Suggestions for leading Lines to Cockpit ?

[MrBee]

We have an Irwin 10/4 with Wire/rope halyards and all lines are controlled at the Mast.
I would like to run the Main Halyard and Topping lift to the Cockpit as an off season project.
Will probably run the Reefing lines and Lazy jacks (When i install them) also. Just looking for different ideas on how YOU have or would do this. The Main Halyard is wire to rope but there is plenty of line that the wire will never get to the bottom of the Mast. I don't intend to Pull the Mast this winter so don't want to install anything as a Mast Step. I'm thinking something simple like a Pad eye bolted to the Deck and attaching a snatch block...or maybe a few of those spring loaded stand up blocks that bolt thru the deck. Would it be better to attach right to the Mast, I was thinking I t would be best to NOT have that many holes screwed to the mast at the bottom.
What ever method I use to transition from the Mast to the Deck, I will also need Deck organizer then run to a rope clutch. I am trying to get a list together of how I want to do this then try to pick up the items over winter as I find good prices.

Thanks for your ideas and opinions .

Brian

 

[Ed Schenck]

Except for the wire halyards your dilemma is the same as mine. I have had all the pieces parts for eight years and still everything is at the mast. My situation may be a little different as my mast is keel-stepped. Using the plate at the mast partner I can remove a bolt and replace with an eye-bolt. I did that for my vang and even have one ready for the halyard. I also have the two deck organizers bolted down, one double on each side. I also have the winches and clutches but uninstalled. If you can somehow attach to the mast base I think that is better than drilling holes through the coach roof. Next best is the standup swivel block. Maybe I will get my own halyard and topping lift back there before Christmas.

 

[David in Sandusky]

Solution on a '77 h27

Here are the pictures and description of our project on our '77 h27, Lady Lillie.

http://hunter.sailboatowners.com/in...7&cat_id=16&aid=7355&page=article&mn=27_75-84

The on new idea for you may be cheek blocks mounted low on the mast to turn the lines aft. We got ours from the reject box of a local rigger, but I'm sure you could find new ones on the web.

I wouldn't worry about holes at the foot of the mast. For a deck mounted mast, there is no bending load at the foot, a little shear load, and maximum compression load. But the bending load is the problem causing most mast failures, in combination with compression. Cruising masts are usually overbuilt enough to take a few small holes, even where the bending stress is the greatest (the spreaders, for instance.) A keel stepped mast would have a little more bending stress at the deck, but this is high only when one or more stays has already failed, and I still doubt that the holes would be a problem.

Good luck - we love the ease and safety of controlling our main from the cockpit.

 

[Stu Jackson]

I wouldn't put a single more hole in my mast than necessary. The deck can take almost anything. Stand-up turning blocks or the spring loaded regular blocks (which keep the line higher off the deck and require the deck organizers to be further away) can be used and then run to cheek blocks or deck organizers. To avoid additional friction, minimize the angle the deck organizers make in the line. This would suggest that instead of being abeam the mast they be further aft.

Instead of reinventing the wheel, take a look at any block manufacturer's catalogs, Harken has some good suggestions. Talk to Garhauer, they're helpful, too. Time to get rid of the wire halyard.

 

[Dick Westwood]

I did this project on my 20-footer the way you're considering: spring-loaded stand-up blocks bolted through the deck, and a rope clutch. Both the main halyard and the jib halyard. Works perfectly for me. It's an easy project to do, and - at least for me - pays off big time. Particularly when single-handing, life improves greatly when you never have to leave the cockpit.

A little time thinking about the deck layout pays off. Like where to place the clutches relative to your winches. Also, whether to use backing plates below-decks or just fender washers (I did the latter). But, again: really easy project.

Regarding alternative approaches: I've installed cheek blocks on my mast for other reasons (single line reefing), and have had no problems as a result. Even so, if I were going to turn my halyards at the mast itself, I think I'd prefer to install one of those stainless steel plates with attachment points at the mast foot, and shackle my blocks there. It seems to me that there's a heck of a load on halyards, including jerking loads if you increase halyard tension in a blow, and I'd prefer not to be depending on a couple of bolts screwed into the mast. Probably overly paranoid, but that's how I am.

 

[Beyond_the_Arc]

Also, consider a solution that incorporates something that I saw this weekend in Solomons, MD. Wasn't my boat, but I'm looking for a solution to the cockpit rigging as well and saw this: Halyards were internal to an intermediate point on the mast (below the lower spreaders), from the exit blocks, the halyards (main, 2 x jenny, spin, plus topping lift and spin pole lift) then 'free fell' directly to organizer/stand-up block arrangements located approximately 12" laterally from the mast and swept back towards the cockpit slightly. The resultant arrangement allowed all of the lines to be held away from the mast (I bet that boat was silent in its slip) and because of the angle of the steel mounting plate, each line was away from others and could be led to the rope clamp and winch near the cockpit. The slight windage presented by the 'free standing' halyards was likely more than compensated for by the lack of banging halyards as the boat rocked. I didn't examine it more closely than a dockside stare; however, it appeared the steel was 1/4" thick in an inverted 'T' about 8" long and was secured to the deck with six through bolt fasteners. I would assume that the interior installation was most likely finished by a load-spreading plate and some fancy nuts or wood covers (at least, that's what I would do in similar circumstances). The blocks appeared to be Harken 40mm and each was shackled with a stand-up spring. Because the stand-up block/organizer held the lines away from the mast, there was no need for cheek or turning blocks on the mast. Because the stand-up blocks took the place of the deck organizer (only requiring essentially the same mounting space as a traditional deck organizer, there was only need to penetrate the cabin roof as if an organizer were in that postion.

From observation (only), the pros appear to be a significant reduction in running rigging friction (one less turning block per halyard) and a much simpler installation. The cons likely include slightly increased windage (though the halyards would still be exposed in a more traditional set-up) and (possibly!!!) increased loading on the cabin roof. If the static and dynamic loads were considered carefully by the rigger, then this possible 'con' is eliminated.

IMHO, this looked intriguing enough that I'm going to track the owner down (wasn't present when I was) and ask more questions. Beyond_the_Arc isn't a racer, so the windage issue isn't a concern and because I'm an engineer I like elegant (RIP simple) solutions--this has desirable characteristics.

Fair winds, following seas to all!

 

[MrBee]

Stu, thanks for the suggestions, Not sure why you say not to reinvent the wheel, I don't intend to. Looking for how other have done it to see what method I like for our situation.

Also, what is wrong with wire Halyards ? Seems like the boat has been fine with them since 1975.
YES I would like to have all rope Halyards and if it was just a matter of replacing the line it would have been done already. But you know there is more to it than that and everybody, I mean some of us, have a boat budget. I have several Items higher on the list than changing the Halyards.
I'm not the least bit squeemish about drilling holes in my boat, so I was leaning towards blocks on the Deck rather than the Mast.
A stand up block run to an organizer then to a clutch should be what I need.

Brian

 

[sand sailor]

i did what your looking to do last year and i have no regrets go for it youll love it