I have a Hunter 40.5 with four 80 amp house batteries in parallel. I have a 30 amp three stage charger. I leave the two air cooled Adler Barbour units on between weekend cruises, sometimes for up to three weeks. In order to keep the batteries maintained I leave the battery charger on. In theory this should work fine, but last fall I found the batteries overheating and boiling all of the water out. I thought it might be just bad batteries, so I replaced them all. Everything has worked fine until this last week when I went to check the batteries and they had been cooking again, down about a half gallon of water in each. The batteries appear to be fine otherwise. So, here's my question...what is causing the three stage battery charger to stay at the higher voltage? Could this be summer heat related? Is my battery charger the cause? Incidently, the starting battery connected to the same battery charger on a separate leg has not boiled over. One other thought....two of the three legs of the battery charger are connected together I assume in order to provide more juice to the house battery group. Could that be the cause? I know this is not exactly refrigerator trouble, but it is directly related. Any help would be appreciated. JORUM III
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Rich Lemieux
Battery Problem
What charger do you have? I know of one charger that would keep the voltage on the batterys too high when a load (like refig) was on. With the load off it would work fine. BTW That same charger would require that the two lugs of the charger be connected together. Rich
What charger do you have? I know of one charger that would keep the voltage on the batterys too high when a load (like refig) was on. With the load off it would work fine. BTW That same charger would require that the two lugs of the charger be connected together. Rich
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Ralph Johnstone
Plagued by exactly the same problem ..........
........ as you have described here, Chris. The theory that I came up with is that the refrig. unit is just pulling enough amperage (> 2.0 amps)that the charger thinks it's all going to charge the batteries so it remains at the higher voltage to complete charging. The higher voltage (14.8 V)keeps forcing more amps into the battery and cooking them. What seems to back up this idea is that the problem disappears when the refrig. is disconnected. With the battery almost charged, I can watch the voltage slowly rise to 14.8 V and the amperage drop to 2.0 A. on a LINK 10 battery monitor. At that point, the amperage immediately drops to 0 and the voltage slowly drops to 13.5 V. The input is now between 0 and 0.1 amps and stays there indefinitely. With the refrig. connected, it won't come down from 14.8 V. Now, having said all that I still don't have a simple solution to the problem. Regards, s/v Island Hunter
........ as you have described here, Chris. The theory that I came up with is that the refrig. unit is just pulling enough amperage (> 2.0 amps)that the charger thinks it's all going to charge the batteries so it remains at the higher voltage to complete charging. The higher voltage (14.8 V)keeps forcing more amps into the battery and cooking them. What seems to back up this idea is that the problem disappears when the refrig. is disconnected. With the battery almost charged, I can watch the voltage slowly rise to 14.8 V and the amperage drop to 2.0 A. on a LINK 10 battery monitor. At that point, the amperage immediately drops to 0 and the voltage slowly drops to 13.5 V. The input is now between 0 and 0.1 amps and stays there indefinitely. With the refrig. connected, it won't come down from 14.8 V. Now, having said all that I still don't have a simple solution to the problem. Regards, s/v Island Hunter
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Rich Stidger
Rich is on to something.
Chris: Rich Stidger is on to something here. There were a boatload of problems with the Guest chargers (not smart, Smart Chargers). They were cooking batteries. Now why they don't cook the starter battery, is probably because it is maintaining the correct voltage. Depending on your setup Heart or Statpower, would be good alternatives to look at. The Statpower should be a direct replacement for your Guest unit (if that is what you have). The Heart unit would give you Inverter Power and a charger. Heart Interface, Statpower and Trace are all owned by Xantrex now.
Chris: Rich Stidger is on to something here. There were a boatload of problems with the Guest chargers (not smart, Smart Chargers). They were cooking batteries. Now why they don't cook the starter battery, is probably because it is maintaining the correct voltage. Depending on your setup Heart or Statpower, would be good alternatives to look at. The Statpower should be a direct replacement for your Guest unit (if that is what you have). The Heart unit would give you Inverter Power and a charger. Heart Interface, Statpower and Trace are all owned by Xantrex now.
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Ralph Johnstone
Steve, NOW you tell us ...........................
............ of all the problems with Guest chargers. That was the Hunter factory issue on our 1999 H310. I spoke to Mike Thomas at Hunter a few weeks back and he said they no longer installed Guest chargers but he did put me in contact with the Guest manufacturer. The manufacturer said they no longer produce that particular model due to "technological upgrades" In other words ..... it didn't work. An upgrade may be the only answer. Cheaper than replacing batteries every year. Regards, s/v Island Hunter
............ of all the problems with Guest chargers. That was the Hunter factory issue on our 1999 H310. I spoke to Mike Thomas at Hunter a few weeks back and he said they no longer installed Guest chargers but he did put me in contact with the Guest manufacturer. The manufacturer said they no longer produce that particular model due to "technological upgrades" In other words ..... it didn't work. An upgrade may be the only answer. Cheaper than replacing batteries every year. Regards, s/v Island Hunter
Ralph, I have CRS but..........
