We have a Sea Era head flushing with pressurized freshwater that has performed very nicely for a couple of years. BUT, in the past month, it has developed the rather unpleasant habit of producing strong sewage smells belowdecks while we are underway. It took us a while to figure it out but it is only sailing heeled on a starboard tack (head and holding tank are on port side) or rolling heavily that produces the "toxic cloud" in the head compartment. We have checked for leaks, the hose is only 2 months old, everything seems okay...my current hypothesis is that perhaps the joker valve has failed enough to allow some sewage to surge back into the toilet base when we are bouncing on starboard tack. I've ordered a replacement valve, but is there anything else that might be going on? I'd rather only have to take this apart once...
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Toilet not the culprit...and your logic is flawed
It's time to replace the joker valve anyway--it should be replaced at least every two years...but if the joker valve in the toilet were allowing waste to flow back into the bowl when heeled, a) you'd see it--or at least signs of it--in the bowl..and b) the odor would be ONLY in the head, none below decks. So I don't think your sanitation system has anything to do with your odor...when was the last time--if ever--you cleaned your bilges and sump(s)? I don't mean just dumped in some bilge cleaner and/or bleach, but really CLEANED 'em and flushed all the dirty water out? Wet dirty bilges and sumps can smell just like a sewer. Motion while underway causes the odor belowdecks...heeling causes odor from a dirty sump to roll out the shower drain. Give your bilges and sump(s) a REAL cleaning for a change, and I think you'll get rid of the odor.
It's time to replace the joker valve anyway--it should be replaced at least every two years...but if the joker valve in the toilet were allowing waste to flow back into the bowl when heeled, a) you'd see it--or at least signs of it--in the bowl..and b) the odor would be ONLY in the head, none below decks. So I don't think your sanitation system has anything to do with your odor...when was the last time--if ever--you cleaned your bilges and sump(s)? I don't mean just dumped in some bilge cleaner and/or bleach, but really CLEANED 'em and flushed all the dirty water out? Wet dirty bilges and sumps can smell just like a sewer. Motion while underway causes the odor belowdecks...heeling causes odor from a dirty sump to roll out the shower drain. Give your bilges and sump(s) a REAL cleaning for a change, and I think you'll get rid of the odor.
My problem
Is that if I don't pump long enough in the dry pump position, the hose leading to the tank doesn't empty and that water finds it's way back to the head...sometimes it's very black but is always very smelly. I'm sure my joker value needs to be replaced, but it doesn't happen if I flush right.
Is that if I don't pump long enough in the dry pump position, the hose leading to the tank doesn't empty and that water finds it's way back to the head...sometimes it's very black but is always very smelly. I'm sure my joker value needs to be replaced, but it doesn't happen if I flush right.
Oops...I just accidentally deleted the last post!
I meant to hit reply, hit delete by mistake. (Ok, that cat is out of the bag now...Phil enabled me to delete posts so I could remove spam, 'cuz I'm a time zone two hours earlier than he is...I see 'em before he gets up). So whoever posted it, you were not "censored"...there is no glitch in the site OR your computer...you're only a victim of my mistake! And to reply to your solution...closing the tank vent thru-hull is NOT a good idea. For one thing, if air displaced by incoming flushes can't escape out the vent, the tank will become pressurized...and when that happens, flushes will be pushed back toward the toilet, into the bowl...sometimes with enough force to make you wish you hadn't done that! It can even result in a cracked tank during a long enough passage, or if you forget to open it before attempting to pump out or dump the tank. Closing the vent also prevents any fresh air exchange with the air/gasses in the tank, turning the contents anaerobic, which guarantees that what comes out the vent when you open it again will STINK! There's only one reason to close a tank vent: when you're in open ocean, flushing the toilet directly overboard and find yourself in weather/sea conditions that keep your decks awash long enough (days!) that taking on water via the tank vent could become an issue. In any other conditions, NEVER close off the tank vent. The tank vent is never the source of odor INSIDE a boat unless what's coming out comes back in through an open sidelight or hatch. If you had odor inside your boat, putting ball valves on the vent through-hull had nothing to do with curing it, replacing the hoses did.
