Rigging replacement

[higgs]

Interesting discussion on this topic is starting on another thread so I thought I'd move it here.I am curious to know how many of you replace all the rigging on your boat and at what intervals? Do you do it after 10 years, 15, 20, or have never done it.I inspect my rigging yearly and replace any parts that look suspect. I have always owned old boats - 20 years old or more and never done a wholesale replacement.

 

[Mike]

31 Years for me

I bought a '75 C22 in 2003. Replaced the forestay in 2004 and increased the size from 1/8" to 5/32" because I was installing a CDI furler, and was giving up the redundancy of the jib luff, so I wanted a little extra safety factor there. I Replaced the chainplates with Catalina Direct's heavier upgrade kit in 2005 and rebuilt all of the standing rigging myself over the winter of 2006, again with 5/32" wire rope. It cost me 1/3 the cost of shipping the rigging and paying for them to do what I can do. I also get to keep the swaging tool I bought and can do future work on rigging for friends when needed.http://www.go2marine.com/search.do?q=wire+rope

 

[Mke]

swaging tool

Here's a link to the site for buying a swaging tool.http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/topages/swagingtool.php

 

[Brian M H23]

Reusable fittings

What do people use at the top of their forestays with the reusable fittings? It doesnt appear that they sell a T fitting...

 

[Tim R.]

Fine for small boats but

I want all my swages done on a proper press. If you want to DIY, use mechanical fittings such as Sta-Loc.Yearly inspections. I try not to let any of my standing rigging go more than 10 years even though it is stored inside a heated room with the mast. I am rotating out everything on my boat now(not sure how old it is but at least 10 years). New headstay last year with the Furlex, new lowers this year, new uppers and intermediates next year, new back stay year after that. my rigger says everything checks out fine but I will sleep better knowing the age and quality of what is going on.Tim R.

 

[Robert Gainer]

Mike,

Mike,That’s a nicropress tool and it’s not so good for standing rigging. Yes I know some small boats have the wires done that way but the ends will not hold 100% the strength of the wire. A real swager will put an end on that will hole more then the rated strength of the wire. A small swager will cast over 5,000 dollars and is limited to wire less then 7/32”. One example is www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/topages/kearneyswag.php and this is one type I have and use for my lifelines and halyards. For my standing rigging I use my Wire-Teknik A200 which cost more then my boat when you add all the attachments and a full set of dies for wire ranging from 1/16” up to 5/16”. With something as important as standing rigging I don’t think you should kid around and you need to have it done right. Either use swage-less ends or have a good shop put swage fittings on and leave the nicropress for lightly loaded jobs.All the best,Robert Gainer

 

[Maine Sail]

Any time..

Any time I buy a used boat and the previous owner can't prove to me that the standing rigging has been replaced in the last 8 years I replace it period. Considering the price of a mast and the fact that I was on a boat that lost a mast I take NO chances. All my rigging is swaged at the top and mechanical at the bottom. I don't like swages at the bottom in New England. My rigger tells me that in 25 years he's seen less than 1% of the swaged fitting failures occur at the top of the mast. I used Norseman fittings this time but the Sta-Locks are just as good. If you are replacing 304 with 316 you may need to go up one wire size due to lower load ratings for the more corrosion resistant 316 stainless vs. 304..

 

[Maine Sail]

Mke

Please try and refrain from suggesting dangerous and sub par methods for swaging standing rigging. While most on this forum know that a $17.00 tool is NOT intended for standing rigging there is always some cheapskate that will try it and hurt themselves or worse someone else when they loose the stick. The only decent use for that tool IMHO is to crimp battery lugs onto battery cable. It's not even safe for lifelines. Would you hoist a 30 footer out of the water with a set of $12.99 Wal*Mart ratchet straps or would you prefer the right tool like a diesel powered travel lift?

 

[Robert Gainer]

Use Dyform and get the advantage of 316 stainless

Maine Sail,Use Dyform and get the advantage of 316 stainless without loosing any strength while using the same diameter. Makes to easy to keep the same size clevis pins.All the best,Robert Gainer

 

[Warren Milberg]

Usually the time to

replace your standing rigging is when you start thinking about it a lot. When you go out on a very windy, look up at the rig, and ask yourself "....is this the day it'll fail....". Then you know its time. I had oversize rigging on a small C&C some years ago that looked good at the deck level, but I new it was the original stuff and many years old. I eased the replacement cost pain by replacing the fore and back stays one year, and the shrouds the next. When I inspected the old rigging at home and with a magnifying glass, I found a tiny hairline fracture just beginning in one of the upper shroud swages.... It really was time.

