I have debated whether I should post this to the group. My intention is to relate the extended frustration that comes when one of us decides to sell their pride and joy. I have finally sold my boat. It took 399 days from first listing with a broker to selling by owner with an expected closing date in late October. During that time, I worked with three agents. Then, I went off on my own and did extensive advertising. In the end, here's how I found my buyer. I advertised in "Latitude 38" amoungst others. And, the ad referred people to my web site. It's listed below. During this time I estimate the web site had over 10,000 hits from sources linked to the ads. I can determine this via the outfit that hosts the site. Our boat is a highly maintained, upgraded and beautiful Hunter 410. With all the acitivity on the site, no one could believe she didn't sell. I set a price that I (mistakenly) thought was a fair value considering everything I have done to the boat. Honestly, there was nothing else to do short of adding air conditioning, a water maker and SSB. But, in our local area these things are not needed unless one wants to cruise to Mexico. The price was ultimately lowered by $40,000 due to the overwhelmingly "buyer's market" conditions here in So. Calif. The man who finally bought the boat did so without ever seeing it first hand. He found the ad, linked to the web site and continued looking at "over 50 boats" until deciding to make an offer for our boat. I mention this for this reason. I spent a bundle on upgrades. If a new gizmo was out there, I bought it. The boat was almost spotless. She won awards for the best maintained boat in our yacht club's fleet. She did well in racing. All the "stuff" I bought turned out to be money down the drain. In the final analysys, I would not have added anything beyond OEM stuff because the idea of recooping this upon a sale wasn't gonna happen. It's OK to do the upgrades as long as you realize these items will be for your pleasure and will not provide you with an increased boat value and ultimate sale price. I've spent the last two days removing personal stuff from the boat. I have a highly bittersweet feeling now that I realize the boat is sold and will go to someone else. One really develops a bond with their boat. She becomes a member of the family highly similar to a child when they finally move on to adulthood. Right now, I don't know whether I should be happy or sad. I'll be interested in the response generated from this. Best wishes, John Richard s/v Jack's Plac John Richard s/v Jack's Place
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Sorry to see you sell what sounds to be your....
pride and joy. Your post is very informative and I think the xtras and upgrades are also true for automobiles. abe
pride and joy. Your post is very informative and I think the xtras and upgrades are also true for automobiles. abe
Reason for selling
John, after reading your post I'm not sure if I should congratulate you or offer my condolences. What made you decide to sell? Are you getting a new boat? Thanks for sharing your experiences.
John, after reading your post I'm not sure if I should congratulate you or offer my condolences. What made you decide to sell? Are you getting a new boat? Thanks for sharing your experiences.
I did the same thing
I di the same thing and recently sold my 2003 356.I had put alot of new stuff into the boat and have come to the same conclusion as you,that adding those things really are for the use of the owner.However,let me say that had I not had those things,I dont think I would have gotten prospective buyers to consider buying the boat and in addition,I think I might not have sold it.So I put it in perspective that putting those value addecd items helped me sell the boat and that a boat's resale value will always depend on A: the publics perspective on the value of the boat(i.e. Tartans,etc always seem to be valued more at resale) B: The care and maintenance of the boat C: the number of the same boat for sale in your area. This is not a definitive list to me but some points I feel important.I COULD have hung on for a better price but I had no guarrantee that would ever happen so to close,I know that I will never buy a new boat again and I will buy my next boat looking for the same things that I had installed on the boat I sold.
I di the same thing and recently sold my 2003 356.I had put alot of new stuff into the boat and have come to the same conclusion as you,that adding those things really are for the use of the owner.However,let me say that had I not had those things,I dont think I would have gotten prospective buyers to consider buying the boat and in addition,I think I might not have sold it.So I put it in perspective that putting those value addecd items helped me sell the boat and that a boat's resale value will always depend on A: the publics perspective on the value of the boat(i.e. Tartans,etc always seem to be valued more at resale) B: The care and maintenance of the boat C: the number of the same boat for sale in your area. This is not a definitive list to me but some points I feel important.I COULD have hung on for a better price but I had no guarrantee that would ever happen so to close,I know that I will never buy a new boat again and I will buy my next boat looking for the same things that I had installed on the boat I sold.
