well this came up at work the other day when my boss asked me " If you were sailing really far away from land, like a week or two from anywhere, and your wife was with you, and she like died, what would you do with her?" Well my initial response was fairly matter of fact in that, after rigor had set, and she was blue, and i knew for sure that she was dead , well i'd wrap her up and toss her overboard. well everybody laughed(because we work together and she was standing behind me) but then we kind of got to thinking , well what if a crew died . what would you do . of course the basics of a new anchor or make sure the arm is up for a cupholder came to mind ,but after the gaiety waned we wonderd what are the legal ramifications of a death on board . anyway the matter became a bit more serious. so i told them at the risk of being banned for life on this, my favorite message board , i would write and see what you all think, so folks your crew just died on board what would you or should you do? the serious and of course the humorous welcome. thanks tim
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If you're THAT far offshore...
...then I'd assume you had some means of long-haul communications- SSB, Satellite phone, something- so the first course of action would be to call the authorities in the nearest port, and ask for assistance and/or instructions. Just my $.02. --Jon Bastien H25 'Adagio'
...then I'd assume you had some means of long-haul communications- SSB, Satellite phone, something- so the first course of action would be to call the authorities in the nearest port, and ask for assistance and/or instructions. Just my $.02. --Jon Bastien H25 'Adagio'
Yo, Ho Ho and a Barrel of Rum
In the great days of sail they used to preserve the corpse -- at least that of the captain -- in a cask of spirits. I for one have neither cask nor sufficient spirits on board should they be needed for this purpose... Mike Turner S/V Amith
In the great days of sail they used to preserve the corpse -- at least that of the captain -- in a cask of spirits. I for one have neither cask nor sufficient spirits on board should they be needed for this purpose... Mike Turner S/V Amith
What a waste of good drink
Is it true that Lord Nelsons' men drank the spirts from the keg that carried his remains back to England? A burial at see would be ok with me, especially in the tropics. Russell Egge S/V Allie Kat
Is it true that Lord Nelsons' men drank the spirts from the keg that carried his remains back to England? A burial at see would be ok with me, especially in the tropics. Russell Egge S/V Allie Kat
You Better Have A Body
For the authorities to autopsy, or you could be facing some good awful accusations about her demise. Remember in "Weekend at Bernies", when the corpse got towed behind the boat, well...
For the authorities to autopsy, or you could be facing some good awful accusations about her demise. Remember in "Weekend at Bernies", when the corpse got towed behind the boat, well...
In international waters, the skipper rules
That probably means a burial at sea, especially in the tropics. The trouble starts when you get to port, where the authorities can detain you as a murder suspect. Peter S/V Raven
That probably means a burial at sea, especially in the tropics. The trouble starts when you get to port, where the authorities can detain you as a murder suspect. Peter S/V Raven
Sea Burial
If I were close to port (and alone) then I would make for port and document the death. If I had another crew member (or alone and far from port) then I would do a sea burial. It would probably take some explaining, however s*** happens............
If I were close to port (and alone) then I would make for port and document the death. If I had another crew member (or alone and far from port) then I would do a sea burial. It would probably take some explaining, however s*** happens............
My 2 Cents
Since I have some experience here I thought I'd weigh in. As a homicide detective for the Mass. State Police I'd say that if someone dies on your vessel you should call the coast guard via ssb or vhf. They will dispatch a helicopter or sea vessel to remove the body. The port or airport location the body is remove to has jurisdiction over the death investigation. This happens all the time here in New England when a fisherman dies out to sea. There have been time where during extremely rough weather we don't begin our investigation into the death until the body makes it to shore, which can take some time. Fishing boats can of course store the body on ice, but that doesn't do the sailors here much good since the little ice we have is needed for our cocktails! In all seriousness, I would never condsider a burial at sea. The after affects of that decision could haunt you for a long time. Sorry didn't mean to get so serious, and let's hope we never meet on a professional basis!!! Sail Safe! Bob Knott H380
Since I have some experience here I thought I'd weigh in. As a homicide detective for the Mass. State Police I'd say that if someone dies on your vessel you should call the coast guard via ssb or vhf. They will dispatch a helicopter or sea vessel to remove the body. The port or airport location the body is remove to has jurisdiction over the death investigation. This happens all the time here in New England when a fisherman dies out to sea. There have been time where during extremely rough weather we don't begin our investigation into the death until the body makes it to shore, which can take some time. Fishing boats can of course store the body on ice, but that doesn't do the sailors here much good since the little ice we have is needed for our cocktails! In all seriousness, I would never condsider a burial at sea. The after affects of that decision could haunt you for a long time. Sorry didn't mean to get so serious, and let's hope we never meet on a professional basis!!! Sail Safe! Bob Knott H380
thanks bob
yes after some thought the scenerio is a bit odd to just end up with a body on board. it seems that during a medical emergency leading to death that i would attempt radio contact for assistance which would hopefully alert appropriate authorities of the delema and give much needed instructions. and none of us are lawyers so the legal stuff didnt jump out at us real fast. (of course we all sail because we like to be bound by capricious rules and regulations )(just kidding... a little) this makes my wife happier as well , as she puts it "i'd kill you if you ever died on me out there!" followed with a "thats why im not going!!" she is such a good sport. thanks everyone,very enlightening, tim
