I should preface this by saying I am still very much a beginner. Yesterday I took my H260 out on the lake in 18-20 winds, only used the jib. Things were going pretty well, so I sent my crew down into the cabin to make drinks. Next thing I know we're spinning around in the lake like a top!!! Pretty scary. I'm still not sure what I did wrong. Anyway, obviously we recovered, and spent the rest of the day doing pretty well. In fact it turned out to be an awesome day. Has anyone had something like this happen? Is it possible to tip this boat over?
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Ike Cook
Cow in the bow
no offense to any of your crew, but my friends refer to that circumstance as "too much cow in the bow", another words, too much weight in the bow. If you were a fish looking up at your boat when the crew went forward, you would see that the wetted perimeter of your boat was probably cut to 2/3rds. Therefore you would loose control as the effectiveness of your rudder was also decreased. With the transom lifting slightly out of the water, the wind would catch it and spin you around like a top. Is the H26 water ballasted? I'm sure somebody that has an h26 could give you more insight, but I'm pretty sure it has to do with weight placement. It also depends on which point of sail you were headed. Usually with only the jib up you can only effectivly sail on a beam reach, broad reach or running, otherwise you could spin out of your bearing (so-to-speak). Bring the cooler to the cockpit, then you never have to leave. You can always tell onlookers that you were practicing your MOB drills. Ike 'Freebie'
no offense to any of your crew, but my friends refer to that circumstance as "too much cow in the bow", another words, too much weight in the bow. If you were a fish looking up at your boat when the crew went forward, you would see that the wetted perimeter of your boat was probably cut to 2/3rds. Therefore you would loose control as the effectiveness of your rudder was also decreased. With the transom lifting slightly out of the water, the wind would catch it and spin you around like a top. Is the H26 water ballasted? I'm sure somebody that has an h26 could give you more insight, but I'm pretty sure it has to do with weight placement. It also depends on which point of sail you were headed. Usually with only the jib up you can only effectivly sail on a beam reach, broad reach or running, otherwise you could spin out of your bearing (so-to-speak). Bring the cooler to the cockpit, then you never have to leave. You can always tell onlookers that you were practicing your MOB drills. Ike 'Freebie'
Better balance!
Mary: I would think that these fractional rigs are more suited to sailing with a reefed main only before a jib only configuration. As far as tipping one of these boat over, I think that you are going to heel over 40-45 deg and spill mostl of your wind out of the sail/sails. The boat will then get excessive weather helm which is going to drive you pretty much into the wind. Then the cycle will start over again until you reef down. I have not sailed on one of these water ballasted boats so I'm not sure what they are going to REALLY do.
Mary: I would think that these fractional rigs are more suited to sailing with a reefed main only before a jib only configuration. As far as tipping one of these boat over, I think that you are going to heel over 40-45 deg and spill mostl of your wind out of the sail/sails. The boat will then get excessive weather helm which is going to drive you pretty much into the wind. Then the cycle will start over again until you reef down. I have not sailed on one of these water ballasted boats so I'm not sure what they are going to REALLY do.
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Paul Housman
Mary, We have a water ballast H26.Sail on a rather large lake in Kentucky. Took her out the other day in 15 mph winds gusting to 20. With full sail we heeled 30 degrees plus and due to lack of attention on my part broached a couple of times. This week we went out winds 10-15 but we reefed the sail. made a big difference. Wasn't as exciting but we had more control. the water ballast boats heel quicker than the lead keel jobs. When we were heeled over 30 degrees never felt like the boat was going to flip. She just points her self into the wind. Can't help you with why the spinning maybe somebody plugged the blender in to make cocktails? Paul H S/V Linda Belle
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Alan
Like They Said.....
Using the headsail only will give "lee helm" that is cause the boat to head down wind. If when pushed further down wind the sheets are not adjusted (let out)then you would be pushed even faster. You cease to sail and are spun around. It seems like it might be easier to sail with jib only but as pointed out it is not. The mail sail reefed may be a better choice because if over powered or over sheeted will tend to point towards the wind depowering it. The boat will heel hard but tend to point towards the weather (that is wind). In these boats and most others it is easier to ease (let out) the main sheet also. And do ease the sheet instead of turing into the wind first to reduce heel as not doing so will cause you to heel even more (that is how I almost got knocked down and yes any boat can tip). I sail with the jib only when in situations where I want to go slow, don't need to sail close to the wind and need to furl quickly such as when practicing docking without a motor. One other important item. CHECK THE RUDDER. Those on the 26/260 are notorious for partially kicking up reducing control. Have fun. alan
Using the headsail only will give "lee helm" that is cause the boat to head down wind. If when pushed further down wind the sheets are not adjusted (let out)then you would be pushed even faster. You cease to sail and are spun around. It seems like it might be easier to sail with jib only but as pointed out it is not. The mail sail reefed may be a better choice because if over powered or over sheeted will tend to point towards the wind depowering it. The boat will heel hard but tend to point towards the weather (that is wind). In these boats and most others it is easier to ease (let out) the main sheet also. And do ease the sheet instead of turing into the wind first to reduce heel as not doing so will cause you to heel even more (that is how I almost got knocked down and yes any boat can tip). I sail with the jib only when in situations where I want to go slow, don't need to sail close to the wind and need to furl quickly such as when practicing docking without a motor. One other important item. CHECK THE RUDDER. Those on the 26/260 are notorious for partially kicking up reducing control. Have fun. alan
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Chris Haraway
A rite of passage...
