synthetic oil

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RAD

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Jun 3, 2004
2,330
Catalina 30 Bay Shore, N.Y.
Jack some info FWIW

Amsoil Corp was one of the first to develope synthetic oils and I would think the pricing is close to Mobil synthetic, the stuff is not cheap but if you don't have to change it as much and you get better lube than regular oil I would think its worth it. A friend has been using a synthetic blend? in his boat and diesel truck and I've been meaning to ask him about that
 
Oct 3, 2006
1,029
Hunter 29.5 Toms River
100k

100k a year...thats nearly 300 miles a day, every day. 43 perfect engines that didnt leak or burn a drop of oil at high mileage Why do you get rid of them? Its really hard to buy a car cheap, put 100k on it, and sell it for a profit. And yes - it's pretty widely known that putting synthetic in an old engine will make things leak- every synthetic advocae in the world will tell you that.
 
May 24, 2004
125
Ericson E-23 Smith Mt. Lake
Everyone's an expert

Recently my sister-in-law asked if it was OK to add conventional oil to an engine with synthetic in the crankcase. The counterman (NAPA) just about went nuts, and told her she could do extreme damage to the engine mixing the two. Right on the jug of Mobil 1 it says it is compatible with conventional oils - so who was right, the 18 year old high school "expert" or the corporation with extensive lab capabilities and lots to lose from a lawsuit? I've asked the same question and gotten answers all over the map: "It gums up the engine"; "It'll make the engine blow up" came from a couple of wet-behind-the-ears counter jocks. "No problem"; "I do it myself" from experienced mechanics and racers. I run Amsoil in two vehicles that each have about 160k, and I change it at about 1 year intervals, of course changing filters every 3k to 4k and topping up the oil as needed. The big advantage I see is in not generating all the waste oil and saving the time involved in oil changes (plus small mpg increases). The molecules in a good synthetic don't break down nearly as quickly as conventional petroleum oils - that's why it's guaranteed to meet specs at 35,000 miles, and why it's so good in gearboxes. Yep, if you have weak seals, it will find them and leak out - that's one reason it's better, it penetrates into smaller gaps. Yep, on engines that have sludge, it will dissolve it (it has a natural detergent effect) and on a real high mileage engine that has not been flushed it can cause the oil pump pickup or oil filter to plug up and starve the engine for lubrication. As in many other aspects of mechanical issues, you have to use your head. Every jet engine uses synthetic, because conventional oils aren't good enough. Two years ago I talked a local racer (track champ in Street Stock) into running Amsoil in his dirt track car - at the end of 16 races (same oil, never changed) the engine builder did a teardown and could not believe the condition of the internals, especially the bearings. He used the same bearings the next year - a hitherto unheard of procedure. Yes, some synthetics in the past have been "snake oils". But a good brand is still better than any conventional in the same weight, and if you can run a one year or more interval between changes, it does indeed come out ahead in a cost analysis. Blends are just that - a mix of both. The qualities and properties of the synthetic are degraded when blended - why do it, other than to save a few bucks? If you want to save money short term, buy the $2/qt stuff and change it frequently. If you want the ultimate in protection and performance, buy the best synthetic and install a by-pass filter system that will keep the oil super clean and allow 100k mi change intervals. Your money, your engine, you choose.
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,713
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
Actually...

