I'm still looking for my first sailboat. I want a 22-27 foot boat, I'm a beginner to owning a sailboat, have sailed in past with limited experience. Want something forgiving to sail, mostly used for daysailing, occasional overnight. Something with some performance due to fact club racing is around these parts. West coast of florida (tampa bay area), will keep boat in water all the time. (I've looked at centerboard models, worry about the upkeep of that design/cable/pins/barnacles when in water all the time. Fairly shallow draft wanted (less than 4 feet wanted). I guess an outboard. Price want to be in the less than 8-9K range or so, would be great if less than 5K. I've seriously considered cape dory's - but dismissed due to lack of speed and full keel issues with running aground and lack of pointing?,,, precision 23's but dismissed due to centerboard issues and musty interiors on those I've looked at, I looked at an O'day 25 but had centerboard and think that might be a headache for me - am I wrong?, now considering catalinas - saw a wing keel 2'10" draft but think that might be too shallow for much windward performance, heard problems with cataling wing keels grounding and causing hull problems,,,considered a ranger 23 1072 but haven't looked at that boat yet..... Basically looking for racer/cruiser less than 27 feet, 5-8K with draft of less than 4 feet fixed keel, daysailer/a few overnites, with some ability to handle a beginner in the open gulf on occasion. Please let some recommendations fly!! Thanks a bunch. Doug
still looking, 1/2 the fun they say
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catalina 27
I am thrilled with my Catalina 27. 4 foot draft and handles sooooo much better than my previous centerboard. There was a fellow in the Tarpon Springs area who had one listed here a few months ago. Tall rig, outboard, just a bit older than I wanted. It was priced about 9k and he was willing to come down. Matbe he will see this and relist. If you would like to try a Cat 27 let me know,I would be happy to take you. jack
I am thrilled with my Catalina 27. 4 foot draft and handles sooooo much better than my previous centerboard. There was a fellow in the Tarpon Springs area who had one listed here a few months ago. Tall rig, outboard, just a bit older than I wanted. It was priced about 9k and he was willing to come down. Matbe he will see this and relist. If you would like to try a Cat 27 let me know,I would be happy to take you. jack
get the biggest boat you can afford
After you have been reading this board for awhile you will notice that there is some type of viral disease that overcomes all sailboat owners. I do not know the scientific name but it is commonly called "twofootitis" and the symptoms include the strong urge to move up to a two foot longer boat. My wife and I began our sailing experience with a catalina 22. 1 year later we bought a Hunter 27! The principles of sailing are the same on all size boats, just a difference in the learning curve (the larger the boat the longer the learning curve.) my two cents Chris Drifter II SF Bay
After you have been reading this board for awhile you will notice that there is some type of viral disease that overcomes all sailboat owners. I do not know the scientific name but it is commonly called "twofootitis" and the symptoms include the strong urge to move up to a two foot longer boat. My wife and I began our sailing experience with a catalina 22. 1 year later we bought a Hunter 27! The principles of sailing are the same on all size boats, just a difference in the learning curve (the larger the boat the longer the learning curve.) my two cents Chris Drifter II SF Bay
I'll chime in first.
We're very pleased with our Starwind 27 for our first pocket cruiser. It is a Jim Taylor designed model (he designs Precision and Sabre models) made by Wellcraft in the 1980's. It looks very similar to Precision and seems to be a well made boat. We're very happy with performance but we don't race, so what would we know? I was just looking at a 2004 model Precision 28 that looks very similar to our boat from the outside. There are significant differences in the interior, though. It's a little beamy and I understand that doesn't help in rough conditions, but it makes it roomy below and on deck. We have a diesel inboard for auxillary power, which I recommend for you if you are thinking bigger in the future. You may as well get introduced to it at some point in time. Our shoal draft lead keel is just under 4' and has served us well around the various docks we sidle up to on the lake. You may be able to find a 20-year old boat like this (in decent condition) at the upper end of your price range. Just remember to budget plenty of money for upgrades and transition costs. The purchase price is about half our total cost so far in just one full year after adding survey, haul-out, trucking, rigging, slip fee, winter storage, up-grades (including upholstery, and 2 new sails), etc. You may not have many of these costs, but you get the point. We looked at a Cal 2-27 that we liked but didn't act quickly enough on it. After looking at a few boats in the 24' range, we realized that they didn't have enough room to satisfy us right from the git go. For a boat to learn the ropes on, she's been great for us and I'm really glad we found her. Good luck in your search.
We're very pleased with our Starwind 27 for our first pocket cruiser. It is a Jim Taylor designed model (he designs Precision and Sabre models) made by Wellcraft in the 1980's. It looks very similar to Precision and seems to be a well made boat. We're very happy with performance but we don't race, so what would we know? I was just looking at a 2004 model Precision 28 that looks very similar to our boat from the outside. There are significant differences in the interior, though. It's a little beamy and I understand that doesn't help in rough conditions, but it makes it roomy below and on deck. We have a diesel inboard for auxillary power, which I recommend for you if you are thinking bigger in the future. You may as well get introduced to it at some point in time. Our shoal draft lead keel is just under 4' and has served us well around the various docks we sidle up to on the lake. You may be able to find a 20-year old boat like this (in decent condition) at the upper end of your price range. Just remember to budget plenty of money for upgrades and transition costs. The purchase price is about half our total cost so far in just one full year after adding survey, haul-out, trucking, rigging, slip fee, winter storage, up-grades (including upholstery, and 2 new sails), etc. You may not have many of these costs, but you get the point. We looked at a Cal 2-27 that we liked but didn't act quickly enough on it. After looking at a few boats in the 24' range, we realized that they didn't have enough room to satisfy us right from the git go. For a boat to learn the ropes on, she's been great for us and I'm really glad we found her. Good luck in your search.