I suspect that most of us have furiously spun around for the joy of onlookers at least once. We have an 18.5 and sail in 15-20kt winds frequently. The best advice I can give is to reef the main and keep the mainsheet uncleated in your gloved hand. You'll get the hang of it. After a few powerful centrifuge tests, we are now able to heel our baby over on short notice without undue alarm. It's exciting and educational to place your boat on the edge in controlled situations. Try something else a few times...in very light winds, with full, *very* close-hauled sails, let go of the tiller. You'll learn a lot about your boat.
I suspect that most of us have furiously spun around for the joy of onlookers at least once. We have an 18.5 and sail in 15-20kt winds frequently. The best advice I can give is to reef the main and keep the mainsheet uncleated in your gloved hand. You'll get the hang of it. After a few powerful centrifuge tests, we are now able to heel our baby over on short notice without undue alarm. It's exciting and educational to place your boat on the edge in controlled situations. Try something else a few times...in very light winds, with full, *very* close-hauled sails, let go of the tiller. You'll learn a lot about your boat.
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Todd Steffen
Yep
I Agree with those who say reef the main and try to avoid sailing on the jib alone. The Problem with sailing jib alone in higher wind situations (on the H-26) is that the jib is trying to turn your boat toward downwind. Your rudder counteracts this (most of the time) ... the rudder can only produce a finite amount of counter-active force based on boat speed, rudder size, and angle of heel. As the boat heels, the rudder becomes less effective. If you can imagine the angle on the rudder, it's now using some of it's potential in a helpful direction (left or right) and some of the potential in a useless direction (up or down). If the "jib force" exceeds the "rudder force," the jib force wins and the boat does a loopty loop. I too have experienced the thrill of out of control boating (my first summer on our 95' H-26). You'll no doubt get better at "feeling" when it may be time to reconfigure the boat so that doesn't happen. Or maybe you'll start to enjoy the "boatabatics" and open an adventure thrill ride company. Good boating!!!
I Agree with those who say reef the main and try to avoid sailing on the jib alone. The Problem with sailing jib alone in higher wind situations (on the H-26) is that the jib is trying to turn your boat toward downwind. Your rudder counteracts this (most of the time) ... the rudder can only produce a finite amount of counter-active force based on boat speed, rudder size, and angle of heel. As the boat heels, the rudder becomes less effective. If you can imagine the angle on the rudder, it's now using some of it's potential in a helpful direction (left or right) and some of the potential in a useless direction (up or down). If the "jib force" exceeds the "rudder force," the jib force wins and the boat does a loopty loop. I too have experienced the thrill of out of control boating (my first summer on our 95' H-26). You'll no doubt get better at "feeling" when it may be time to reconfigure the boat so that doesn't happen. Or maybe you'll start to enjoy the "boatabatics" and open an adventure thrill ride company. Good boating!!!
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Frank
Boat Drinks
Your mistake is: "so I sent my crew down into the cabin to make drinks". If the wind is more than 10 then have drinks already handy in the cockpit cooler. Even spilled beer makes a horrible mess below decks. Hope you didn't spill too much. I have such a bad record as far as drinks are concerned that I have cut myself off until the boat is put to bed for the night.
Your mistake is: "so I sent my crew down into the cabin to make drinks". If the wind is more than 10 then have drinks already handy in the cockpit cooler. Even spilled beer makes a horrible mess below decks. Hope you didn't spill too much. I have such a bad record as far as drinks are concerned that I have cut myself off until the boat is put to bed for the night.
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Jerry Gerber
Make sure your rudder is all the way down and fastened securely so that it won't work its way back up. When the rudder is not vertical and there is a lot of wind, it is very hard to control. It will cause you to cross the wind and "spin like a top".
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Ken Shubert
Margaritas with a PFD?
These lakes in the plains never have a steady wind. Only gusts! I've found the H23.5 sails better with balanced main and jib. A reefed main and maybe even the storm-jib if too gusty. I've been 'asleep at the helm' when a gust caught me and heeled so far that the jib layed on the water. That's very close to a 'knock down', but things righted themselves in what seemed like an eternity. The boat & rigging will stand up to it but the worst problem is being thrown over board. The PFD is not really a joke. Also-- check the rudder. Ken S/V Wouff Hong
These lakes in the plains never have a steady wind. Only gusts! I've found the H23.5 sails better with balanced main and jib. A reefed main and maybe even the storm-jib if too gusty. I've been 'asleep at the helm' when a gust caught me and heeled so far that the jib layed on the water. That's very close to a 'knock down', but things righted themselves in what seemed like an eternity. The boat & rigging will stand up to it but the worst problem is being thrown over board. The PFD is not really a joke. Also-- check the rudder. Ken S/V Wouff Hong
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