Securing the boom with Bimini open

[CHSN WND]

I recently installed a 6 foot Ameriseam Bimini (stern rail seat model) on my H26. To prevent interference from the boom, I need to raise the boom about a foot so it doesn't rub the Bimini top. I also need to remove my down haul, since that would also interfere with the Bimini. That pretty much precludes any sailing with the Bimini open!

The question is, when I have the boom raised and down haul removed, what's the best way to secure the boom? I've heard of a rigid vang, but have a very limited understanding of what they are and how they function.

Any advice, either on a rigid vang or other ideas for securing the boom in the slip (of course, I know I could just tie a line to a stanchion, wrap it around the boom a time or two, then secure to the other stanchion. Just wondering if there's a better way..?

Thanks!

 

[rgranger]

Hmmm..... How much "rub" are we talking about? I'm thinking it might make more sense to hack saw off an inch of tube from the bottom of the bimini frame ....reattach the connector pieces.... but I'm not sure I have the right picture of your situation in my mind's eye.

 

[rgranger]

The Bimi on my boat does not rub.

 

[kito]

Try looking into getting a Boomkicker. They are fairly cheap and along with a traditional soft vang you can raise the end of the boom by adjusting the tension on the vang and not mess with the downhaul. If you want it up while sailing, you may have to cut down your bimini frame a bit though.

 

[Benny17441]

Since you are asking about a rigid boom vang I must assume your boom is currently supported by a topping lift. Now topping lifts can be rigged to be fixed or adjustable. With an adjustable toping lift you can lift the back end of the boom to clear the bimini top as desired. I suspect that what you call the downhaul is the main sheeting mechanism and that it is attached to a "U" bolt in the cockpit sole. If your top does not clear the sheeting mechanism then the top is positioned too long towards the front. If it cannot be moved any farther back then repositioning the sheeting mechanism might be necessary. By moving the boom attachment a little forward you may create an angle to clear the front of the bimini. There is always the option of shortening the height of the top to lessen the angles. The purpose of a bimini is to protect the crew from the heat, sun rays and rain and there is need to be able to use it at all times, when sailing or when lounging at the dock or at anchor. Lifting the back end of the boom may not provide the best sail shape for optimum performance in certain points of sail and moving the sail sheeting mechanism attachment point forward may increase the force necessary to pull the line but small sacrifices will go a long way towards comfort in those hot summer days. I could not sail without a bimini here in Florida for 3/4 of the year. You asked about a rigid boom vang, lets' say it does the function of the topping lift combined with that of a soft vang but it will not restrict horizontal movement of the boom.

 

[CHSN WND]

I wouldn't think that a bimini that is made to fit an H26 with stern rail seats would require cutting to fit, but maybe I shouldn't be surprised...

The topping lift is adjustable, so I can lift it vertically. But when I do, the downhaul / main sheet kind of takes over where the topping lift line left off, so I've disconnected the downhaul when using the bimini. Of course, that means the boom can swing from side to side freely when disconnected from the downhaul- undesirable.

Not to disparage anyone, but I've had nothing but trouble with Ameriseam products, and to some extent, Hunter as well. In Ameriseam's defense, the Ameriseam items I've purchased have been acquired second-hand, but both of the individuals who sold me these items (pop-top cover and bimini) have H26 boats and are honest, good guys who frequent these forums. The pop-top cover simply seems to be too small, - both width and length-wise - and the bimini both doesn't fit and suffers from a terrible design. I need to loosen allen bolts on both sliding arms to put the bimini in place - why not use a spring-loaded snap "button"? That way, I could slide the bimini into place and lock it, and when I'm ready to stow it I could simply depress the button and release the arm. Who wants to keep an allen wrench at the ready to lower or raise their bimini?? The pop-top is no better. I may need to install a second set of snaps about an inch or two up the sides of my hatch to enable it to fit. Really strange, since I believe these boats were factory-made to accept the pop top canvas.

Hunter is often no better - they can't supply a pre-drilled lexan hatch for an H26 - if you buy one from the SBO store, it comes undrilled. Why? Because they have no standard drill pattern for the locking arm or closures. They just put them wherever..? Really strange, but I guess it's just part of owning a Hunter. They did some things very ingeniously, and other, simple things, kind of randomly...

Oh well, I'll keepo trying to figure it out. I asked Ameriseam twice for installation instructions for the bimini and they didn't send anything. They did send instructions for the pop top canvas, but as stated, it doesn't seem to fit my boat. Same old, same old I'm afraid...

 

[Ron20324]

[QUOTE="CHSN WND,..., the downhaul / main sheet kind of takes over where the topping lift line left off,...]
What do you mean, "takes over"?

... I need to loosen allen bolts on both sliding arms to put the bimini in place - why not use a spring-loaded snap "button"?
Okay, so why don't you install a sping-snap? Sailrite.com.

... I may need to install a second set of snaps about an inch or two up the sides of my hatch to enable it to fit....
You can buy snap extenders. Maybe Sailrite, or make your own, or look at thew cooler section of your store. Someone makes/sells them, I know.

