A new sailor I am, but handy with the hands. Someone told me the C22 I just bought needed the keel Faired. Could someone please explain this process and the material to use? Thanks Walt
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Pretty simple job...
To fair the keel sand off any paint from the keel. I prefer to use epoxy but you could also use polyester resin. If you're using epoxy (can be pricey) mix up the epoxy per the instructions and add a low density filler like West System's 410 microlight. Add the 410 to make the epoxy a peanut butter consistancy and then smear it all over your keel. Once the epoxy has hardened, sand fair, repeat if necessary and paint as required. The low density filler makes the epoxy easy to work with and easy to sand fair (make sure you don't confuse low density and high density filler. If you use the high density filler you'll be sanding all day). The cheaper route is polyester resin or even Bondo. Same thing here: sand, smear, sand fair, repeat and repaint. It's a pretty simple job. It doesn't need to be perfect, it only needs to be better than before you started.
To fair the keel sand off any paint from the keel. I prefer to use epoxy but you could also use polyester resin. If you're using epoxy (can be pricey) mix up the epoxy per the instructions and add a low density filler like West System's 410 microlight. Add the 410 to make the epoxy a peanut butter consistancy and then smear it all over your keel. Once the epoxy has hardened, sand fair, repeat if necessary and paint as required. The low density filler makes the epoxy easy to work with and easy to sand fair (make sure you don't confuse low density and high density filler. If you use the high density filler you'll be sanding all day). The cheaper route is polyester resin or even Bondo. Same thing here: sand, smear, sand fair, repeat and repaint. It's a pretty simple job. It doesn't need to be perfect, it only needs to be better than before you started.
not so simple
If your going to the trouble of removing the keel from the boat, you should inspect the pivot hole in the keel and/or replace the pivot pin, hangers, bolts cable, turning ball, tube and even the winch. My keel pivot hole was completely elongated and the keel wobled all over the place. I took the keel to a local machine shop, had it sandblasted to bare metal, primed with Pematex rust inhibitor, had them re-machine the pivot hole square to the centerline of the keel both fore to aft and top to bottom and press in a Stainless steel bushing (316 grade). Catalina Direct has a video kit that describes the process that includes a template for fairing the keel. It is important to keep the fairing equal on both sides of the keel or your performance will change on opposite tacks. After I was satisfied with the shape, I added a barrier coat (stripped and did the hull too) and anti fouling ablative paint. When I did mine I also added the anti clunck pads and they are worth it. It was a lot of work, but I did the whole job and that was 4 years ago and its holding up just fine. Its time to paint the bottom again and drop the keel just to make sure. (after the season is thru, its nicer on the water than in the back yard)
If your going to the trouble of removing the keel from the boat, you should inspect the pivot hole in the keel and/or replace the pivot pin, hangers, bolts cable, turning ball, tube and even the winch. My keel pivot hole was completely elongated and the keel wobled all over the place. I took the keel to a local machine shop, had it sandblasted to bare metal, primed with Pematex rust inhibitor, had them re-machine the pivot hole square to the centerline of the keel both fore to aft and top to bottom and press in a Stainless steel bushing (316 grade). Catalina Direct has a video kit that describes the process that includes a template for fairing the keel. It is important to keep the fairing equal on both sides of the keel or your performance will change on opposite tacks. After I was satisfied with the shape, I added a barrier coat (stripped and did the hull too) and anti fouling ablative paint. When I did mine I also added the anti clunck pads and they are worth it. It was a lot of work, but I did the whole job and that was 4 years ago and its holding up just fine. Its time to paint the bottom again and drop the keel just to make sure. (after the season is thru, its nicer on the water than in the back yard)
dont use bondo on ur keel
either resin or the epoxy which is what i used. bondo and water.. really not a good thing. even if you seal it with somethin. definitely put on some kind of rust inhibitor,before anything else and do the filler with epoxy if u go that way, otherwise the epoxy gets way to liquidity to make it go where u want it to and stay there.even with filler its not that easy to do sometimes.but epoxy and filler is like working with bondo.spread and sand and spread some more, then sand again. it isnt hard to do. and always wear a dust mask when sanding..that stuff is killer on ur lungs ... have fun.. and yea if you've got the thing off.. replace everything else, it's not the hard to do or expensive. the hole in my keel for the pivot pin looked like,well, u know what a bug splatter on ur windshield looks like..? that was the shape of mine.I only assume it was round at one time..haha..the keel pin was worn more than 1/4 way thru. My boat is a 74 and I bet it was the first time any of this had been replaced. If u are going to do all this.. remember that keel is one heavy piece.If you goof up, it really can be a tragic oops.Like if it falls, let it, you aint gonna stop it.If it falls on ur hands or feet,um..keep the phone handy, You'll have to call for help.Try to get it on something that rolls. it will make ur life soooo much easier. check the archives, there are pictures of others who have done it.. good luck...
