Starter issue

[Deadline]

The starter button on my Yanmar 2GM20F (Hunter 320) continues to vex me.

Last year I replaced the OME button as worn out.
Cleaned all connections at batteries and engine ground.
All the leads are tight as well. No corrosion anywhere.
(Except behind starter panel, said to be for lights only.)
The starter itself is just fine, supposedly bulletproof.

It starts up just fine but after sailing all day it takes four pushes to catch.
The first three make no connection, no clicking sound or anything.
What could it be? Does it matter? Thanks.

 

[larryw]

I'd suspect the ignition switch, replace it with a common toggle switch and use it for a few times.

 

[Neil McDonald]

Common Hunter problem. Too much voltage loss in starter button circuit. Modify wiring so that this starter button circuit actuates an additional (small) solenoid to power up existing starter motor solenoid! Wiring diagram somewhere in the archives on this forum. It worked for me!

 

[Neil McDonald]

The starter button on my Yanmar 2GM20F (Hunter 320) continues to vex me. Last year I replaced the OME button as worn out.
Cleaned all connections at batteries and engine ground.
All the leads are tight as well. No corrosion anywhere.
(Except behind starter panel, said to be for lights only.)
The starter itself is just fine, supposedly bulletproof.

It starts up just fine but after sailing all day it takes four pushes to catch.
The first three make no connection, no clicking sound or anything.
What could it be? Does it matter? Thanks.

I just remembered that I made up my own wiring diagram. See attached. Many people have suggested that a NAPA or similar source horn relay is a good selection for the new solenoid. Mine is wired in a few inches away from the starter motor. Now into my third season with this solution.

 

[Ed Schenck]

Adding a starter "relay".

Here is the link to my own fix from back in 1999:
http://hunter.sailboatowners.com/in...&cat_id=38&aid=7175&page=article&mn=37-cutter .

My sketch is not fancy but it definitely fixes the problem. So far my new 3YM30 has not needed the fix.

Whoops! I see that there is something wrong with the picture in the link. Adding it here:

 

[Rich Stidger]

It could also be a "dead" spot on the starter commutator. The next time it happens, give the starter a smack with a block of wood and a hammer. If it starts on the very next try, it is probably the starter.

While you are sailing the hull vibration could cause the starter to move a very tiny bit and locate itself on a dead spot. The fix is usually new brushes. Not a big deal assuming that you can get the starter out easily

 

[Dan]

hmmm! This could be the answer to a problem that's been troubling me since I got my boat. The alarm doesn't even sound when I turn the ignition on. I have to try a number of times to get that to happen. Would that also be a symptom of the relay problem?

 

[Jeff D]

Relay

I put in a relay and it has worked fine. Unfortunately, I also had a bad starter but got one of these and it works fine if you ever need one.


http://www.motorcityreman.com/yaoe122.html

 

[gmeyerga]

starter problems

Common Hunter problem. Too much voltage loss in starter button circuit. Modify wiring so that this starter button circuit actuates an additional (small) solenoid to power up existing starter motor solenoid! Wiring diagram somewhere in the archives on this forum. It worked for me!

I, too, have starter problems. Repeated attempts produce clicks
until the starter comes to life. But before I rewire anything I have a couple of questions:
1) If there is too much voltage loss in the starter button circuit
could/would a failed attempt at least produce a click sound?
2) Why does the starter work after several failed attempts.
The circuitry has not changed, and any flat spots on the
commutator have not been repositioned.

 

[Paul Mermelstein]

Re: starter problems

I helped a friend "fix" his similar problem on his Hunter. Same symptoms. Turned out to be a slightly corroded connection on the starter solenoid, coming from the switch. Removed it, cleaned, works fine. To be sure, you could also replace the crimped on spade connection with a new one.

 

[Neil McDonald]

I, too, have starter problems. Repeated attempts produce clicks
until the starter comes to life. But before I rewire anything I have a couple of questions:
1) If there is too much voltage loss in the starter button circuit
could/would a failed attempt at least produce a click sound?
2) Why does the starter work after several failed attempts.
The circuitry has not changed, and any flat spots on the
commutator have not been repositioned.

