My boat does not have one. I have been considering the installation of a mechanical float type because I'm only interested in full/half/"empty stupid" type readings. Does anyone know if these work and what the success rate is for drilling a 2" hole in a plastic fuel tank without getting the cuttings into the fuel, and not having a leak around the gauge when the tank is full or the fuel is sloshing? Actually, a dipstick would work for my purposes but I'd still have to drill a hole and install some type of cap because there are 2 right angle turns in my filler hose and I can't figure out how to make an articulating dip stick.
speaking of fuel gauges (another post)
- Thread starter Bill C320 Papillon
- Start date
- Status
Bill, just bite the bullet, it won't hurt much.
You don't say how old your tank is, but if you are cutting a hole in the tank, you might as well put in an inspection port too and clean the tank properly. Then you'll know that your fuel tank is full and clean. Both are just as important.
You don't say how old your tank is, but if you are cutting a hole in the tank, you might as well put in an inspection port too and clean the tank properly. Then you'll know that your fuel tank is full and clean. Both are just as important.
Why bother
Bill If you know how many gallons your tank holds, and you know your average fuel consumption, and you either have an engine hour meter or can keep track of hours run, why bother with a fuel gage? Stu
Bill If you know how many gallons your tank holds, and you know your average fuel consumption, and you either have an engine hour meter or can keep track of hours run, why bother with a fuel gage? Stu
Stu and Fred
Thanks for your responses. Fred, an inspection plate would solve my problem but the question remains, how do you install one? Stu,I know how much the tank holds but I have no idea about fuel consumption rate. I lake sail and only use the engine in and out of the Marina or occasionally when the weather doesn't cooperate. Keeping track (no hour meter either) of a few minutes hear and a half hour there seems pretty labor intensive. In order to figure fuel consumption rate, I'd have to be able to run the engine for a known amount of time (no problem) and somehow measure the change in the level in the tank (problem). Unless there is some industry standard consumption estimate for a Perkins M-20 engine, I'm not sure how else to do it.
Thanks for your responses. Fred, an inspection plate would solve my problem but the question remains, how do you install one? Stu,I know how much the tank holds but I have no idea about fuel consumption rate. I lake sail and only use the engine in and out of the Marina or occasionally when the weather doesn't cooperate. Keeping track (no hour meter either) of a few minutes hear and a half hour there seems pretty labor intensive. In order to figure fuel consumption rate, I'd have to be able to run the engine for a known amount of time (no problem) and somehow measure the change in the level in the tank (problem). Unless there is some industry standard consumption estimate for a Perkins M-20 engine, I'm not sure how else to do it.
(another post)
Stu I dont guess you have a fuel guage in your car or truck either. Some people like to just look at a guage to get some kinda idea on how much fuel they have, while not wanting to get out the calculator.
Stu I dont guess you have a fuel guage in your car or truck either. Some people like to just look at a guage to get some kinda idea on how much fuel they have, while not wanting to get out the calculator.
In support of Stu and others
I had a 1980 Watkins 27 sailboat for years and it never had a fuel gauge. And I will admit it is nice to have one but its not absolutely necessary. It had a Yanmar 2QM15 engine that sipped fuel so it was easy to get lazy and not check the fuel, but I found it wasn't a major strain to just fill up "when I could". The one time I let it go, it ended up being late in the season (Sept/Oct) and I didn't fill her and I ran out of fuel coming into the harbor. I kept a 6 gallon tank on board as a spare and went to refill it and the nozzle came out. OOPS....deisel all over. MAN, I never knew deisel fuel was that slippery, it was like skating on ice. But since sailboats don't use that much fuel and if you just "fill up when you can", its not that mandatory to have a gauge. In fact most fuel gauges are not that accurate -- but I do agree they are better than nothing
I had a 1980 Watkins 27 sailboat for years and it never had a fuel gauge. And I will admit it is nice to have one but its not absolutely necessary. It had a Yanmar 2QM15 engine that sipped fuel so it was easy to get lazy and not check the fuel, but I found it wasn't a major strain to just fill up "when I could". The one time I let it go, it ended up being late in the season (Sept/Oct) and I didn't fill her and I ran out of fuel coming into the harbor. I kept a 6 gallon tank on board as a spare and went to refill it and the nozzle came out. OOPS....deisel all over. MAN, I never knew deisel fuel was that slippery, it was like skating on ice. But since sailboats don't use that much fuel and if you just "fill up when you can", its not that mandatory to have a gauge. In fact most fuel gauges are not that accurate -- but I do agree they are better than nothing
No sweat
If you are not running your diesel 15 min. or so out AND back, to and from your slip, to get it up to operating temp., you're not treating it right anyway and it'll "coke up" on you sooner than later. Top off fuel tank, log your engine use for 6-10 hours, determine how much it takes to fill back up, divide gallons by time and...no sweat... you have an approximation of consumption. You really need to get a diesel up to operating temp. and higher on a regular basis as well as running it at 70-80% or more of it's capacity or you're asking for trouble.