Good point
As a newspaperman, I recommend the classifieds in the nearest paper(s) that have a lot of boat ads. Adding the website to the ad eliminates a lot of calls. I've sold boats through newspapers and Internet, and I concur that the upgrades are not materially rewarded at sale. Only at sail, which is sufficient.
As a newspaperman, I recommend the classifieds in the nearest paper(s) that have a lot of boat ads. Adding the website to the ad eliminates a lot of calls. I've sold boats through newspapers and Internet, and I concur that the upgrades are not materially rewarded at sale. Only at sail, which is sufficient.
Yep, as I recall, the 'rule' for upgrades is
you get back 10 cents on the dollar. So John, what are you going to do now? Getting out of sailing?
you get back 10 cents on the dollar. So John, what are you going to do now? Getting out of sailing?
Boat Market
John, The boating market has always been interesting to me. I have seen your boat on your website and I would say (without a survey or close inspection)that it would be a boat in excellent condition. However, in my estimation, you purchased and equiped for the long run and sold the boat much to early to recover any value on these "toys". I do not believe you receive much value from these at the sale of the boat. If you raise the selling price of a boat based on the addition of these extras you will never sell it. You must forget about the cost of these additions and price the boat competitively in the market. I have owned two new boats in my boating career and 3 used boats. At this point, I would NEVER buy a new boat again. The trick in buying is always to look for a well-equipped used boat that is competitively priced with other boats around the same genre. In your case, you are selling a 5 year old boat. It would take you ten years of sailing to recover the value on the sails you purchased for your boat. The same goes for other goodies you purchased. You have not used the boat enough to recover the value on those things before you sold. So I guess my 02. cents worth is that you sold to quicly. David
John, The boating market has always been interesting to me. I have seen your boat on your website and I would say (without a survey or close inspection)that it would be a boat in excellent condition. However, in my estimation, you purchased and equiped for the long run and sold the boat much to early to recover any value on these "toys". I do not believe you receive much value from these at the sale of the boat. If you raise the selling price of a boat based on the addition of these extras you will never sell it. You must forget about the cost of these additions and price the boat competitively in the market. I have owned two new boats in my boating career and 3 used boats. At this point, I would NEVER buy a new boat again. The trick in buying is always to look for a well-equipped used boat that is competitively priced with other boats around the same genre. In your case, you are selling a 5 year old boat. It would take you ten years of sailing to recover the value on the sails you purchased for your boat. The same goes for other goodies you purchased. You have not used the boat enough to recover the value on those things before you sold. So I guess my 02. cents worth is that you sold to quicly. David
Additional comments
You guys have been spot on. During the year+ it took to sell I watched the market very closely. My original illusions of grandure turned more practical. I wish that would have occurred sooner, but hindsight is ususally 20/20. I got myself into racing and quickly realized our boats are basically slugs when compared to the competition that carries a lot less displacement. So, the 20 large spent on sails and a feathering prop added a lot of excitement. The boat DID sail faster and better. No doubt. I think the most productive investment was the Max-Prop. The feathering nature of this displayed immediate changes. Most noticeable was a quieter ride with almost no vibration. I could tune in to the engine and easily feel the boat respond to conditions. The value in backing was supurb. With the transmission in reverse and the blades feathered, I honestly feel I picked up 3/4 knot over my stock two blade. The vertical batten main and larger 125% genoa were also much better than the OEM stuff. So, the "fun factor" was much improved. I guess in the final analysis, while the boat lost a lot of market value, my overall exilaration was off the scale. A couple of you asked why I sold. The reason is one everyone on the board visits during the course of their planning to buy and then maintain. Being away from boats for 37 years I decided to buy a boat I could grow into. The 410 was certainly the right choice. However, along with this was the cost associated with a large sailboat. I'm a retired policeman on a fixed income. The stock market just reached record levels today, however, some of our investment choices sucked. My wife and I came to the conclusion that now was the time to economize and be more practical. The sale of this boat will produce a lot of freedom in this regard. I plan to buy another sailboat, though this one will be a "Harbor 20" (see below link) which is a splendid one-design class here in our area. The fleet is very active and expertly raced. Every Harbor 20 must conform to exact standards when raced. The owners are mostly a bunch of old coots who like to go out and play. Thanks, JR