If you hear a click, it could come come from the main solenoid trying to make a sufficiently solid contact internally that it can provide adequate power to the starter motor. If the actuating circuit has low voltage it may still pull this contact over but not push it hard enough to properly make the circuit. It could also be the starter motor engaging but not getting enough power to turn the engine - all for the same reason. If there is no click, then there is not enough voltage reaching the solenoid to do anything!

Repeated starting attempts will create heat at poor wiring connections on the starter circuit which then lowers the resistance, which in turn increases the voltage and solves the immediate problem. My theories anyway!

 

[Stu Jackson]

Good ideas, here. One addition...

...do you have a fuse in the circuit? If so the fuse holder could be dying a slow death. If so, either replace the fuse holder or install a breaker.

 

[Benny]

Same condition but no concern. I have not checked and probably will not but it must be a drop in voltage on the the low voltage selenoid circuit perhaps due to a loose or corroded conection. I figure it evers get to an emergency I can always cross the high voltage connectors on the starter. Has not happened in the past two years.

 

[Squeezie]

Its the starter

If you search the archives you'll see a long string of comments on this common problem. The starter starts to go dead on the first try when hot, eventually requiring many tries. Sooner or later it will not work at all!. Many people have recognized that the starter button circuit is marginal and solved the problem by rewiring to a heavier guage wire or adding an additional relay. The real problem however is that your starter/solonoid is beginning to fail. I had exactly the same issue with this engine and solved it positively by replacing the starter. Be sure to use a yanmar part as some of the 'equivalent' starters sold on ebay have the connections in a rotated orientation and your wiring harness will not reach with them. A new starter will fix it positively without redesigning the yanmar electrical circuit. (You may need a few long extentions on your socket wrench to get enough clearance on the handle to torque out the bolts.)

The starter button on my Yanmar 2GM20F (Hunter 320) continues to vex me.

Last year I replaced the OME button as worn out.
Cleaned all connections at batteries and engine ground.
All the leads are tight as well. No corrosion anywhere.
(Except behind starter panel, said to be for lights only.)
The starter itself is just fine, supposedly bulletproof.

It starts up just fine but after sailing all day it takes four pushes to catch.
The first three make no connection, no clicking sound or anything.
What could it be? Does it matter? Thanks.

 

[Dan Johnson]

Beg to differ...

with Squeezie, but the starter solenoid is rarely at fault in this situation and is not likely to be failing. Your situation appears to be an exception.

The actual problem is voltage drop between the starter button and the solenoid, not "excess voltage" as someone pointed out. The universal fix is to use a relay tripped by the original wiring to carry the heavier current in appropriately sized wire from the battery terminal on the starter to the solenoid lug. A Radio Shack 30 amp relay for under ten dollars has been the economical solution. Auto starter solenoids and horn relays are just as effective but much more pricey.

Three new, short pieces of wire and an in-line fuse are all that's needed and would hardly be considered "redesigning" the starter circuit any more than any other boat modification would be. This solution has been applied to Universal, Westerbeke, and other diesel installations in boats other than the Hunter/Yanmar configuration with equal success.

 

[tommays]

The slave solenoid has been standard on powerboats (over 20 years) to resolve this problem

Even a 19' powerboat could have 30' of small wire to and from the keyswitch to drop the voltage to low to run a starter solenoid

 

[larryw]

Lots of opinions here. my boat isn't a Hunter and the engine isn't a Yanmar, but I had the same problem with my Beneteau/Perkins and the problem was corroded contacts in the key switch.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Just so, Larry, he's got two things to check and one potential additional installation to do with the starter circuit solenoid, ahead of him!

 

[Rick]

Deadline I also had same problem. First I ran a heavier guage wire. Worked "pretty" good. Next I did Ed (thanks again Ed)'s solution. Followed it to the T with a starter relay from my marine yanmar dealer ( I went ahead and ponied up the extra bucks, 32$). It works, works, works no matter where the perko switches are it works, works. I also completely disagree with Squeezie unless money is not an object.

Cheers