During a recent sail, we bottomed out in shallow water (swing keel up) and broke the rudder in half. As a new rudder cost is at $600-$700 I am looking for suggestions as to where best to find a used rudder. I am also considering building one by laminating 2 pc. of quality ply together and glassing over with heavy fiber glass. Suggestions?
Rudder replacement
- Thread starter Doug Bauckham
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I just found out the other day that one of our YC members built a spade rudder for his O'Day 27 with wheel steering. They say that it came out great. They didn't know how he did it, but I imagine that he built it out of sandwiched marine plywood and fiberglass. I think that "Wooden Boat" Magazine had a article on how to build a rudder with plywood and fiberglass. Also, there are some new synthetic core type materials that you may be able to use in place of balsa or plywood. Check out the Shipshape TV web site for info on it. Good luck.
Joe
Joe
- Jul 24, 2006
- 628
rudder fix
why not grind/sand and epoxy the halves together. Then glass over the joint. Might be an ok for now fix. How did you get home without rudder? Use the outboard? Patrick
why not grind/sand and epoxy the halves together. Then glass over the joint. Might be an ok for now fix. How did you get home without rudder? Use the outboard? Patrick
Doug,
I think that you may be able to fix it as Patrick describes, but the rudder is only going to be as strong as the core material. Think of it this way; The rudder blades were molded in two pieces. then they were glued together with Epoxy and pumped with foam. I tried at least twice to make repairs on my old foam filled blades and had no luck at all. Of course, these guys who sell rudder blades for big bucks want you to buy a new blade off them, but I think that if you can replace the core in the blade and get rid of the seam by reconstructing it with cloth and glass, it can be fixed. I just didn't have the knowledge at the time to make such a repair. I bet that a good fiberglass man could repair it. That might be an option for you.
Joe
I think that you may be able to fix it as Patrick describes, but the rudder is only going to be as strong as the core material. Think of it this way; The rudder blades were molded in two pieces. then they were glued together with Epoxy and pumped with foam. I tried at least twice to make repairs on my old foam filled blades and had no luck at all. Of course, these guys who sell rudder blades for big bucks want you to buy a new blade off them, but I think that if you can replace the core in the blade and get rid of the seam by reconstructing it with cloth and glass, it can be fixed. I just didn't have the knowledge at the time to make such a repair. I bet that a good fiberglass man could repair it. That might be an option for you.
Joe
Doug: I'm guessing that you are the guy who just purchased the solid mahogany rudder from the fellow in Wilmingotn, NC. I think that your boat will look great with that addition. The only concern that I would have would be if you bottom out again with the new rudder. I wonder if the mahogany is so strong that it wouldn't break like the original O'Day rudder? That could lead to the gudgeons being pulled out of your transom.
Steve brings up a good point here. I don't think that it really matters what our rudder blades are made of, if we hit something with them in shallow waters something is going to give. It could be the pintles, gudgeons, or if you have a tip up rudder, it could mean a broken tiller. This happened on my boat once. I let one of my friends steer my boat during a race and he sailed into shallow water and the pressure of blade grounding out in the mud, split my tiller. The only thing that we can do is try to stay out of shallow water by keeping an eye on the depth meter if we're fortunate enough to have one, and I don't, or by listening to the centerboard when it starts grounding in shallow water. I'm kind of sorry now that I didn't keep one of my old rudder blades. Knowing what I'm leaning now about them, I probably could have fixed one and kept it for a spare.
Joe
I sail in a lake that changes depth 6' to 10' each day (nuclear station uses the water). Back in June, I had my Oday 23 on our boat dock and the depth change made the rudder crack (horizontal crack).
I ended up buying one of the Idasailor kickup rudders and have been very happy with it. It cost's way too much (around $850 or $900). It's well built and the kick up idea really works well.
The rest of the boat was fine...just that one horizontal crack in the rudder.
The lesson I learned...not to dock my boat after 1pm (I have a mooring ball near the dock).
By the way, I never told my wife it was a $900 mistake.