I meant to hit reply, hit delete by mistake. (Ok, that cat is out of the bag now...Phil enabled me to delete posts so I could remove spam, 'cuz I'm a time zone two hours earlier than he is...I see 'em before he gets up). So whoever posted it, you were not "censored"...there is no glitch in the site OR your computer...you're only a victim of my mistake! And to reply to your solution...closing the tank vent thru-hull is NOT a good idea. For one thing, if air displaced by incoming flushes can't escape out the vent, the tank will become pressurized...and when that happens, flushes will be pushed back toward the toilet, into the bowl...sometimes with enough force to make you wish you hadn't done that! It can even result in a cracked tank during a long enough passage, or if you forget to open it before attempting to pump out or dump the tank. Closing the vent also prevents any fresh air exchange with the air/gasses in the tank, turning the contents anaerobic, which guarantees that what comes out the vent when you open it again will STINK! There's only one reason to close a tank vent: when you're in open ocean, flushing the toilet directly overboard and find yourself in weather/sea conditions that keep your decks awash long enough (days!) that taking on water via the tank vent could become an issue. In any other conditions, NEVER close off the tank vent. The tank vent is never the source of odor INSIDE a boat unless what's coming out comes back in through an open sidelight or hatch. If you had odor inside your boat, putting ball valves on the vent through-hull had nothing to do with curing it, replacing the hoses did.
HEY! Who deleted my post!?
That was me. No big deal about deleting my post. In my defense: I bet it's not a good idea to have it closed for days! But, if I needed it closed for days while underway I could probably just flush overboard in the first place. I'm in the Chesapeake so I'm on the move for only hours at a time on average (and cannot flush overboard either). Don't you suppose those little aerobic buggers can hold their breath for that long while we move to the next anchorage? Of course flushing the head while the vents are closed is a bad idea. That's why we don't do it. Granted, this configuration does lead to the potential for mistakes such as when one forgets to open the valves before using/pumping the holding tank. You bet those new hoses fixed the smell in the boat. However, with valves installed (at the tank, mind you) I don't have to take another chance with getting smelly liquid/solid soup washing down the vent lines while underway and subsequently testing the permeability of the new hoses. The holding tank configuration on our 30' boat does not allow me to have the vents enter from above as is probably desirable. Hence, the current setup onboard. delete that! ;-)
That was me. No big deal about deleting my post. In my defense: I bet it's not a good idea to have it closed for days! But, if I needed it closed for days while underway I could probably just flush overboard in the first place. I'm in the Chesapeake so I'm on the move for only hours at a time on average (and cannot flush overboard either). Don't you suppose those little aerobic buggers can hold their breath for that long while we move to the next anchorage? Of course flushing the head while the vents are closed is a bad idea. That's why we don't do it. Granted, this configuration does lead to the potential for mistakes such as when one forgets to open the valves before using/pumping the holding tank. You bet those new hoses fixed the smell in the boat. However, with valves installed (at the tank, mind you) I don't have to take another chance with getting smelly liquid/solid soup washing down the vent lines while underway and subsequently testing the permeability of the new hoses. The holding tank configuration on our 30' boat does not allow me to have the vents enter from above as is probably desirable. Hence, the current setup onboard. delete that! ;-)
Sorry 'bout that...it really WAS an accident...
"Don't you suppose those little aerobic buggers can hold their breath for that long while we move to the next anchorage?" Nope...and the higher the level in the tank, the less time it takes for the tank contents to turn anaerobic (RIPE!). And you've just provided another reason why closing the vent thru-hull is a bad idea: if waste is spilling into the vent, a permeated vent line is the least of your worries...waste is building up in the hose, which IS gonna result a clogged vent line a lot faster than it will even if it spills overboard. So you've created more problems than you've solved. There's a MUCH better way to prevent waste spilling into the vent...one which would have cost you a fraction of what it cost you put a secock on the vent line: move the vent fitting on the tank away from the hull, to the top or side of a vertical surface closest to the centerline of the boat. When you're heeled to one side, waste runs away from the fitting...when you're heeled the other side, the vent line runs uphill. And moving fittings on a plastic--ANY material--tank is a now a piece of cake, thanks to the invention of a li'l doodad called the "Uniseal." Details about it here: http://www.aussieglobe.com/uniseal1.htm (Scroll to the bottom of the page and click on "next page" for all the details.) It costs about $1.25.
"Don't you suppose those little aerobic buggers can hold their breath for that long while we move to the next anchorage?" Nope...and the higher the level in the tank, the less time it takes for the tank contents to turn anaerobic (RIPE!). And you've just provided another reason why closing the vent thru-hull is a bad idea: if waste is spilling into the vent, a permeated vent line is the least of your worries...waste is building up in the hose, which IS gonna result a clogged vent line a lot faster than it will even if it spills overboard. So you've created more problems than you've solved. There's a MUCH better way to prevent waste spilling into the vent...one which would have cost you a fraction of what it cost you put a secock on the vent line: move the vent fitting on the tank away from the hull, to the top or side of a vertical surface closest to the centerline of the boat. When you're heeled to one side, waste runs away from the fitting...when you're heeled the other side, the vent line runs uphill. And moving fittings on a plastic--ANY material--tank is a now a piece of cake, thanks to the invention of a li'l doodad called the "Uniseal." Details about it here: http://www.aussieglobe.com/uniseal1.htm (Scroll to the bottom of the page and click on "next page" for all the details.) It costs about $1.25.
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