either resin or the epoxy which is what i used. bondo and water.. really not a good thing. even if you seal it with somethin. definitely put on some kind of rust inhibitor,before anything else and do the filler with epoxy if u go that way, otherwise the epoxy gets way to liquidity to make it go where u want it to and stay there.even with filler its not that easy to do sometimes.but epoxy and filler is like working with bondo.spread and sand and spread some more, then sand again. it isnt hard to do. and always wear a dust mask when sanding..that stuff is killer on ur lungs ... have fun.. and yea if you've got the thing off.. replace everything else, it's not the hard to do or expensive. the hole in my keel for the pivot pin looked like,well, u know what a bug splatter on ur windshield looks like..? that was the shape of mine.I only assume it was round at one time..haha..the keel pin was worn more than 1/4 way thru. My boat is a 74 and I bet it was the first time any of this had been replaced. If u are going to do all this.. remember that keel is one heavy piece.If you goof up, it really can be a tragic oops.Like if it falls, let it, you aint gonna stop it.If it falls on ur hands or feet,um..keep the phone handy, You'll have to call for help.Try to get it on something that rolls. it will make ur life soooo much easier. check the archives, there are pictures of others who have done it.. good luck...
It's as simple a job as YOU keep it...
Why can't you just lower the keel and fair it on the boat? I've been a sailboat owner for less than a year but I am quickly learning that sailboat owners are either the most anal, uptight worry warts, always preparing for the worst no matter how minor the current problem, or they like to spend all their time working and preping their boats so they have no time to go sailing. My boat is not the prettiest in the marina but the engine works, the lights work, the rigging is decent and the sails will make it one more season, but the boat gets used and used well. Used more than almost any other boat in the marina. I see these beautiful boats sit unused for months on end. Sure their "captains" show up on weekends to wash the bird poop off and sit around telling stories about going or wanting to go to the Bahamas or where ever, but their boat just sits. Walt, if you're racing your C22 you want to do the best possible job at fairing the keel and you want to do the job right. It WILL make a difference. If you're afraid of your boat and you don't want to sail, you can fair that keel till the cows come home and no one will think any less of you. If you want to just go sailing, don't worry about the keel, you can fair it later (after all you didn't know it needed faired till someone told you it needed it). If the keel is just killing you now that you know it needs faired, pull the boat out of the water, crank the keel down, and fair what you can and go sailing. Keep it as simple (or not so simple) as you like. I say sail it now and fair it over the winter and I'll see ya out there!
Why can't you just lower the keel and fair it on the boat? I've been a sailboat owner for less than a year but I am quickly learning that sailboat owners are either the most anal, uptight worry warts, always preparing for the worst no matter how minor the current problem, or they like to spend all their time working and preping their boats so they have no time to go sailing. My boat is not the prettiest in the marina but the engine works, the lights work, the rigging is decent and the sails will make it one more season, but the boat gets used and used well. Used more than almost any other boat in the marina. I see these beautiful boats sit unused for months on end. Sure their "captains" show up on weekends to wash the bird poop off and sit around telling stories about going or wanting to go to the Bahamas or where ever, but their boat just sits. Walt, if you're racing your C22 you want to do the best possible job at fairing the keel and you want to do the job right. It WILL make a difference. If you're afraid of your boat and you don't want to sail, you can fair that keel till the cows come home and no one will think any less of you. If you want to just go sailing, don't worry about the keel, you can fair it later (after all you didn't know it needed faired till someone told you it needed it). If the keel is just killing you now that you know it needs faired, pull the boat out of the water, crank the keel down, and fair what you can and go sailing. Keep it as simple (or not so simple) as you like. I say sail it now and fair it over the winter and I'll see ya out there!
