn't that stupid if you could do it easier with an added purchase on a downhaul? It's easy to try; no blocks, no mods, just run a short length of line around the gooseneck a couple of times and you can SNUG (that term doesn't necessarily imply too much tension does it?) the luff. Question: your reasoning is so convincing, you gonna pull all the blocks that have purchase off of your boat, just because you think you have the brute strength (or Ondine does) to pull it directly and set it? Why make anything easier if you can do the same thing by hanging your weight on it, right Rodney? I appreciate your point about not going overboard with luff tension. Thanks. Next time your tugging on that halyard, putting 100 lbs of tension on it, with the line wrapped around your bony little fingers, while you hold on to it and wrap it to set it on the halyard cleat, (or alternatively just send Ondine up to do it), IF YOU EVEN THINK ABOUT THE POSSIBILITY of setting the halyard first and then snugging the luff using a any form of downhaul, I expect an apology buddy. To everyone else, including John S: just give the idea a try; you might like it and see that Rodney is full of . . . . . well let's just say . . . himself. Rod, buddy: you're always fun or funny to read, even when you're not trying to be. And no hard feelings, I do want to come up and sail your neck of the woods before this life is over; if you're still around I'll have to look you up.
FWIW, I've been using marshalls method
On the bigger boats we called it a cunningham, (6:1) block setup for downward tension. on the mac, its just a line with some purchase. but I only cruise my mac...
On the bigger boats we called it a cunningham, (6:1) block setup for downward tension. on the mac, its just a line with some purchase. but I only cruise my mac...
Is a cunningham different than downhaul on tack?
Mr Bill: I thought a cunningham was a grommet set out further in the sail and was a control, in addition to the ring at the tack. Not sure where I got that idea, maybe I just dreamed it. As I remember, Dave told me I might want to get a cunningham cringle (that what you call it?) added on the new main that I had SomerSet build, but I'll be damned if I forgot all about it 'til just now.
Mr Bill: I thought a cunningham was a grommet set out further in the sail and was a control, in addition to the ring at the tack. Not sure where I got that idea, maybe I just dreamed it. As I remember, Dave told me I might want to get a cunningham cringle (that what you call it?) added on the new main that I had SomerSet build, but I'll be damned if I forgot all about it 'til just now.
name that part
Honestly, I have no idea what the correct name if for most of the stuff on my boat. "tighten the Cunningham" is command I hear from the skipper of the big boat I'm currently racing with. what he wants is to flatten the main, by tightening the downhaul block setup. attached to the grommet (cringle?) just above the boom, w/ a 'J' hook, and a line to a cleat on the mast. the block setup is a thin line, 6:1 setup w/ camcleat... simiar to a small vang. I'll let you educated guys figure out what its correct name should be. (When you figure it out, can you tell me how do you say cunningham in spanish? lol)
Honestly, I have no idea what the correct name if for most of the stuff on my boat. "tighten the Cunningham" is command I hear from the skipper of the big boat I'm currently racing with. what he wants is to flatten the main, by tightening the downhaul block setup. attached to the grommet (cringle?) just above the boom, w/ a 'J' hook, and a line to a cleat on the mast. the block setup is a thin line, 6:1 setup w/ camcleat... simiar to a small vang. I'll let you educated guys figure out what its correct name should be. (When you figure it out, can you tell me how do you say cunningham in spanish? lol)
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