If you are not running your diesel 15 min. or so out AND back, to and from your slip, to get it up to operating temp., you're not treating it right anyway and it'll "coke up" on you sooner than later. Top off fuel tank, log your engine use for 6-10 hours, determine how much it takes to fill back up, divide gallons by time and...no sweat... you have an approximation of consumption. You really need to get a diesel up to operating temp. and higher on a regular basis as well as running it at 70-80% or more of it's capacity or you're asking for trouble.
Dip Stick Fuel Gauge
I installed a 12 gallon permanent tank under the motor well on our 26S. After a vallant try to get the factory provided gauge to work I gave up and now use a wood dowel to check the relative level. 12 Gallons lasts a long time on a sailboat (even with a 2 stroke motor) and I have not been motivated to buy a new gauge and try to make the sending unit work. I agree it would be nice to have one, but given the relative need, I think it is highly overrated. BTY, I have had sending units on car/trucks go bad and have got by for years using the trip odometer to mentally calculate fuel levels against a baseline MPG. Steve <>< _/)
I installed a 12 gallon permanent tank under the motor well on our 26S. After a vallant try to get the factory provided gauge to work I gave up and now use a wood dowel to check the relative level. 12 Gallons lasts a long time on a sailboat (even with a 2 stroke motor) and I have not been motivated to buy a new gauge and try to make the sending unit work. I agree it would be nice to have one, but given the relative need, I think it is highly overrated. BTY, I have had sending units on car/trucks go bad and have got by for years using the trip odometer to mentally calculate fuel levels against a baseline MPG. Steve <>< _/)
Attachments
Fuel Measuring
Mark's right: measure how much you put in after you run the engine, not really important to know how much your tank holds. Phantom: I appreciate your jest. Just for kicks, I ignore looking at the fuel gage in my car, and when I get to 250 miles on the trip odometer, I fill up, because the car runs for 252 miles on a full tank.
Actually, the work required to repair the fuel gage and/or sender on my boat just isn't worth it to me, both for cost and effort. The senders don't last long, which is why we keep seeing the "how do I fix my fuel gage" questions on this and other 'sites. I use less than 1/2 gallon per hour, I have a 23 gallon tank. I "fill up" every twenty hours or so with about 10 gallons. The emptier a tank is the more chance there is to get condensation, so I keep it no more than half empty. Been working for 6 years now, never ever came close to runnin' on empty. Records show I "fill up" every 3 to 5 months. Guys, it's not that hard to figure, especially when we use such (relatively) little fuel. Then, of course, there is the opposite side of the story, where incredible amounts of time and energy have gone into trying to figure how to use a fuel gauge with an uneven shaped tank. Have you read the recent Mainsheet? It's amazing how much study went into figuring out how much fuel was left when the gauge said 3/16th but the tank was "only" 2/227ths. Sheez... All in fun, and interesting, but easier to simply keep it mostly full. Why even bother to stretch it at all? I know it's a sailboat, but how can you forget to fuel up on a reasonably regular basis? (whether that's every two months or every six months or so, which may be an even easier way to remember - think about it.... (OK, Tom, I'm not perfect, nor am I pointing fingers at you or anyone else, shoot, it sometimes happens to all of us.) Bill: I just made up a simple spreadsheet when I first got the boat that tracks fuel usage and calculates gallons per hour and hours per gallon, not very difficult to keep track of. Even if the gauge worked, I was interested in knowing the fuel consumption. (email me at sec@c34.org and I'll send you a copy with the formulas) If you know how many minutes you use the engine going in and out, so say half an hour per sail. Four weekends a month, 2 hours. Close enough. Marc's idea to run your engine some more makes a lot of sense. The ref link covers some earlier discussions about this. Stu
Mark's right: measure how much you put in after you run the engine, not really important to know how much your tank holds. Phantom: I appreciate your jest. Just for kicks, I ignore looking at the fuel gage in my car, and when I get to 250 miles on the trip odometer, I fill up, because the car runs for 252 miles on a full tank.