Kevin
I ended up buying one of the Idasailor kickup rudders and have been very happy with it. It cost's way too much (around $850 or $900). It's well built and the kick up idea really works well.
The rest of the boat was fine...just that one horizontal crack in the rudder.
The lesson I learned...not to dock my boat after 1pm (I have a mooring ball near the dock).
By the way, I never told my wife it was a $900 mistake.
Kevin
I don't think that I could use my mooring without having my kick-up rudder in the up position when I leave her moored. When the tide goes down, I have the same problem you do. I rope my tiller off good to my stern cleats to keep the rudder centered. I had sewn a piece of leather on my tiller to act as a chafe guard when the ropes are tied to it. Last year, my rudder got a little too close to my raised outboard skeg and it wore a little knick in the blade during a storm. So now I rope it off so that the blade is a few inches off center and away from the outboard skeg. The only other thing that you need to be mindful of is when the blade pops up while you're motoring. The blade will hit the prop just about every time. Outside of that, you can't beat a kick-up rudder. The first thing I did for my kick-up blade was make a rudder blade hold-up pendant line for it using a brass fair lead on top of the rudder head, a self rescue clam cleat on top of the tiller, and 1/4" braid line. There are other ways to hold the blade up without drilling a hole in the blade, though.
Joe
My 1986 222 O' rudder had a foam core and was of a two peice design with the seam all around the edges. Being a tilt up design the blade wanted to float to the surface. There was a pendant and a special quick release jam cleat to keep the blade in the down position. Seems like a great design when these boats were new but now that we are getting age on our loved O'Days, some of the parts are not doing well ( foam rudder blades ) are one. When Mine broke I immediately blamed it on age of the fiberglass and getting brittle with time and water intrusion in the foam core freezing in the cold Ohio winters. I choose to get a new blade from D & R Marine and am extremely happy I did. It is made extra heavy and the fit was perfect. The boat sails well. Delivery time was 10 Days I beleive. I would do it again but with the new solid rudder blade I don't think I'll need to.
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My rudder blade broke in the same area as yours did, Chuck. On the day that mine broke, my boat hit one of the pilings at the Fall River Ma. drawbridge which caused some damage to the toe rail and gunwale strip on my boat. Now we're finding out that these rudder blades are failing on some of the larger O'Day boats. I went through two of these blades in the 1990s. One has to wonder about how good they were to begin with. I really feel that I was cheated and the company that manufactured these blades should have compensated the owners of these boats for their loss.
Joe
To prevent the outboard propeller from hitting the rudder blade we had a guard on our outboard. What we did was cut a "half-moon" shape out of plexiglass or lexan and bolt it to the anti-ventilation plate on the outboard on the side towards the rudder. The plastic plate sticks out just slightly farther than the propeller's tips and the rudder would hit that plate instead of the propeller. That was on our CAL 21, and she had a mahogany rudder, I also used a plate like this on my old WIDGEON, although that was more to protest the prop....the rudder was aluminum and the prop was plastic!
I thought I had a photo of the plate on the outboard, but can't find it now. I'll keep looking!
I thought I had a photo of the plate on the outboard, but can't find it now. I'll keep looking!
I had used the "investment" angle when I bought a new Tohatsu 6hp and motor mount.
The old motor stopped on us multiple times (even after 3 trips to the mechanic).
The last time...it was about 95 degrees, no wind and we were in the middle of the lake with our two boys (6 and 3 year old).
Finally managed to get enough wind to make it back to our mooring.
After that, she went along with the new motor.
Anything after that, I thought I would be pushing my luck.
I am in the market for a larger jib.....anybody have one for sale????
Kevin
The old motor stopped on us multiple times (even after 3 trips to the mechanic).
The last time...it was about 95 degrees, no wind and we were in the middle of the lake with our two boys (6 and 3 year old).
Finally managed to get enough wind to make it back to our mooring.
After that, she went along with the new motor.
Anything after that, I thought I would be pushing my luck.
I am in the market for a larger jib.....anybody have one for sale????
Kevin
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