Sump Pump and Bildge Pump?

[rajhnsn]

My Oday 35 has a sump pump in the bildge that is seperated from the rest of the bildge. A hose from the shower and from the ice box leads into it and a hose leads out overboard at the stern. There is about a 4 inch high wall around the sump with a metal screen covering the top. There is no seperate bildge pump. I will be adding a seperate bildge pump but my questions are: How many gpm should I buy considering that the sump pump will act as a back up? Can I tap into the existing hose for the bildge pump or does it need its own hose? I suspect that the sump was an addition to the boat but I'm not sure. Do other Oday 34/35's have this arrangement?

 

[DannyS]

That must have been something the P.O. must have done unless you are the O.O. (original owner). Where is it located? Mine has a bilge pump but no sump. I would think you could add a "Y" in the hose to keep from drilling another hole in the hull. You might need a one way valve in between the sump pump and the "Y" to keep the water from being pumped from the bilge, into the sump and not outside.
On another note, I was perusing your photos and had never seen the bulb keel on the 35's. What do you draw? Another difference I noticed was what looks like teak toerails. Mine has molded fiberglass toerails with teak caps.
Always interesting seeing the differences in like boats.

 

[rajhnsn]

I am probably the 4th owner of this boat so it seems like it was done by one of the po's since you don't have it. It was most likely owner #2. He purchased the boat with some damage and did a nice repair of the hull. He also did a few other modifications such as the toe rail and the bulb keel. The toe rail was probably due to the damage. He did a beautiful job of adding a 2 1/2" toe rail that will get a few coats of cetol this year. The boat was originally a deep draft (close to 6'). What he did was cut off about 12" and added led on both sides to make up the loss of righting moment then created a bulb with fiberglass. The boat now draws about 4' 7", about the same as the shoal draft. When I redid the bottom last year, I refaired the bulb. The boat sails fine. I've never raced it so I don't really know how well it points but it does not seem to be a problem. The PO was pretty handy. There are other things on the boat that he did that must of taken a bit of skill. For example, he built a track on the legs of the table so that it can be adjusted side to side to give more room to pass forward. He was a pretty handy guy that cared about the boat--one of the reasons I was sold on it.

Thanks for the idea of the check valve. It makes sense.

 

[DannyS]

I know some will say not to put a check valve in a bilge pump line because they can clog and not open and potentially sink the boat, but I think it would be alright in between the sump and the Y since the bilge pump will have a free run to the outside. I have a 1100 gph pump and that seems to work just fine but I really don't have anything to compare it to.
The keel modification is quite impressive on your boat. We have the deep keel and we can point like crazy into the wind. One of the many things I love about the boat!

 

[rajhnsn]

Good point about the check valve. I will need to make it a mater of my maintenance routine to keep it clean. There are enough holes in this boat as it is. The only issue that I have with the keel is that the new rudder is at the same depth as the keel. If I have a hard grounding, its likely that I could bend the rudder post. I'm a lot more cautious than I used to be. Is your rudder as long as your keel?

 

[Oldhokie64]

I'm new to sailing but have a 40 year background in construction including plumbing and hydronics. I would avoid check valves and go with two independent lines. You are certainly far enough north to have serious freezing and the check valves (you would need two) would cause water to be continuously in the line. Lines in the open air are more likely to freeze than water in the bilge. In addition to possible cloging, a check valve can remain in the open position which would circulate bilge to sump or reverse. Also the lines should slope back to the pump with no "P" traps which would trap water.

My 272 has a combination bilge or to put it more simply, the shower dumps into the bilge. I would go for a second safety pump on a seaperate circuit if there were room.

 

[DannyS]

I knew someone would weigh in on the check valve and Oldhokie's probably right about needed two check valves because if you were using the shower and the sump filled up, kicked the sump pump on, that water might backflow into the bilge without a check valve in between the Y and the bilge pump.
Do you use the shower much? Perhaps you could just do away with the sump and have it and the icebox drain into the bilge. then you could use the sump pump as your bilge pump assuming it's large enough. That's how mine is set up. That way, you won't need to drill anymore holes and you don't need to buy another pump.
I do have a manual pump as a backup or (worst case scenario) in addition to the automated bilge pump.
My rudder is not as long as the keel. It looks like the same rudder as yours. In fact, I have my rudder in the garage right now. I have some delamination to fix before splashdown.

 

[BarryL]

Hey,

My boat (1986) does not have a separate sump for the shower. The shower (and ice box) just drain down into the regular bilge. My boat has a 2000 gph Rule pump and no check valve.

How big is the existing sump pump? You can probably go smaller because, as you mentioned, the existing pump can still be used. Personally, I would use the same size so you have redundancy and by carrying 1 spare you are covered.

Barry

 

[rajhnsn]

I'll have to check the size of the sump pump this weekend. Its starting to warm up here. Time to start the projects. One of them will be to replace the hose and mixer for the cockpit shower. There was a leak that caused the bilge to fill and overflow into the sump. I've also noticed that when I use the hot water heater on shore power it will overflow to the bilge. I still have to trouble shoot this one a little further. It does not seem to happen when the engine heats the water. Its probably related to the cockpit shower leak. Do your 35's have engine heated water or was this an add on?

 

[DannyS]

Ours heats with the engine as well. Not sure if that was an option or not, I assume it was standard but who knows. That's an interesting dilemma you have, I've never checked on mine but does your heater have a thermostat? Perhaps it's set too high and overheating the water tripping the pressure release valve. Just a theory.

 

[rajhnsn]

I'll check for a therostat. Good idea. Thanks

 

[BarryL]

hi,

My boat has a hot water heater that works on electric and engine. According to the documentation I have, the hot water heater was an option, but I bet that most boats have it. Also, I would be surprised if your boat has the original hot water heater - I bet most don't last more than 15 years.

Good luck,
Barry

 

[Oldhokie64]

The electric stat is probably set high, also the TP valve could be defective and the fresh water heater never gets the water hot enough to pop the valve.

 

[Tom Potter]

Quick question guys, I also have a 6 gallon hot water heater that heats under engine power and shore power. About how long does it take to heat up while on shore power?

 

[DannyS]

As I recall, ours is pretty hot within an hour with shore power. Hot water on the boat while out at anchor is one of the many things I love about our boat!

 

[Oldhokie64]

1500 watts, 12.5 amps, I would agree - an hour or less. A domestic electric water heater is around 25 amps and as I recall generates about 14 gph.

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wc...Primary Search/mode matchallpartial/0/0?N=377 710&Ne=0&Ntt=water heaters&Ntk=Primary Search&Ntx=mode matchallpartial&Nao=0&Ns=0&keyword=water heaters&isLTokenURL=true&storeNum=11&subdeptNum=4&classNum=0