Making it easier
Your very specific desires make it easier to offer advice. I have an Oday 23, and find that the centerboard is a simple, no maintenance thing. However, my boat is out of the water 8 months of the year and I can clean and repaint the inside of the trunk easily. You may be right in wanting to avoid the Oday centerboard- in-a-keel-trunk design if you won't be pulling the boat out on a regular basis. I too love the Catalina (almost bought a 25); I don't think there is a brand out there that holds its value better. The Catalina 27 may only be two feet longer than the Oday 25, but it is a much "bigger" boat. You are right; looking is half the fun.
Your very specific desires make it easier to offer advice. I have an Oday 23, and find that the centerboard is a simple, no maintenance thing. However, my boat is out of the water 8 months of the year and I can clean and repaint the inside of the trunk easily. You may be right in wanting to avoid the Oday centerboard- in-a-keel-trunk design if you won't be pulling the boat out on a regular basis. I too love the Catalina (almost bought a 25); I don't think there is a brand out there that holds its value better. The Catalina 27 may only be two feet longer than the Oday 25, but it is a much "bigger" boat. You are right; looking is half the fun.
Here is your boat, Sir
A Pearson 28 is in your budget, plenty of space, sweet sailing characteristics, and built tough. Check them out at www.yachtworld.com
A Pearson 28 is in your budget, plenty of space, sweet sailing characteristics, and built tough. Check them out at www.yachtworld.com
catalina 27?
Thanks Jack, so you like your catalina 27. You think a newbie could handle that size boat? Does yours have inboard or outboard. I was thinking outboard for ease/simpicity but cruisers always say eventually you'll want an inboard. Is a diesel engine much of a headache to maintain? compared to an outboard? I don't want such an albatross that I'm afraid to sail it or have such a handful to sail singlehandedly. Thanks others for comments. The pearson 28 has a bit too deep draft for me, 4 1/2 feet I think...I did look at 2 pearson 26's. They sail very nice, but I couldn't get past the very spartan/formica interiors, very dated on the Pearson 26s that I saw, otherwise I like that boat. Any other recommendations?
Thanks Jack, so you like your catalina 27. You think a newbie could handle that size boat? Does yours have inboard or outboard. I was thinking outboard for ease/simpicity but cruisers always say eventually you'll want an inboard. Is a diesel engine much of a headache to maintain? compared to an outboard? I don't want such an albatross that I'm afraid to sail it or have such a handful to sail singlehandedly. Thanks others for comments. The pearson 28 has a bit too deep draft for me, 4 1/2 feet I think...I did look at 2 pearson 26's. They sail very nice, but I couldn't get past the very spartan/formica interiors, very dated on the Pearson 26s that I saw, otherwise I like that boat. Any other recommendations?
Catalina
Hey Doug, I had an O'day 25 c/b in beatiful condition but we never felt comfortable in winds much over 15knts. 15 knots would equal 20 plus degrees heel and an added gust would push us over a far as 30 degrees plus. We were constantly adusting the sails. Alot of food, drinks, and sometimes blood on the floor. A three foot chop would cause outboard to tilt out of the water causing the prop to spin freely in the air. Don't get me wrong, smaller boats in the right hands will perform very well but not as forgiving as a larger, fin keel, at least to me. Are there better built boat than old Catalinas? Yes. Pearson? Probably. But bang for the buck it would be hard to beat. When I moved to the Catalina 27 I couldn't beleive the differance 2 feet made. Of coarse it was more money than the Oday 25 but still cheap by comparison. There is an older one listed at this web site in St.Petersburg and he is asking a premium for it. It might have the spartan interior that you are trying to stay away from, but the sailing characterists for money spent on the bay and gulf waters.....sweet! Send me an email if you would like to and good luck hunting. scoyne@tampabay.rr.com
Hey Doug, I had an O'day 25 c/b in beatiful condition but we never felt comfortable in winds much over 15knts. 15 knots would equal 20 plus degrees heel and an added gust would push us over a far as 30 degrees plus. We were constantly adusting the sails. Alot of food, drinks, and sometimes blood on the floor. A three foot chop would cause outboard to tilt out of the water causing the prop to spin freely in the air. Don't get me wrong, smaller boats in the right hands will perform very well but not as forgiving as a larger, fin keel, at least to me. Are there better built boat than old Catalinas? Yes. Pearson? Probably. But bang for the buck it would be hard to beat. When I moved to the Catalina 27 I couldn't beleive the differance 2 feet made. Of coarse it was more money than the Oday 25 but still cheap by comparison. There is an older one listed at this web site in St.Petersburg and he is asking a premium for it. It might have the spartan interior that you are trying to stay away from, but the sailing characterists for money spent on the bay and gulf waters.....sweet! Send me an email if you would like to and good luck hunting. scoyne@tampabay.rr.com
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