Some days I drive 500 miles some days only 200. I cover a very large geography VT, NH, ME, MA, CT & RI and part of NY and virtually live in my car during the week. I also never said NONE of the cars ever leaked a drop. My cars with conventional oil leaked far less than the ones I ran synthetic in though. Yes only one engine "burned" oil as in blue smoke and that was my Fiesta from when I was a kid. I did have a Volvo that used about a quart every 1k but the engine never smoked. I have also owned eight cars with turbo and every one used conventional oil. COntrary to what dealers would have you beleive. It's not hard to buy a CLEAN high mileage car, keep it spotless and maintained and sell it for what you paid, a slight profit or perhaps a very slight loss. I do it all the time. My cars are usually less than two years old with over 100k when I purchase them. I drive it for a year or so and at about 9 months start the search for my next one. I now, within the last two years, get a company car and not an allowance so I just hand in the keys every 9 months or so and get a new one but I still buy my wife and my personal cars the same way. If I put eithr the current Lexus or the BMW in a line up and asked anyone to pick out the highest mileage car no one could guess. Here's a hint get friendly with a salesman and get on the list to buy their cars. My brother just bought my last company car a 2005 Ford Explorer XLT for $5870.00 from my fleet management company. Trade in value even with 102k is $10,425.00 so even if he were to trade it he could make money...
 
Oct 25, 2005
735
Catalina 30 Banderas Bay, Mexico
Like religion or politics ... :)

Debating oil is a banned subject on many automotive forums. :) There is no question that full synthetics have some very desirable properties ... if your engine needs those properties. There is also no question that oil needs to be changed to remove contamination from normal blow-by. If operating conditions (extended high temperature and a good PVC system) work to remove these contaminates, any oil can be left in the crankcase for extended periods. For sailboat engines that see 20-50 hours of use per year, synthetic oil makes no sense at all. They never get the oil hot enough for long enough to keep it clean. For cars that don't get driven at cruise speeds for hours every day, synthetic oil makes no sense at all. They never get the oil hot enough for long enough to keep it clean either. For racing engines and commercial engines that spend most of their time fully warmed up, synthetic oil makes perfect sense. FWIW, synthetic oil should be cheaper than dino oil. When made in quantity the cost is lower than drilling wells, pumping and refining. Paying $7+ a quart has someone laughing all the way to the bank. BTW- in the last few years, they have changed the definition of "synthetic" as applied to motor oil. Mobil 1 used to be a full synthetic, now it is a blend.
 
Sep 15, 2006
202
Oday 27 Nova Scotia
Blame Wayne :)

He started it :) Actually, I thought it was interesting & useful exchange and a concensus was reached, namely that synthetic oils are NOT appropriate for aux. power in sailboats.
 
Oct 25, 2005
735
Catalina 30 Banderas Bay, Mexico
Oh sure Fred ...

like you would have an opinion on [insert subject here] that was worth anything ... :D
 

RAD

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Jun 3, 2004
2,330
Catalina 30 Bay Shore, N.Y.
Fred knows some thing but

he's not telling *x
 

Guy D

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Sep 25, 2006
46
- - Plainwell, MI
Synthetic oil and Leisure Suits

Put the synthetic oil in the closet with your leisure suit. Like all man-made products ir was all the rage for awhile and then reality reasserted itself. Oil does NOT break down. The 'molecules' in synthetic are no stronger than in conventional oil. All oil is subject to contamination and dilution through the combustion process. Unless you are on a ship with a duplex strainer on all of your oiled systems you will need to change your oil regularly. Ships go to the bone-yard with the same oil they left the ship-yard with. My preference is for a straight weight oil, ie...30W. The multi-vis oils achieve their properties with additives that do break down. Since you are going to change your oil regularly, why use something 3-4 times as expensive? The entire push towards running syn. was to extend the oil change interval, thereby justifying the cost. Since common sense tells us that we still have contamination and dilution with synthetic, why change. The only place, IMHO, for sysnthetic is in a gear box, properly broken in, and left there. BTW, high milage gearboxes with dubious maintenance histories are often best left with the old oil in as well. New oil alone has a tendency to soften seals and remove sludge. Just top it off. I don't know what jets are running today, but I know they were running just fine before sysnthetic was invented. Boaters, like clothing shoppers, sometimes think that more expensive is better. Save the money on synthetic and use it for more frequent changes and buy a magnetic oil plug. Most engines don't come with one-get one for the tranny too. I wear wool and burn Indonesian crude!
 
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