Hunter is often no better - they can't supply a pre-drilled lexan hatch for an H26 ...
It is probably a one-size-fits-all hatch, but various years have various latching systems?

... I asked Ameriseam twice for installation instructions ...[/QUOTE]
Not sure what instructions you need. It is up, isn't it? As others said, perhaps you can shorten the bows to lessen height.

 

[rgranger]

Hey CHSN WND:

My pop-top cover is also a tad small, the snaps almost reach. I have not tried this yet but I read that it works well.... I'm going to soak overnight my pop top cover in the bath tub with a strong solution of fabric softener. From what I've read, that should "relax" the fabric enough to get the snaps in place (rinse before installing). Let it dry in place. I plan to do this next week as I'm in frantic preparation for a two week cruise and want my pop-top cover. I'll post if it works or not.

BTW: what are you calling the "down haul"? Are you talking about the main sheet that connects on the cockpit floor?

 

[CHSN WND]

[QUOTE="CHSN WND,..., the downhaul / main sheet kind of takes over where the topping lift line left off,...]
What do you mean, "takes over"?

It afixes to the floor of the cockpit, meaning even if the boom is raised, the downhaul line blocks the front of the bimini from fully extending. Your Beneteau probably has a traveler, the H26 does not.

... I need to loosen allen bolts on both sliding arms to put the bimini in place - why not use a spring-loaded snap "button"?
Okay, so why don't you install a sping-snap? Sailrite.com.

Seriously??? Would you buy a round sail and cut a triangle out of the middle so you can use it? Seems like a custom-made item should fit w/o mods like this....

... I may need to install a second set of snaps about an inch or two up the sides of my hatch to enable it to fit....
You can buy snap extenders. Maybe Sailrite, or make your own, or look at thew cooler section of your store. Someone makes/sells them, I know.

Probably not the best at keeping bugs out, but could at least enable the pop top to be fit on.

Hunter is often no better - they can't supply a pre-drilled lexan hatch for an H26 ...
It is probably a one-size-fits-all hatch, but various years have various latching systems?

No, it's a lexan hatch that is specific to the H26. To my knowledge, it was never used on any other model, so one would expect it would afix to any H26 the same way...

... I asked Ameriseam twice for installation instructions ...

Not sure what instructions you need. It is up, isn't it. As others said, perhaps you can short the bows to lessen height.

Yes, but is it properly installed? I could possibly attach it to the bow, and maybe even put it up, but is it correct? Hard to say. So yeah, instructions would indeed be helpful.

 

[CHSN WND]

BTW: what are you calling the "down haul"? Are you talking about the main sheet that connects on the cockpit floor?

Yep - I may be using the wrong terminology. I thought that the part was properly called a downhaul... but a quick wikipedia search suggests another term may be a cunningham..? Anyway, it is indeed the mainsheet contraption that connects the boom to the cockpit floor.. If I raise the boom via topping lift and keep the "mainsheet" attached to the cockpit floor, that line then blocks the forward extension of the bimini...

 

[CHSN WND]

My pop-top cover is also a tad small, the snaps almost reach. I have not tried this yet but I read that it works well.... I'm going to soak overnight my pop top cover in the bath tub with a strong solution of fabric softener. From what I've read, that should "relax" the fabric enough to get the snaps in place (rinse before installing). Let it dry in place. I plan to do this next week as I'm in frantic preparation for a two week cruise and want my pop-top cover. I'll post if it works or not.

I had heard that from Fred, the gent who sold me the pop top. He said it fit pretty tight on his boat, but did fit.

I kind of wondered if the sunbrella fabric would become thoroughly soaked since it's supposed to be water repellent, but maybe? Especially with fabric softener - Fred didn't mention it, but then again, he didn't need to soak it - that may enhance the soaking effect... Please let me know if it works. I can certainly see why the snaps wouldn't line up - each boat is indeed different in that regard - but I was surprised when the fabric seemed to be too small... If soaking in water+fabric softener overnight fixes the issue, I'll be a happy camper (literally)!

 

[rgranger]

....If soaking in water+fabric softener overnight fixes the issue, I'll be a happy camper (literally)!

Will do.... It is on my list for next week. The list keeps growing.....

 

[flynhi4u]

You could use the cover you have now as a pattern and sew your own making it the length you need for your snaps then sell the old one to another H26 owner.
A bow bimini? You might be onto something there Dave!

Sam

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

chase wind;
The bimini was designed to be open with sail up. Call Ameriseam and ask for Jim Larsen and tell him that I told you to call him or I will. As for the pop top, I am a little foggy here but if you install that I am thinking that you can raise the pop then. I will need to go back and think about this one

 

[CHSN WND]

You could use the cover you have now as a pattern and sew your own making it the length you need for your snaps then sell the old one to another H26 owner.
A bow bimini? You might be onto something there Dave!

Sam

I'm anxiously awaiting rgrangers next post, hopefully telling me that soaking the fabric in water with fabric softener worked like a champ (fingers crossed for both of us!).

