I am going to look at a '85 Catalina 27 next week with a friend who has owned 3 sailboats and currently owns a Hunter 27. He is an aircraft mechanic by profession and has suggested that since the boat is under $15,000 that I do without a survey. Instead he suggests that he and I will spend the day inspecting the boat, then if the boat is satisfactory,return the following week when the boat is put in the water to do a sea trial. He had a survey done on his Hunter and tells me that he had already found pretty much everything the surveyor did. And I know he has read a couple of books on inspecting sailboats because he gave them to me to review before we go. Would I be a fool to skip getting a professional survey?
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Survey
Yes Mike, it would be foolish, after all it's your money not your friends. Besides, you'll more than likely need it for insurance purposes. It's money well spent. Good luck.
Yes Mike, it would be foolish, after all it's your money not your friends. Besides, you'll more than likely need it for insurance purposes. It's money well spent. Good luck.
Insurance may want a survey
Like Gerry said, the insurance may want a survey. Having your friend along when you go look at the boat may serve you well in terms of deciding on an offer, but the surveyors report is what insurance companies and banks will want to see in order to establish the value and condition of the boat.
Like Gerry said, the insurance may want a survey. Having your friend along when you go look at the boat may serve you well in terms of deciding on an offer, but the surveyors report is what insurance companies and banks will want to see in order to establish the value and condition of the boat.
Survey
Ask the ins co if they require a survey. Last year I bought a 1997 C320...no survey required. Normally you can get a reasonable idea of the condition of the boat by a short walk around. If it is in excellent condition and well maintained, I'd be tempted to go without the survey, and you and your friend do a serious inspection. On the other hand, the $350 to $450 for a survey is worth some piece of mind.
Ask the ins co if they require a survey. Last year I bought a 1997 C320...no survey required. Normally you can get a reasonable idea of the condition of the boat by a short walk around. If it is in excellent condition and well maintained, I'd be tempted to go without the survey, and you and your friend do a serious inspection. On the other hand, the $350 to $450 for a survey is worth some piece of mind.
My criteria
My criteria would be "would I loan this friend $15K and trust him to pay me back?". If you trust him that much AND this is his third boat AND it's well maintained, then I might conisder going without a survey. But I think you'd be very surprised at what a good surveyor looks for and will find. Most will probably be minor....but what if you skip the survey and 2 months later find major corrosion or rotten decking etc. Would you trust your friend to split the cost of a major repair within the first couple months??? The Insurance will probably require the survey. And unless I trusted this friend like a brother (and I trust VERY few people that I call 'friends' that well) then I'd keep us BOTH honest and get the survey.....if the $3-400 for the survey is too much for you to handle, then good luck with the 'hole in the water' aspect of boating.....
JimmyD
My criteria would be "would I loan this friend $15K and trust him to pay me back?". If you trust him that much AND this is his third boat AND it's well maintained, then I might conisder going without a survey. But I think you'd be very surprised at what a good surveyor looks for and will find. Most will probably be minor....but what if you skip the survey and 2 months later find major corrosion or rotten decking etc. Would you trust your friend to split the cost of a major repair within the first couple months??? The Insurance will probably require the survey. And unless I trusted this friend like a brother (and I trust VERY few people that I call 'friends' that well) then I'd keep us BOTH honest and get the survey.....if the $3-400 for the survey is too much for you to handle, then good luck with the 'hole in the water' aspect of boating.....
JimmyDFood for thought
Y'all have given me some food for thought. My friend has two passions; sailing and flying. I taught him to fly some 15 years ago and he has over 8,000 hrs and a pocket full of ratings now. When he does something it is all out. And he spends more time with his boat than his plane(which I financed for him). I think if he is absolutely positive about the boat, I'll purchase without survey. If he is negative, I'll keep looking. And if he is in between or a little hesitant, I'll have the boat surveyed. I appreciate everyone's input.
Y'all have given me some food for thought. My friend has two passions; sailing and flying. I taught him to fly some 15 years ago and he has over 8,000 hrs and a pocket full of ratings now. When he does something it is all out. And he spends more time with his boat than his plane(which I financed for him). I think if he is absolutely positive about the boat, I'll purchase without survey. If he is negative, I'll keep looking. And if he is in between or a little hesitant, I'll have the boat surveyed. I appreciate everyone's input.
Survey!!!!!!!
I have owned now, eight boats in the last 30 years from a Helsen 22 to a Coronado 35 (liveaboard). I had everyone surveyed, despite my experince with boats, the available literature and other opinions. Why? Because for the few hundred dollars, I am relying on often a certified and experienced surveyor who may see things I won't, provide far more experience with boat systems then I have, put his name on an instrument that is often required for insurance or financing and its just the right thing to do. A 27 Catalina will cost you $350-$400 for a survey plus hauling out costs. Thats the best money you can spend. Like mentioned earlier....its piece of mind as well. Regards Bob 30 Catalina
I have owned now, eight boats in the last 30 years from a Helsen 22 to a Coronado 35 (liveaboard). I had everyone surveyed, despite my experince with boats, the available literature and other opinions. Why? Because for the few hundred dollars, I am relying on often a certified and experienced surveyor who may see things I won't, provide far more experience with boat systems then I have, put his name on an instrument that is often required for insurance or financing and its just the right thing to do. A 27 Catalina will cost you $350-$400 for a survey plus hauling out costs. Thats the best money you can spend. Like mentioned earlier....its piece of mind as well. Regards Bob 30 Catalina
Survey
Not all surveyor's are the same. If you do decide to use a surveyor, ask for reccomendations, and check them out. I know someone who paid for a survey, and really only got an inspection. Depending on the age, and value of the boat, most insurance company's will require a survey. Maybe you should find out in advance if yours will. For "peace" of mind, so to speak.
Not all surveyor's are the same. If you do decide to use a surveyor, ask for reccomendations, and check them out. I know someone who paid for a survey, and really only got an inspection. Depending on the age, and value of the boat, most insurance company's will require a survey. Maybe you should find out in advance if yours will. For "peace" of mind, so to speak.
Survey
Boats are an ongoing expense. You will find that the survey is money well spent. best of luck. jax
Boats are an ongoing expense. You will find that the survey is money well spent. best of luck. jax
Common Sense
Spend your money for something for the boat, you're friend, I would think will do fine. And unless this is your last $15,000, forget the insurance, except for liability.
Spend your money for something for the boat, you're friend, I would think will do fine. And unless this is your last $15,000, forget the insurance, except for liability.
And if later
you end up finding something really seriously wrong with the boat that your friend didn't catch..........???????????
you end up finding something really seriously wrong with the boat that your friend didn't catch..........???????????
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