Rope to wire halyard rope length?

[Jaxg]

Why do i have such long rope on these halyards (has to

be 50+ ft) ? The boat is a 1980 hunter 37c. The only thing that makes any sense to me is if it were related to a spinnaker or they are there to help haul something heavy aboard. Im a new owner and still figuring out the intricacies of this boat. Thanks in advance.
Greg

 

[Will Gilmore]

It looks like the halyard is temporarily connected to a preventer or a vang just to stow it off the mast and prevent annoying halyard slap.

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[Jaxg]

4:1 block and tackle to reduce halyard slap, that’s a lot of line and hardware to achieve such a simple objective. But I don’t see how this setup achieves any added structural integrity. Just seems odd. Thanks for the response.

 

[Joe]

4:1 block and tackle to reduce halyard slap, that’s a lot of line and hardware to achieve such a simple objective. But I don’t see how this setup achieves any added structural integrity. Just seems odd. Thanks for the response.

Why do you think that line is a halyard. A wire to rope halyard is a length of rope splice to a length or line to create one long stretch of halyard.

 

[Jaxg]

A steel line coming from the mast terminating at the deck/hull in my uneducated mind is typically a halyard. I understand the true definition, of a “wire to rope” halyard, you are correct that is not what this is. I just don’t know how else to categorize this piece of rigging, and I clearly don’t understand its purpose.

 

[Will Gilmore]

It isn't a piece of rigging as such. It looks to be a headsail halyard that has been temporarily attached to an unrelated piece of rigging just as a matter of convenience. The block and tackle look like a preventer or a vang, maybe a sheet, considering how much line is on it. The 4:1 leverage is incidental. It just happens to be a conveniently availible way to attach the halyard to something else that needs to be tied down. Unless... is this a gaff or gunter rig? No! You said Hunter.
Actually, that eye at the end looks more like a stay than a halyard. That's a running backstay. It's not a halyard at all.

Sorry for the lack of perception in my previous post.

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[Will Gilmore]

Nope! That makes no sense either. Part of the lazy jack system? It sure doesn't appear to be a halyard. There's no block and tackle system on the port stay?

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[Will Gilmore]

Humm! I'm back to running stay.

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[Jaxg]

Lazy jacks!!! This really makes the most sense to me. I think the block and tackle and amount of line was just crazy to me. Thanks guys! And I’m ears open to other suggestions...

 

[Will Gilmore]

You can see them in this sales video of a '81. They don't seem to be lazy jacks.

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[Jim Legere]

What you have there are running backstays. All Hunter 37 Cutters came with them. They are used to support the mast at the top of the inner forestay for the staysail. When you are sailing in heavy winds with a reefed main and just the staysail (no jib) you may find the mast 'pumps' a bit. By clipping the windward backstay to the toe rail somewhere around the forward end of the cockpit and cranking down on the block and tackle, the mast will be stabilized. Probably not required in anything under 30 knots of wind.

 

[Jaxg]

What you have there are running backstays. All Hunter 37 Cutters came with them. They are used to support the mast at the top of the inner forestay for the staysail. When you are sailing in heavy winds with a reefed main and just the staysail (no jib) you may find the mast 'pumps' a bit. By clipping the windward backstay to the toe rail somewhere around the forward end of the cockpit and cranking down on the block and tackle, the mast will be stabilized. Probably not required in anything under 30 knots of wind.

Thanks for the explanation. That would i guess account for what i considered as excess line on the block and tackle. If you are moving it to different anchor points on the toe rail you are changing the length needed by every minor adjustment. Sounds like a race option, but something I’d like to research and understand a lot more than I do. I never plan on racing but i love heavy weather, and want to keep the boat in one piece. My background is hobie (every size), nacra, thistle, laser. But i just recently found out that i was now old, so i bought a big slow boat, and love it!! Lots to learn! Thanks to everyone for taking the time.

 

[Jim Legere]

...Sounds like a race option, but something I’d like to research and understand a lot more than I do. I never plan on racing but i love heavy weather, and want to keep the boat in one piece. My background is hobie (every size), nacra, thistle, laser. But i just recently found out that i was now old, so i bought a big slow boat, and love it!! Lots to learn! Thanks to everyone for taking the time.

Using the running backstays is not really a "race option"; its more of a heavy weather/bluewater sailing thing. Who told you a Hunter 37 Cutter is slow? I think you will be surprised by how it performs against other boats of similar size, especially when the wind pipes up! And you might want to talk with Blaise Pascal who has won many ocean racing trophies on his H37C Midnight Sun (he converted to a sloop rig for racing).

 

[Johnb]

Jim got it right. That is a running backstay. You should have two. Note that they attach to the mast at the level of the inner forestay.

As Jim says the go to arrangement for heavy weather is deeply reefed main and staysail jib. I take the back stays far enough aft that the main boom can clear them so no need to mess with them any further. Then you have a mast supported at the lowers, at the level of the inner forestay and at the top. On double reefed main and staysail alone she turns into a easy to handle self tending pussycat.

And they are not slow.

 

[DianaOfBurlington]

Only Jim got it right! Sheesh.

No; running backs are NOT a 'race option'; they're actually a requirement, as you can't fly the inner staysail without them. Remember ALL aluminum spars are meant to be used IN COMPRESSION - any lateral or torsional load on one will make it fail. Therefore, stressing the middle of an aluminum spar (such as the inner forestay) without its corresponding backstays (these runners) can be disastrous. ANY time the inner staysail is up, the runner(s) must be tensioned accordingly.

Then we have people who insist on doing away with the inner forestay and the runners because they're 'so complicated'. If you look at it, nothing could be simpler. The cutter is infinitely more versatile, and stronger, than the sloop. I actually added runners and (removable) inner forestay to my H25. In certain conditions it's absolutely ideal.

Thanks, Jim.

 

[Will Gilmore]

Only Jim got it right! Sheesh.

Oh man, my ego.

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[DianaOfBurlington]

Oh man, my ego.

-Will (Dragonfly)

Hahaha, Will; you said it was a halyard drawn off 'to a preventer or a vang just to stow it off the mast and prevent annoying halyard slap. '

Look at the WIRE, gang - it's 1x19 rigging wire. No WAY that could be a halyard - you will NEVER bend that around any sheave less than about 2 ft in diameter. Halyards are 7x7 for flexibility. Sometimes centerboard lifts are 7x19. ALL rigging should be 1x19 (and I exclude rod for a reason).

I admit when I first saw this thread title I came in fully-loaded to rail against wire-to-rope halyards in this day and age. No reason for them again, ever. Even if you doubted the integrity of good solid yacht-grade double-braid (and why should you, ever?), you could go to Dyneema for the whole length of the halyard and (observing the reduced longevity due to bending it over a sheave at the top of the mast) you would have something many times stronger than the antiquated rope-to-halyard splice could ever be (and, just barking here, the longevity of the Dyneema, while a limitation, would probably outlast the stupid rope-to-halyard splice, which will become 'hairy' and 'burr-y' after barely a few seasons).

 

[Will Gilmore]

I did conclude, in the end, that it was a running stay and I wasn't even sure there was a second one on the port side.
However, I admit that my thoughts did ramble over several posts before I got there.


-Will (Dragonfly)