yes after some thought the scenerio is a bit odd to just end up with a body on board. it seems that during a medical emergency leading to death that i would attempt radio contact for assistance which would hopefully alert appropriate authorities of the delema and give much needed instructions. and none of us are lawyers so the legal stuff didnt jump out at us real fast. (of course we all sail because we like to be bound by capricious rules and regulations )(just kidding... a little) this makes my wife happier as well , as she puts it "i'd kill you if you ever died on me out there!" followed with a "thats why im not going!!" she is such a good sport. thanks everyone,very enlightening, tim
Log It
Bob has good advice. Remember that your vessel's log book is an official record and be sure to carefully log the details, such as onset of illness; duration; symptoms and anything else relevant to the situation, including attempts to contact authorities or calls for help. If at all possible, be sure to head for a U.S. port where the Constitution and presumption of innocence prevails. You will face an inquiry and must be prepared to defend your actions. Even if the authorities are satisfied, you still might wind up in a civil lawsuit with the insurance company. Lastly, before any voyage, a bit of prayer for a safe passage and health of the crew is always helpful. Dick Vance H-25.5 "Honey Bear"
Bob has good advice. Remember that your vessel's log book is an official record and be sure to carefully log the details, such as onset of illness; duration; symptoms and anything else relevant to the situation, including attempts to contact authorities or calls for help. If at all possible, be sure to head for a U.S. port where the Constitution and presumption of innocence prevails. You will face an inquiry and must be prepared to defend your actions. Even if the authorities are satisfied, you still might wind up in a civil lawsuit with the insurance company. Lastly, before any voyage, a bit of prayer for a safe passage and health of the crew is always helpful. Dick Vance H-25.5 "Honey Bear"
USCG
Remember the orange and white boys are really our best friends out there. They will venture far beyond what you and I consider US waters to resure someone or to remove and injured or dead crew member. Their actions are often heroic operating in the weather we only have nightmares about as sailors. Remember that next time you get boarded for nothing, or a routine inspection as they call it, the19 or 20 year olds that board your vessel, might not even need to shave yet, but when your EPIRB goes off half way between Bermuda and the Caribbean during a hurricane, they'll be the ones coming to your rescue and putting their lives on the line in weather we'd wished we had never seen. Just food for thought, and no I've never been in the USCG, though I've been boarded once or two on Serenity and other boats I've owned
)))) Smooth Sailing Bob Knott H380
Remember the orange and white boys are really our best friends out there. They will venture far beyond what you and I consider US waters to resure someone or to remove and injured or dead crew member. Their actions are often heroic operating in the weather we only have nightmares about as sailors. Remember that next time you get boarded for nothing, or a routine inspection as they call it, the19 or 20 year olds that board your vessel, might not even need to shave yet, but when your EPIRB goes off half way between Bermuda and the Caribbean during a hurricane, they'll be the ones coming to your rescue and putting their lives on the line in weather we'd wished we had never seen. Just food for thought, and no I've never been in the USCG, though I've been boarded once or two on Serenity and other boats I've owned
)))) Smooth Sailing Bob Knott H380EPIRB
Bob, your suggestions are fine if you have an SSB or if you are in coastal waters and can reach someone via VHF. I wonder what your advice would be if you were in the middle of the Atlantic and had no working radio. How many days does it take before a dead body starts decaying. Ugh! Is this a situation where setting off and Epirb would be permitted?
Bob, your suggestions are fine if you have an SSB or if you are in coastal waters and can reach someone via VHF. I wonder what your advice would be if you were in the middle of the Atlantic and had no working radio. How many days does it take before a dead body starts decaying. Ugh! Is this a situation where setting off and Epirb would be permitted?
EPIRB
Tim, If you have an EPIRB on board and you dfon't use it when you have a fatality aboard, not only are you crazy, but the questions you'll face from the police and coast guard when you finally report the mishap are not going to be pretty. Don't know of any off shore boats that don't carry an epirb or ssb, and all boats have the VHF as required by the USCG. Don't forget if you are within 50 -100 miles of shore you'll find a boat who will answer your call if the coast guard on shore can't hear you. A relay is a very fine way to lengthen the VHF capabilities. That being said if the worst were to happen and radio contact was not an option a decaying corpse is not something you'd want to be around, take it from me it's not something that one soon forgets. Geez, how'd we get started on this topic, let's all sail, stay aboard, stay healthy, and I'll have less autopsies to attend!)))) Bob Knott H380
Tim, If you have an EPIRB on board and you dfon't use it when you have a fatality aboard, not only are you crazy, but the questions you'll face from the police and coast guard when you finally report the mishap are not going to be pretty. Don't know of any off shore boats that don't carry an epirb or ssb, and all boats have the VHF as required by the USCG. Don't forget if you are within 50 -100 miles of shore you'll find a boat who will answer your call if the coast guard on shore can't hear you. A relay is a very fine way to lengthen the VHF capabilities. That being said if the worst were to happen and radio contact was not an option a decaying corpse is not something you'd want to be around, take it from me it's not something that one soon forgets. Geez, how'd we get started on this topic, let's all sail, stay aboard, stay healthy, and I'll have less autopsies to attend!
)))) Bob Knott H380It happens
"It" happens infrequently on the long-range (7+ days) sportfishers out of San Diego. They just put'em in the freezer with the tuna. I hope my fish didn't keep him company. Guess I should've asked.
"It" happens infrequently on the long-range (7+ days) sportfishers out of San Diego. They just put'em in the freezer with the tuna. I hope my fish didn't keep him company. Guess I should've asked.
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