I think you get my point re: bow-mount bimini; "setting it up" is one thing, setting it up PROPERLY may be another. Installation instructions that show an H26 with stern rail seats - which this bimini is custom made for - would be useful. But, if I'm the only one having issues, maybe investing in model-specific instructions would be a waste.

Bottom line, I'm sure there will be resolutions, it's just that my issues are apparently rather uncommon (SURPRISE!). I guess that's a good thing (for the other owners of these items lol!). With a little help from my SBO friends, we'll get it figured out.

 

[flynhi4u]

Yes Dave, hopefully that works. My only comment would be that it has been my experience that fabric softer can remove the water repellant from some fabrics. If it works you might want to spray some silicone tent sealant on it to reef waterproof it.
Speaking of water, it is pouring buckets down here right now. Like a super cell is parked over the airport right now. Got our first inch and working on the second. Darn rain.

Sam

 

[CHSN WND]

Yes Dave, hopefully that works. My only comment would be that it has been my experience that fabric softer can remove the water repellant from some fabrics. If it works you might want to spray some silicone tent sealant on it to reef waterproof it.
Speaking of water, it is pouring buckets down here right now. Like a super cell is parked over the airport right now. Got our first inch and working on the second. Darn rain.

Sam

Good advice. Another gent suggested just soaking the canvas in water overnight and trying to stretch it that way. rgranger may want to try water first, and if necessary, add fabric softener for a second try..?
75 and sunny today up here, but rain is on the way for tomorrow, Saturday and Sunday AM. Lousy timing!

 

[Benny17441]

Yep - I may be using the wrong terminology. I thought that the part was properly called a downhaul... but a quick wikipedia search suggests another term may be a cunningham..? Anyway, it is indeed the mainsheet contraption that connects the boom to the cockpit floor.. If I raise the boom via topping lift and keep the "mainsheet" attached to the cockpit floor, that line then blocks the forward extension of the bimini...

OK, what I am understanding is that you have installed the bimini but cannot fully extend it forward because it interferes with the mainsheet. Is there a reason why the top cannot be positioned farther back? It might cut into headroom for the stern seats but what good would headroom do if the top cannot be used while sailing. Another option might be depending on the length of the intrusion forward to reposition the mainsheet attachment at the boom forward enough to clear the top? The position of that attachment point offers some leeway to be moved to the back or to the front a few inches (4" to 8") without affecting boom structural or blocks purchase performance. Obviously the top does not fit between the current rigging parameters so the either the top is adjusted or the rigging parameters are altered. To install a top and just be able to use it at anchor or dock does not sound like a sensible alternative. As far as securing the boom when the sheeting mechanism is removed just remove the sheeting mechanism from the sole of the cockpit, move the boom to one side until the mainsheet clears the top and then attach to a midship cleat or other fixture.

 

[CHSN WND]

OK, what I am understanding is that you have installed the bimini but cannot fully extend it forward because it interferes with the mainsheet. Is there a reason why the top cannot be positioned farther back? It might cut into headroom for the stern seats but what good would headroom do if the top cannot be used while sailing. Another option might be depending on the length of the intrusion forward to reposition the mainsheet attachment at the boom forward enough to clear the top? The position of that attachment point offers some leeway to be moved to the back or to the front a few inches (4" to 8") without affecting boom structural or blocks purchase performance. Obviously the top does not fit between the current rigging parameters so the either the top is adjusted or the rigging parameters are altered. To install a top and just be able to use it at anchor or dock does not sound like a sensible alternative. As far as securing the boom when the sheeting mechanism is removed just remove the sheeting mechanism from the sole of the cockpit, move the boom to one side until the mainsheet clears the top and then attach to a midship cleat or other fixture.

 

[CHSN WND]

Hi Benny,
You pretty much have the right picture. One thing I've learned, though, is the PO (I purchased the new bimini from another SBO member who needed to get a coming mount instead) needed to replace a pole or two; he worked with Ameriseam to select the right replacement parts - and he then suplied it to me. What I think happened is Ameriseam sent him the wrong parts. When I followed the writen instructions supplied with the bimini, it was clear that the rear supports were way too short - like about a foot too short - to attach to the center stern rail. After much head scratching and attempted adjustments, I came to the conclusion that the only way the bimini could possibly fit would be to attach the rear supports to the back rails of the stern rail seats, which essentially made those less than comfortable. I'm trying to verify all of this, but I believe that's the issue with fitment...
As for securing the boom, I guess I'll need to get the bimini fitted properly before I can tell exactly what's happening there. I like the idea of securing the mainsheet to a stanchion - I think that'll work in the slip just fine. I'm game to move the U bolt on the boom further towards the mast to change the angle of the mainsheet. That, coupled with a few inches of lift from the topping lift may very well enable me to sail with the bimini up. Time will tell, I guess.
Thanks all, for the input - it is appreciated! I'll let you know what I learn from Ameriseam re: rear support length.