Rudder problems.

[Jenni]

My rudder recetly failed rather spectacularly, and here is my story for any that are interested.

We were participating in the annual Cloud 9 race from Peter's Rock (half way between Coburg and Port Hope) ON to Point Breeze NY about 30 NM. We sailed across Lake Ontario on the Saturday and stayed overnight in Oak Orchards Yacht club in NY. The second leg the race we retun to Peter’s rock across the lake. We set out from Oak Orchard at 9AM we had five to six foot waves with a 20-25 mph wind from the SW with gusts up to 30mph. We were heading almost due north on a broad reach with the Genoa and Main sail set. We were making between 6-7 knts speed. Just past the weather buoy in the middle of Lake Ontario we noticed that the boat started to head up into the wind when ever a gust would hit and we couldn't seem to hold course even with the rudder hard over. We also noticed that their was practically no resistance on the tiller even when hard over.
We took a look over the back and saw the rudder at a very strange angle. We immediately dropped sail and pulled the rudder off the back of the boat. It was as you can see in the pictures. We tried to bend the sides in a bit and to splint the rudder using duct tape and our emergency paddle. We then put it back on and tried to hold a course while under power. This broke the paddle and the rudder hit prop nearly immediately. We pulled the rudder back inboard and proceeded back using the outboard alone to steer her in. Now I don't know if your familiar with the motor well on the back of a 26D but it is sunk down into the lazarette on the port side. There is only enough room in the well for the motor head to swing about 2 inches to port and 1 inch to starboard. So with this limitation and the large waves that day we swung back and forth drunkenly as we kept our eyes firmly glued on the cartplotter and compass mounted on the starboard cabin wall. Three of four hours latter we arrived in Coburg. We managed to make it across the harbour to the boat ramp where we tied up and called for a ride back to Port Hope so we could pick up the car and our trailer, and hauled the boat.

I contacted the rudder's manufacturer, and after they saw the pictures they offered to replace it right away. So my rudder is currently "in the mail".

So what spectacular failures have you had on your cruises this year, and please feel free to coment on how you would deal with a problem like the one I had.

 

[Joe]

overpowered... under rigged

That rudder is just not designed to take that kind of pressure. It looks like a rudder designed for a dinghy with its hinged bracket and kick up line. I'm assuming you had the centerboard down to help take the pressure, so next time you get in those conditions.... reef. Get the sailplan balanced.

I would seriously consider looking for a beefed up version of that rudder, or perhaps adding some support to the bracket that's bent. But in reality the rudder's design is the main problem. Look at the rudders on other similarly sized sailboats and you'll see what I mean. Good luck.

 

[Ray T]

Lack of good engineering

Jenni, I am somewhat appalled at your flimsy rudder. The designer or the builder should have known that a boat your size might encounter heavy weather somewhere along the way. I hope your new rudder has been beefed up to handle the weather you are bound to encounter. While you are dealing with the rudder you might check the rest of the boat for weak points. If you don't feel competent to do this you might consider hiring a surveyor. I hope you have safe sailing in the future. Ray T.

 

[bffatcat]

Broken rudder

I hate to be redundant but, replacing that lightly built rudder with what was on there is not a good Idea. I suggest making a template of the old
rudder. Take it to a lumber mill. get a new one made of solid oak. Make it much heavier than the old one. apply at least 3 layers of glass and resin.
Replace the pintels and gudgeons with much heavier stock than the original.
Next time you get out in a stiff breeze reef your main and jib accordingly so you can get a balanced helm. Avoid excessive weather helm. Be careful
not to put to much strain on a lightly built boat. Next time you get out in a stiff breeze and your new rudder seems ok but youve got a lot of helm, reef down immediately. Next time the rudder might hold but you could wind up with a
transom failure instead which is worse. Again Be careful

Bffatcat

 

[Timo42]