 

[Capt Ron;-)]

Educational forum

Robert both you, Mr. Maine Sail+ Tim R have put up some good informative posts here.I am convinced Mr. Gainer that you know rigging better than I, not saying THAT much, what you say does make sense and you are undoubtedly a gentleman by your manner.My point, and I am mainly repeating what I have read or picked up just being round it and rigging my own (Lord knows I would not rig for another) is that when it comes to rigging conservative is not a bad thing and better early than late.Further, I have seen many expensive yachts sparkeling from sanding, varnish, polish and many hours to look pretty, then I find that the rig is twenty-odd years old and the owner, who spends mucho to 'look' good or on electronics not really needed, is very reluctant to put some $$ into rigging to protect his guests and crew. If it cannot be seen, for oos & ahhs, or played with, it isn't worth the $$ is the attitude I have seen oft in my sailing career.welllll its back to work you swabs, happy Monday....;-)

 

[Roger (Ninette Manitoba)]

Small boat rigging

I sail a 20' 1300# boat with a swing keel, and a 24' stick. It has a forestay, backstay, upper and lowers. What is a ball park figure for replacement of the standing rigging, (excluding turnbuckles which I replaced this year? Am I looking at a few hundred or several hundred for 5/32" ss?

 

[Robert Gainer]

Nothing wrong with being conservative

Capt. Ron,Nothing wrong with being conservative and after all it’s about what makes you comfortable. Also it’s all about percentages. You have a small, very small chance of rig failure when a boat is brand new because of mistakes or defective materials. I think everybody accepts this without any problems. As the rig ages the chance of failure increases until the risk is unacceptable to the owner and then the rigging is replaced. Replacing the wire every 10 years means you have a 99.99% chance that you will never have a dismasting with the .01% representing the early failure due to mistakes etc. It doesn’t get any better then that unless you have an un-stayed mast. What is the chance of failure at 15 or 20 years expressed as a percentage? That would be an interesting number and if it was something you could look up it would make this discussion superfluous. But I have not run across such a study so we all need to look at the available information and make our own choices. Obviously I am willing to accept more risk then you (I sail 22 foot boats trans-Atlantic just to prove it) but as I always say my decisions are correct for my application at the time and represent only one data point among many when it becomes time for your own decisions.All the best,Robert Gainer

 

[Doug]

Tossing the dice

I just bought my 21 yo 38 and the rigging withstood a gale when I was bringing her home even though I've no idea of it's age. In considering that the next 3 years it will only see Chesapeake good weather weekending I chose to replace only the forestay when resteppping the mast after it's truck ride for the final leg of the journey home. The rigger said I should do a full refit but the bottom line being $7,500+ (figure $8,500+ by the time it's over) is a lot of boat bucks to me. Maybe a mistake, time will tell, but the rest will get done before I head off shore again. I think it depends on how you plan to use it. My first 23'er had loose individual wires to cut your hands on the sidestays but it never fell down as I didn't know any better. God looks out for babies and drunks.

 

[Robert Gainer]

RiggingOnly is a good place to get a price

Roger,RiggingOnly is a good place to get a price. You can check their web site at ww.riggingonly.com or give them a call at 508-992-0434. They are not the only source with a good price but the advice and support from them is priceless.All the best,Robert Gainer5/32” wire is about $0.81 per foot and a swage is $4.94 each with a small charge to do the swaging.

 

[Tim R.]

Failure stats can be hard to get

Because of many variables most people don't consider:How much is the boat used(Put away in the winter)?How is the boat used(racing, coastal cruising, offshore)?Is the boat stored with stick up(water collecting in the swages)?Is the boat stored in a freezing environment(expansion and contraction of ice)?Is the boat used in fresh or salt water?Quality of parts and workmanship(new kid gets to try out the swaging press!!)?etc..Tim R.