Survey

Bill1565 · Aug 28, 2013

Cambo said:
Hi guys,

I'm looking at purchasing a small keelboat (25ish feet) and around the 5-6000 dollar range. I spoke with my insurance broker and a Survey is not required.

In your opinions, is it worth it to spend the money on a survey and haul out on a boat this cheap

Thanks for any advice

Cam

IMHO a survey is a great thing. I always arrange to be there to see what the surveyor sees and to ask questions since the surveyor knows a whole bunch more than I do. Never felt the money was wasted, and occasionally the survey found stuff that reduced the price more than the survey cost. Would not plan on that in the $5k range tho. Survey reports make great planning documents and will help you focus your improvements.

Stu Jackson · Aug 28, 2013

Bill's right, but the one thing WE don't know is what YOUR boating experience is. In 1983 we bought a 1981 Catalina 22 that was pristine, almost new, no survey. In 1987 we bought a 1981 Catalina 25, no survey because I knew what I was looking at. In 1998 we bought a 1986 Catalina 34, got a survey because it had more systems than G*d!

I knew a LOT more in 1998 than I did in 1983, but horses for courses. Your knowledge is what counts on a boat this size. When we sold the C25, the first prospects took a sea trial and liked it, but backed out because the wife didn't know the difference between paint bubbles on the iron keel and blisters! Even their surveyor said they were nuts! The second guy read their survey and bought it without even a haulout.

You just never know.

Good luck.

Deadline · Aug 28, 2013

On the other hand...

A survey will be comparatively pricey for a boat this size. I just paid $800 for a survey on a 2001 H32. Find a buddy who knows boats to go over the thing with him, since this isn't rocket science. If the boat is out of the water, on the hards, all the better because you can check the bottom and the prop. Put the $800 or so into new equipment you'd like to replace.

Captn TJ · Aug 28, 2013

Deadline said:
A survey will be comparatively pricey for a boat this size. I just paid $800 for a survey on a 2001 H32. Find a buddy who knows boats to go over the thing with him, since this isn't rocket science. If the boat is out of the water, on the hards, all the better because you can check the bottom and the prop. Put the $800 or so into new equipment you'd like to replace.

Ouch - I think a wet deck could cost more than the price of the boat. A good survey is well worth the price.

sailor832 · Aug 28, 2013

This book will walk you through how todo a self survey. Not a replacement for a professional but a good start. Don Casey's Complete Illustrated Sailboat Maintenance Manual: Including Inspecting the Aging Sailboat, Sailboat Hull and Deck Repair, Sailboat Refinishing, Sailbo

Stu Jackson · Aug 28, 2013

There's also this:

http://forums.sbo.sailboatowners.com/showthread.php?t=102541

Winkfish · Aug 28, 2013

I wonder, if you tell a surveyor that this is not required by insurance, but is for your peace of mind, might he or she do a less comprehensive survey for less money?

Benny17441 · Aug 28, 2013

The most costly components on a boat are the sails, the engine, hull integrity includying keel joint, the standing rigging includling the spar and mast support and the steering system includying the rudder. If you can ascertain these to be in fair shape you will not get burnt on a $5,000 boat. To inspect the keel/hull joint may require a dive to avoid the cost of a haulout. You can probably get a diver that cleans bottoms for a living to give you a visual inspection for $50. They are not surveyors and you will not a written report or recourse against ommissions but they have been around boats enough to recognize major problems. I rely on the diver that cleans the bottom of our boat for monthly reports on the condition of the hull. To inspect the boat just take someone else with you preferably someone with more experience as four eyes tend to see more than two. If the insurance broker says they will not require a survey there is no need to argue with them.

nolasafari · Aug 29, 2013

On a boat that size and not overly complicated, plus such a deal on the lift do it yourself. You have done your homework go for it. I did use a survey on the hunt for my new boat, cost $750 for a 30 foot Catalina plus lift, I walked on that one due to blisters, best money I ever spent. Spent about the same on the 2006 Hunter I just purchased but the survey did give me enough information to have several items replaced by the owner which did add up to more than the survey. We are talking about a much diffrent price range and boat than yours. Just don't discount the value of a survey when and if you make a larger purchase.

Jim

higgs · Aug 29, 2013

You do need to cover yourself liability wise. an umbrella policy would probably do that for you. Otherwise, if you are willing to take the risk, forgo the insurance.

Captn TJ · Aug 30, 2013

higgs said:
You do need to cover yourself liability wise. an umbrella policy would probably do that for you. Otherwise, if you are willing to take the risk, forgo the insurance.

Forgoing insurance is irresponsible. Last year my boat got hit while at anchor along with another boat by an uninsured boat that dragged anchor.

Damage to my boat was $10k and about $30k to the one he hit first. Hope my insurance company takes him to the cleaners - especially since he lied about having insurance.

py26129 · Aug 30, 2013

Cambo said:
Thanks for all the great advice guys. I know some of you will frown upon this but I am leaning towards skipping the survey.

I contacted some marine surveyors today and it is looking like it will cost me close to $800 for the survey and a lift out of the water as there are no local surveyors so they must travel.

I have not owned a cruising boat but have been around enough, and have also read several books on the subject. I intend to bring an experienced person along as well to take another look. The Marina said they will lift the boat out for me for $100 so I can get a look at the underside.

Hopefully all goes well and I will be into a new boat soon.

Thanks again

COngratulations. It all depends on what you are comfortable with. We bought our IP31 without a survey or a sea trial (but had some caveats in the sales agreement) and have had no regrets. You will have some issues with any boat you buy, but that is just part of the ownership expereince. Enjoy your boat and get out there.

Cheers

Matt

kito · Aug 30, 2013

I guess it depends on if you are a hands on type of guy. I plan on making an offer on a boat this weekend without a survey. It is on the hard right now getting bottom painting and dripless shaft seal and zincs put on. I have no concerns about that. My main concern is if there are any deck soft spots, major leaks, condition of engine, sails and rigging and check for keel step mast rot. Which I can check out myself. These are high dollar fixes and deal breakers if they don't check out ok. The $500 or so I would pay a surveyor can be used to fix the little things that need attention.