Rush to judgement

Lets not be so quick to condemn the design here. The pictures don't show enough detail to determine what failed, could be the welder had an off day, could have been the result of previously unnoticed damage, sailing outside of design conditions, or any of a number of reasons. The fact that the manufacturer stepped right up and replaced the unit without question is a good thing. This is a performance rudder for small boats and it works far better than the original hunk of fiberglass that came with these boats, which is no longer available by the way. I have no relation with the company except as a satisfied customer with this rudder on my boat who wants to see small companies with good ideas that fill a niche succeed. The pivot is a weak point, but the kick up design is a compromise for use in shallow water and while trailering and launching and this design looks stronger than similar rudders I have seen on other boats and is much easier to use.Until we see a pattern of failures, why not congratulate the OP for thinking their way out of a potentially bad situation and the mfg for stepping up to the plate. Tim

 

[Jenni]

A little more detail

The long tube from the tiller is made of stainless box tubeing and is by far more ridgid than the original rudder. The two bent out peices are also stainless steel and seem very strong. The part of the rudder that failed was the weld that help the stainless sideplates to the box tubeing. The HDPE rudder blade itself was fine. I was actually very suprised that it broke were it did. I had expected that if it was going to break it would be the plastic that sheared off.

I would not be suprissed to find out that the whole problem was caused a welder haveing a bad day.

 

[Blake]

O B steering

Jenni, I put the same the rudder(blade only) on my 26S this season. It is reasurring to see that the SS failed before the HDPE. Gives me alot of confidence in my new blade. Still carry the old one as a spare, but always thought that I would just motor in using the O.B. to steer as you did. I have an 8hp, 2 stroke Tohatsu, and am able to turn it to port, all the way to the stops and if I fold up the O.B. tiller handle, can turn it all the way to starboard as well. Chris and Lennore even mounted a handle on the top cover of ther O.B. for tight manuvering. Of course they use the rudder in conjuction with the O.B. Your post makes me want to try steering without the rudder next time I'm out. I am curiose as to what motor you are using? 4 strokes are heavier, but are they bigger as well? I would think that you should be able to turn your O.B. further from side to side.
At any rate, congrats on your handling of a trying situation!

 

[Jenni]

Outboard

I have a 9.9 4 stroke Yamaha motor, with remote throttle and electric start. I think the biggest problem steering whith my motor was that it dosn't have a steering arm on it. So when you want to turn it you had to read down and grab the carrying handle, or just turn it by the motor houseing. After this experiance I think I am going to rig up some way to attach a tiller to the top of the motor. The other really tireing part of steering with my motor is that it is tightend up so it does not turn easily. wich of course is great if you have a rudder to steer with.

 

[Joe]

don't rationalize, please

the reason the rudder broke was because it was too weak for the conditions. If that means the welder had a bad day.... well how can you verify that? Btw isn't that the responsibility of the company's quality control
department. If there was one bad welder day.... could you assume there may be more. Please, don't rationalize about this issue just because you love your boat. I love my C27 but I'm not sailing off to Hawaii in it because I know its limitations. You are lucky enough to have survived one of your boat's limitations and now you have to use that experience to avoid another similar incident. There are three things you can do. 1 avoid the conditions that caused the failure 2. increase the strength of the equipment and 3. learn to trim the boat so there will be less stress on the rudder bracket.

Over time the rudder became wobbly inside the bracket and eventually the stress of heavy weather helm caused it to fail. You should learn to trim you boat so that there is no more that 5 degrees of weather helm. Weather helm is the propensity for the boat to round up into the wind... so that means keeping the boat flat. Depower the sail plan, move the ballast (crew) to weather, drop the centerboard.

You can also change your point of sail for a more comfortable ride... it might take longer to get there but it might be worth less wear and tear onthe boat and its crew.

Finally you could consider a fixed bracket rudder rather than the kick up design. Unless you beach your boat a lot, I can't think of any reason for the kick up feature. Just remove it when you put it on the trailer. Good luck.

 

[Blake]

5 Degrees?

Joe, I understand weather helm and get your point about minimizing it, but don't understand how you measure it in degrees. Please explain.

 

[dancing bear]

Re: 5 Degrees?

I have that type of rudder on my Mac 25, but with the original rudder castle. That stainless does not look as beefy as my rudder castle. How thick is the stainless anyway?

 

[tommays]

The way that is designed makes it hard for the welder to have a good day because without a special TIG torch all you can do is make a pass on the outside seam as it to narrow to weld inside the channel that is formed