Splicing Nut

Ross · Jan 13, 2009

Jerry , I have never used one but your rope is also a plastic polymer.

Calif. Ted · Jan 13, 2009

Also never used one, but do you think it's better than a bowline ?

gfrazzle · Jan 13, 2009

Jerry,

I have used them to attach the sheets to the clew on my roller furling 140 Jenny. No problems in a year close hauled in up to 20+ knot winds. I use bowlines for my halyard shackles.

Roger Long · Jan 13, 2009

gfrazzle said:
I use bowlines for my halyard shackles.

A Buntline Hitch

http://www.animatedknots.com/buntlineboating/index.php

is more compact and designed for the job. It's easy to tie, just a slip loop made with a clove hitch on the standing part and pulled tight. You can even get the shackle closer to the block than with many splices.

It's a very useful knot that I use many places.

Prime Time · Jan 13, 2009

Have used them

I have used them for halyards, vang, outhaul and topping lift for 2 seasons. They are not as strong as a splice but are easier. For my purposes, are sufficiently strong.No problems whatsoever.

catsailor · Jan 13, 2009

You can bet the line was sized for stretch and not breaking strength

It will not fail in the knot - it will fail elsewhere due to chafe. On small boats lines just aren't loaded that much.

A bowline is also a very weak knot... but it is easy to tie and to untie, and 90% of the time, good enough.

An entertaining exercise with knots is to take some weak twine, tie different knots in each end, and see which fails first. It will always be the bowline.

newly anonymous · Jan 13, 2009

with all due respect...

Roger Long said:
A Buntline Hitch

...a buntline hitch is an evil knot. The only way to untie one is with a blowtorch, two pair of vicegrips, a heavy marlinspike and a hacksaw. As an emergency way to tie on a halyard shackle, okay, but only in mid-ocean during an up-the-mast emergency. As a way to attach a sheet to a clew? NEVER!

Roger Long · Jan 14, 2009

newly anonymous said:
As a way to attach a sheet to a clew? NEVER!

Agreed. But it is a good way to attach a rope to a shackle in a situation where your might otherwise use a splice (that will also have to be cut out if it's double braid). Shackle end renewal on a halyard will usually require removing a foot or so of rope anyway.

I don't use them for direct attachement where there are heavy repeated loads and I need to undo them frequently. However, most places where you want a tight compact knot that is only untied once a season, they work very well.

sailingdog · Jan 14, 2009

I like the buntline hitch for the halyard-to-shackle connection, but it isn't going to be one that you untie anytime soon. It is a compact and very reliable knot with good strength.

I'm not a big fan of gimmicks, like the splicing nut, since the plastic can be UV-damaged and then the splicing nut may fail with little warning.

Franklin · Jan 14, 2009

The splicing nut is not a strong connection. Many knots are stronger. What makes a knot weak is the binding/pinching points. This device has a 180 tight bend (http://shop.catalinaowners.com/detail.htm?fno=20&group=1200&cat=1637) in it giving it a weak point.

If you are lazy and don't like tieing knots, buy one, but definately don't buy one thinking it's stronger than a knot.

Franklin · Jan 14, 2009

A bowline knot is not all that weak for a knot. It does have two fairly sharp bends but it's not too bad.

http://users.mo-net.com/district8WR/members/knots/knot_str.htm

catsailor · Jan 14, 2009

The Figure 8, Flemish Bend, and Double Fishermans are all 80%+

The Flemish bend is really a trace figure 8.

Not as compact as a bowline, they are not too bad to untie and do not share the bowline's potential to work loose. Rock climber stand-bys.

Useful if you want a big fat knot to grab on to.

Ross · Jan 14, 2009

catsailor said:
The Flemish bend is really a trace figure 8.

Not as compact as a bowline, they are not too bad to untie and do not share the bowline's potential to work loose. Rock climber stand-bys.

Useful if you want a big fat knot to grab on to.

How would you use that to attach a line to a shackle?

catsailor · Jan 14, 2009

I have used a Figure 8 on a bight with a kevlar main halyard...

Ross said:
How would you use that to attach a line to a shackle?

The stuff was so stiff a bowline did not set well, but that was 15 years ago. I did not mean a figure 8 stopper knot.

The bends were mentioned in my post only to illustrate stronger knot types that are commonly used. I'm not sure of the strength of the buntiline hitch, but I am fairly sure it is 80% or so as well.

Ross · Jan 15, 2009

Another hitch that hasn't been mentioned here is the tried and proven anchor bend.
http://www.animatedknots.com/anchor/index.php?LogoImage=LogoGrog.jpg&Website=www.animatedknots.com

Maine Sail · Jan 15, 2009

catsailor said:
Not as compact as a bowline, they are not too bad to untie and do not share the bowline's potential to work loose.

Potential to work loose? Jeeze I must be doing something wrong

because in 35+/- years and literally thousands of nm I have yet to see even one bowline I tied work loose. I've used them on jib, genny, spin sheets that all flog and flail during tacks, dinghy painters and many, many other applications for years. My halyards are always spliced.. The key with a bowline is that you can actually un-tie it. How many of the other knots will come undone after a day, summer or year of sailing? Buntlines are great knots and easy to tie but try swapping genny sheets to the 100 from the 150..

Perhaps others have had one work loose but if you leave a little tail I think it is very, very unlikely. Never happened to me and the bowline is one of my most used knots when I want to be able to untie it.

We once towed a 35 foot sport fishing boat 15nm using a bowline in 3-4 foot seas and about 20 knots of wind. When we got to the dock we simply untied the bowline and retrieved our line..

How many of you guys have had a bowline come loose? I'm now a little curious??

Paul J. Rusyniak · Jan 15, 2009

Maine Sail said:
How many of you guys have had a bowline come loose? I'm now a little curious??

Properly tied, NEVER!

Ross · Jan 15, 2009

Sometimes a bowline is improperly tied with the tail to the outside where it can snag and cause the knot to spill. I have had them pulled too tight and very difficult to untie but never on the farm, at work or on the boat have I known one to shake loose.

Warren Milberg · Jan 15, 2009

I'm a splicing nut... I like to splice, and tie knots and hitches. Learning to do these nautical tasks adds a lot of satisfaction to the sport. But if I didn't have the time or tools on hand to splice a halyard shackle, I, too would opt for the buntline hitch. The fact that I may not be able to untie it at some later date wouldn't matter as you can't untie a splice either.

Not too long ago, "Good Old Boat" ran an article about how people connect their sheets to the headsail. I was astounded at the many choices listed. But more astounding was the comment that the bowline was a bad choice. Like a number of you here, I've used bowlines for a lot of years to tie my sheets to the genoa and never once had one come loose. I could see using the "Splicing Nut" for something like setting fenders, but not for something as serious as a main halyard....