Sailboat Instruments

dlochner · Sep 13, 2016

As BarryL notes, going with a multi-vendor solution presents a new set of issues, especially when a company upgrades its firmware.

Careful selection of the instruments may mitigate this concern. Devices that simply send data to the next work, such as speed, depth, etc. will probably integrate fairly well with most any contemporary N2K network. However, devices that do something with the data may have greater difficulty, such as an AP of one brand talking to an AP of another brand.

One drawback of a fully integrated system by one vendor is that if the network crashes, everything is lost. Redundancy is important.

Second Star has a B&G Zues2 and a Vespar AIS transceiver that play well together. The Vespar unit has its own WiFi network through which firmware updates can be installed. The Standard Horizon VHF has integrated GPS and AIS receiver that is independent of the network. This is by design. If every thing is operating on one network, one failing device can take down the whole network. If the Zeus2 goes down, I can still get position data from the VHF or the Vespar AIS. If one those two goes down, then I still have the other.

Ken Cross · Sep 13, 2016

Tally Ho said:
My new to me O'Day 322 has a hodgepodge of instruments, and they don't all talk to each other.
-Garmin 741 chart plotter
- DSC VHF radio with AIS receiver
The "problems":
DSC radio does not interface with the GPS Chartplotter, so no location information to the Radio
Greg

If your GPS is interfaced with your Garmin chart plotter via NMEA 183 it will be necessary to ground the data minus (-) lines to make that interface operate. It took me a long time to figure that out on our previous boat. At least it is a really easy fix.

Ken

Tally Ho · Sep 13, 2016

Thanks

Ken Cross said:
If your GPS is interfaced with your Garmin chart plotter via NMEA 183 it will be necessary to ground the data minus (-) lines to make that interface operate. It took me a long time to figure that out on our previous boat. At least it is a really easy fix.

Ken

Thanks Ken,
The GPS in integrated in the Chartplotter, and I have looked it to the VHF radio via NMEA2K.

Greg

njlarry · Sep 13, 2016

I admit that I am low tech. I don't understand the need to integrate all the instruments. The chartplotter usually has its own gps. Separate speed and depth instruments are easy to read. New vhf units now have dsc. I can see wanting ais on the chartplotter maybe but even that may be too much screen clutter. As a cruiser I am only concerned with apparent wind.
What am I missing?

LeslieTroyer · Sep 14, 2016

njlarry said:
I admit that I am low tech. I don't understand the need to integrate all the instruments. The chartplotter usually has its own gps. Separate speed and depth instruments are easy to read. New vhf units now have dsc. I can see wanting ais on the chartplotter maybe but even that may be too much screen clutter. As a cruiser I am only concerned with apparent wind.
What am I missing?

most of the combining is to make things easier

combine chart plotter to AutoPilot - so you don't have to set direction to next waypoint
combine wind speed/direction and (water) speed to get true wind speed and direction
combine GPS with VHF and Plotter to get AIS on Plotter
combine wind and AP to get limited steer by wind functionality
combine engine vitals & plotter to get info you need where you can see it (with visual alarms)

I don't buy into the idea if you loose one piece of gear you loose all functionality. Most failures won't take the network down, the instrument sensors fail. If one did take the network down it is only a twist away from being able to be removed. what do you loose?? the ability to use that instrument by itself and in combination with others. I don't need my plotter for wind / depth / auto pilot / VHF to work I have other displays for that info -- heck I can see most all of it on my remote stereo display, and I've still got 2 I70's and a P70.

The biggest risk I see is if you live where lightning is common. A strike could get into the network and fry all your electronics (but it could almost as easily get onto the DC and fry them anyway.

I don't have a problem with mixed vendors - just be sure you plan for firmware updates and calibration with appropriate overlap of equipment.

Les

Jim 5757 · Sep 14, 2016

I believe in KISS principle. We have Lowrance GPS that interfaces only with vhf for the DSC function.
Depth/speed/temp are standalone Raymarine ST 40 bidata. Works fine for us...

njlarry · Sep 14, 2016

Thank you Leslie, that is a great explanation, very understandable. But I am with Jim. ...kiss! Seems like a lot of effort for little benefit. At least for the cruising I do, might feel different if racing.

LeslieTroyer · Sep 15, 2016

I don't race - If you stick with a single vendor it is quite simple, where things get complicated is when you have to go with 183 or convert between network technologies - finding the right adapter cable can be a challenge - I'm mostly Seatalkng (Raymarine) but have 3 NMEA 2K devices that required adapter cables (no active components, just connector changes), I do have NMEA 183 between the VHF and Plotter and and SeatalkHS between Radar and Plotter.

To me the biggest benefit from above is seeing the engine vitals while motoring - while my engine panel is in the cockpit I have to get on my hands and knees to read the gauges. Now it's right in front of me with visual popups if something goes out of setpoints I control. I'm hard of hearing (wear hearing aids) so the visual notification is great (not just a dim light positioned where it is hard to see).

The second biggest benefit is having the ability to adjust where and how I see various data, with standalone instruments you don't get the option to have depth and ground speed and water speed all on one display - with the networked solution it is very easy. I can also view my plotter from below using a tablet or phone. This is helpful if I'm below occupied while the wife has a question at the helm.

Les

druid · Sep 15, 2016

I agree with dlochner, but not for the same reasons. At what point does "sailing" become "playing on a computer"? All I've ever needed was a Windex, depth sounder (mainly for anchoring) and a compass: obviously not connected together. I've added a GPS with small chartplotter capabilities, although sometimes I turn it off if I feel I'm depending on it too much. It just detracts from the sailing experience!

Sure, get a giant chartplotter, radar, wind instruments, AIS, cameras, AP... all connected together. Then go down below and watch TV.

druid

dlochner · Sep 15, 2016

druid said:
Sure, get a giant chartplotter, radar, wind instruments, AIS, cameras, AP... all connected together. Then go down below and watch TV.

druid

Well, now you're talking. The Zeus2 has a video input. I could hook up a camera and then go below and watch where we're going on the iPad. Think of the savings in sunscreen! No more basal cell... no more liquid nitrogen treatments, closer to the cooler and cold beer....

First time I crossed Lake Ontario, it was on a Tanzer 22 with a boom box and a compass, didn't even have a knot meter. This was before LORAN, GPS, and even affordable and compact VHFs.

The most valuable instrument is the knot meter. It senses small speed changes much better than I do and helps with sail trim.

Our current electronics were installed in anticipation of some extensive cruising outside of our current area and in areas where fog and commercial traffic is a reality, thus the radar, chart plotter, and AIS. The AIS is also a safety item, it has an anchor watch and with the new personal SAR AIS transmitters a way to find crew that has gone overboard.