You guys have been spot on. During the year+ it took to sell I watched the market very closely. My original illusions of grandure turned more practical. I wish that would have occurred sooner, but hindsight is ususally 20/20. I got myself into racing and quickly realized our boats are basically slugs when compared to the competition that carries a lot less displacement. So, the 20 large spent on sails and a feathering prop added a lot of excitement. The boat DID sail faster and better. No doubt. I think the most productive investment was the Max-Prop. The feathering nature of this displayed immediate changes. Most noticeable was a quieter ride with almost no vibration. I could tune in to the engine and easily feel the boat respond to conditions. The value in backing was supurb. With the transmission in reverse and the blades feathered, I honestly feel I picked up 3/4 knot over my stock two blade. The vertical batten main and larger 125% genoa were also much better than the OEM stuff. So, the "fun factor" was much improved. I guess in the final analysis, while the boat lost a lot of market value, my overall exilaration was off the scale. A couple of you asked why I sold. The reason is one everyone on the board visits during the course of their planning to buy and then maintain. Being away from boats for 37 years I decided to buy a boat I could grow into. The 410 was certainly the right choice. However, along with this was the cost associated with a large sailboat. I'm a retired policeman on a fixed income. The stock market just reached record levels today, however, some of our investment choices sucked. My wife and I came to the conclusion that now was the time to economize and be more practical. The sale of this boat will produce a lot of freedom in this regard. I plan to buy another sailboat, though this one will be a "Harbor 20" (see below link) which is a splendid one-design class here in our area. The fleet is very active and expertly raced. Every Harbor 20 must conform to exact standards when raced. The owners are mostly a bunch of old coots who like to go out and play. Thanks, JR
One design is a great choice.
Congrats on the sale(yet?). It's all about the experience and you sound like you had a great time overall. We nearly considered the "big boat" buy but weighed the cost/depreciation/upkeep to be out of reach for our area and for all practical(is sailing practical?) purposes incl our investment goals. The area we're in has exorbitant dock fees and now a serious water quality problem to boot. So considering the $ factor it turns out to be better owning the more modest side of sailing. In St Pete we found(although we didn't do it) a viable big boat compromise in the Sailtime fractional use option. Looked closely and it has merit if the franchise is strong, growing and has friendly mangement. Our area franchise was/is very nice and rapidly expanding. New boats, well maintained, flexable usage and resonably priced. All that said we'll stay in a modest boat, crew now and then and just charter the BVI's or wherever and still be ahead. I think you'll have a great time in that new one design fleet. Have fun sailing with the old coots(racing wolves in sheeps clothing I'm sure) and make the most of it all. Congrats. Michael and Kelli Sarasota, Fl
Congrats on the sale(yet?). It's all about the experience and you sound like you had a great time overall. We nearly considered the "big boat" buy but weighed the cost/depreciation/upkeep to be out of reach for our area and for all practical(is sailing practical?) purposes incl our investment goals. The area we're in has exorbitant dock fees and now a serious water quality problem to boot. So considering the $ factor it turns out to be better owning the more modest side of sailing. In St Pete we found(although we didn't do it) a viable big boat compromise in the Sailtime fractional use option. Looked closely and it has merit if the franchise is strong, growing and has friendly mangement. Our area franchise was/is very nice and rapidly expanding. New boats, well maintained, flexable usage and resonably priced. All that said we'll stay in a modest boat, crew now and then and just charter the BVI's or wherever and still be ahead. I think you'll have a great time in that new one design fleet. Have fun sailing with the old coots(racing wolves in sheeps clothing I'm sure) and make the most of it all. Congrats. Michael and Kelli Sarasota, Fl
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