Hold on there Greg
In sailing, like any other hobby, there are many aspects to enjoy. I enjoy sailing my C22 but I also enjoy working on it, planning future improvements, shopping and researching new additions (currently researching roller furling) and dreaming about where I might sail some day. It is all part of the joy of this hobby called sailing. Focus on the part you most enjoy but respect that others may get their kicks doing their own thing. Whatever floats you boat....
In sailing, like any other hobby, there are many aspects to enjoy. I enjoy sailing my C22 but I also enjoy working on it, planning future improvements, shopping and researching new additions (currently researching roller furling) and dreaming about where I might sail some day. It is all part of the joy of this hobby called sailing. Focus on the part you most enjoy but respect that others may get their kicks doing their own thing. Whatever floats you boat....
Do it in the Winter
I just finished the keel on my '79. It was not difficult, just time consuming. I followed the Catalina Direct video and good luck. I used West Systems epoxy with Microlight filler and then followed up with 6 coats of straight epoxy. It really needed building up near the top. It took three months at several hours per week and I wish I had started earlier in the Winter. Can't wait to go sailing!
I just finished the keel on my '79. It was not difficult, just time consuming. I followed the Catalina Direct video and good luck. I used West Systems epoxy with Microlight filler and then followed up with 6 coats of straight epoxy. It really needed building up near the top. It took three months at several hours per week and I wish I had started earlier in the Winter. Can't wait to go sailing!
PART OF THE CREW
Thanks a lot for the information gentlemen I feel like part of the crew already. I'll keep you posted how things work out with this project.
Thanks a lot for the information gentlemen I feel like part of the crew already. I'll keep you posted how things work out with this project.
Wow, was that my first rant?
Sorry if I was ranting. Maybe I misunderstood the kind of info Walt was looking for. It's just my instict to try to keep things as simple as possible. And Charlie, I hope you took no offence to my post. I've just been having a run of bad luck lately just trying to help people keep it simple. --Greg p.s. Walt, just go sailing!
Sorry if I was ranting. Maybe I misunderstood the kind of info Walt was looking for. It's just my instict to try to keep things as simple as possible. And Charlie, I hope you took no offence to my post. I've just been having a run of bad luck lately just trying to help people keep it simple. --Greg p.s. Walt, just go sailing!
Epoxy for Walt
Walt- I bought all the materials to do the same job on a MacGregor 22, but ended up selling the boat and getting my Catalina 22. So I have 3 gallons of brand new RAKA epoxy (similar to West System but less expensive) with a bunch of filler that I'm willing to sell you for cheap. Email me at greenpastures2304@yahoo.com if interested. Take care and good luck getting that keel cleaned up. Please heed Tom B's advice...i've dropped/raised/moved my Cat 22 keel a lot and it can hurt you bad if you're not careful. NEVER get any part of your body underneath the keel. ALWAYS leave the keel cable attached (unless replacing it) to help keep the keel from falling over to the side, and if you choose to drop the keel all the way out, you'll probably want to build some kind of support cradle to lower it into, to keep it from tipping over on you. good luck... Tom ps. A day without safety can mean a lifetime of pain.
Walt- I bought all the materials to do the same job on a MacGregor 22, but ended up selling the boat and getting my Catalina 22. So I have 3 gallons of brand new RAKA epoxy (similar to West System but less expensive) with a bunch of filler that I'm willing to sell you for cheap. Email me at greenpastures2304@yahoo.com if interested. Take care and good luck getting that keel cleaned up. Please heed Tom B's advice...i've dropped/raised/moved my Cat 22 keel a lot and it can hurt you bad if you're not careful. NEVER get any part of your body underneath the keel. ALWAYS leave the keel cable attached (unless replacing it) to help keep the keel from falling over to the side, and if you choose to drop the keel all the way out, you'll probably want to build some kind of support cradle to lower it into, to keep it from tipping over on you. good luck... Tom ps. A day without safety can mean a lifetime of pain.
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