Actually, the work required to repair the fuel gage and/or sender on my boat just isn't worth it to me, both for cost and effort. The senders don't last long, which is why we keep seeing the "how do I fix my fuel gage" questions on this and other 'sites. I use less than 1/2 gallon per hour, I have a 23 gallon tank. I "fill up" every twenty hours or so with about 10 gallons. The emptier a tank is the more chance there is to get condensation, so I keep it no more than half empty. Been working for 6 years now, never ever came close to runnin' on empty. Records show I "fill up" every 3 to 5 months. Guys, it's not that hard to figure, especially when we use such (relatively) little fuel. Then, of course, there is the opposite side of the story, where incredible amounts of time and energy have gone into trying to figure how to use a fuel gauge with an uneven shaped tank. Have you read the recent Mainsheet? It's amazing how much study went into figuring out how much fuel was left when the gauge said 3/16th but the tank was "only" 2/227ths. Sheez... All in fun, and interesting, but easier to simply keep it mostly full. Why even bother to stretch it at all? I know it's a sailboat, but how can you forget to fuel up on a reasonably regular basis? (whether that's every two months or every six months or so, which may be an even easier way to remember - think about it.... (OK, Tom, I'm not perfect, nor am I pointing fingers at you or anyone else, shoot, it sometimes happens to all of us.) Bill: I just made up a simple spreadsheet when I first got the boat that tracks fuel usage and calculates gallons per hour and hours per gallon, not very difficult to keep track of. Even if the gauge worked, I was interested in knowing the fuel consumption. (email me at sec@c34.org and I'll send you a copy with the formulas) If you know how many minutes you use the engine going in and out, so say half an hour per sail. Four weekends a month, 2 hours. Close enough. Marc's idea to run your engine some more makes a lot of sense. The ref link covers some earlier discussions about this. StuAn alternative is
to use the Snake river Acugage system. It consists on two aluminum tapes that are attached vertically to the outside of the tank. It works well enough and a unit can be used to monitor more than one tank in your boat (water, waste etc.). They sell them at WM but call Sanke River Electronics first to get the proper sensor for fuel. They also have cheaper/simpler versions than those sold at WM.
to use the Snake river Acugage system. It consists on two aluminum tapes that are attached vertically to the outside of the tank. It works well enough and a unit can be used to monitor more than one tank in your boat (water, waste etc.). They sell them at WM but call Sanke River Electronics first to get the proper sensor for fuel. They also have cheaper/simpler versions than those sold at WM.
$.25 'tap-sounding' on the outside....
After musing with some fellow sailors over another that ran out of diesel in his brand new boat I got to wondering why I had run most of the summer and hadn't gotten below a half tank on the gage. I ran tappity-tap down the outside of mine with a coin to find only an inch or two left in my 20-gallon aluminum tank....quite an eye opener to realize that the gage that I'd blindly believed stopped registering below half.
After musing with some fellow sailors over another that ran out of diesel in his brand new boat I got to wondering why I had run most of the summer and hadn't gotten below a half tank on the gage. I ran tappity-tap down the outside of mine with a coin to find only an inch or two left in my 20-gallon aluminum tank....quite an eye opener to realize that the gage that I'd blindly believed stopped registering below half.
More Input
Dale Glad you checked. So much for blind belief. It just occurred to me that the difference between cars and boats in fuel gages is that boat gages are a lot less dependable. If you read the referenced links in my last post above, one of them describes the way the senders on boats work. Because boats aren't used so much, and because they still tend to move slightly at the dock when unattended (unlike stationary cars), the senders wear out, thus making the gages useless. That's another reason I keep track of the engine hours. The Snake River gages are more sophisticated, but also more expensive. Your boat, your choice, your bucks. Stu
Dale Glad you checked. So much for blind belief. It just occurred to me that the difference between cars and boats in fuel gages is that boat gages are a lot less dependable. If you read the referenced links in my last post above, one of them describes the way the senders on boats work. Because boats aren't used so much, and because they still tend to move slightly at the dock when unattended (unlike stationary cars), the senders wear out, thus making the gages useless. That's another reason I keep track of the engine hours. The Snake River gages are more sophisticated, but also more expensive. Your boat, your choice, your bucks. Stu
- Status