Ralph: I have the dreaded CRS disease, but sometimes if you wake up one of those dead brain cells I remember things. You are correct, get rid of the guest chargers and you will be money ahead. I got a StatPower 40 and it seems to work fine. No noise and it is a realtively small package. I paid about $370 for the unit I bought. You really need to decide if you want/need a inverter or not. If the inverter is NOT in your budget, these units come highly recommended. I think that they also have a unit that has both the charger and the inverter but that was not in the cards for me. I purchased the unit from Back Woods Solar www.backwoodssolar.com
Ralph: I have the dreaded CRS disease, but sometimes if you wake up one of those dead brain cells I remember things. You are correct, get rid of the guest chargers and you will be money ahead. I got a StatPower 40 and it seems to work fine. No noise and it is a realtively small package. I paid about $370 for the unit I bought. You really need to decide if you want/need a inverter or not. If the inverter is NOT in your budget, these units come highly recommended. I think that they also have a unit that has both the charger and the inverter but that was not in the cards for me. I purchased the unit from Back Woods Solar www.backwoodssolar.com
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John Nixon
Battery Chargers
I am in the marine electrical service and sales business, and am also the Master Distributor for Lifeline Batteries in Texas. The only stand alone battery chargers I can recommend without reservation are the StatPower Truecharge 20 and 40 units with the optional battery temperature sensors. Any of the included battery charger functions in the current Freedom inverters are also very good if you need or want quick and quiet AC available for convenience loads, or if you have larger battery banks that need more charging capability the the 40 amp maximum from the StatPower products. The most common failure mode I see for batteries in boats is long term over-charging, generally at the hands of poorly designed chargers. Many charger designs try to be "universal" in their application to the 3 main battery technologies: flooded, gel, and AGM. This will never result in satisfactory results. Additionally, many less expensive chargers have rediculously high maximum output voltages that are disasters waiting to happen. As others have noted, save yourself a lot of money and trouble in the long run and replace your old charger with one of the units I have mentioned. You won't be sorry, and your batteries will thank you.
I am in the marine electrical service and sales business, and am also the Master Distributor for Lifeline Batteries in Texas. The only stand alone battery chargers I can recommend without reservation are the StatPower Truecharge 20 and 40 units with the optional battery temperature sensors. Any of the included battery charger functions in the current Freedom inverters are also very good if you need or want quick and quiet AC available for convenience loads, or if you have larger battery banks that need more charging capability the the 40 amp maximum from the StatPower products. The most common failure mode I see for batteries in boats is long term over-charging, generally at the hands of poorly designed chargers. Many charger designs try to be "universal" in their application to the 3 main battery technologies: flooded, gel, and AGM. This will never result in satisfactory results. Additionally, many less expensive chargers have rediculously high maximum output voltages that are disasters waiting to happen. As others have noted, save yourself a lot of money and trouble in the long run and replace your old charger with one of the units I have mentioned. You won't be sorry, and your batteries will thank you.
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Richard
Shore power for 12-volt refrigeration
The BD compressors must be connected to battery. The suggestion to connect refrigeration direct to charger will cause the electronic unit to fail. There are many Deafness compressors running from shore power. The answer is step voltage charger either temperature controlled or a third stage charge that will stay in when refrigerator is running. I presented a talk on this subject at SSCA annual meeting, last year. You can read it on my web site. I have two boats at my dock with Adler Barbour refrigeration. One 15-year-old unit has run continuous for 6 years with a three step 10 amps. Guest charger. Add water every two months. The second runs from batteries charged by Heart link 20 with third stage set to 13.05 volts I check water and maybe add every six months. Dick Kollmann http://www.Kollmann-marine.com
The BD compressors must be connected to battery. The suggestion to connect refrigeration direct to charger will cause the electronic unit to fail. There are many Deafness compressors running from shore power. The answer is step voltage charger either temperature controlled or a third stage charge that will stay in when refrigerator is running. I presented a talk on this subject at SSCA annual meeting, last year. You can read it on my web site. I have two boats at my dock with Adler Barbour refrigeration. One 15-year-old unit has run continuous for 6 years with a three step 10 amps. Guest charger. Add water every two months. The second runs from batteries charged by Heart link 20 with third stage set to 13.05 volts I check water and maybe add every six months. Dick Kollmann http://www.Kollmann-marine.com
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Chris Behre
Thanks
You have all confirmed my thoughts that the Guest charger just can't handle the chore. I'm off to the store looking for a temperature compensated Statpower. Much cheaper than replacing batteries avery summer! Chris
You have all confirmed my thoughts that the Guest charger just can't handle the chore. I'm off to the store looking for a temperature compensated Statpower. Much cheaper than replacing batteries avery summer! Chris
Call Back Woods Solar
Chris: Back Woods Solar has the Statpower 40 cheaper than anyone around. They don't publish the price but their price with shipping is much cheaper than anyone around even on sail.
Chris: Back Woods Solar has the Statpower 40 cheaper than anyone around. They don't publish the price but their price with shipping is much cheaper than anyone around even on sail.
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Garry @ S/V TASHTEGO
Wait a minute
You don't need a big bucks charger. You have the problem described by Ralph Johnstone. What you need is a separate 12 volt power supply running off 110 volt shore power for use when you are on the dock. Go to www.radioshack.com and order the following: 13.8Vdc,11A/8A Power Supply Price $49.99 Brand: Samlex Model: SEC11 Cat.#: 910-0450 Only available online. and DPDT Flip Switch 12 Volts, 20 amps Price $2.99 Cat.#: 275-710 Connect your fridge to the and - central terminals of the switch. Connect one side to the and ground side of your battery circuit and the other side to the and - terminals of the power supply. If the power supply doesn't have a fuse or a circuit breaker, add one. Put an appropriately sized fuse in the line between the switch and the fridge. If the current demand by the fridge is greater go back to the radioshack catalog and get the next larger size supply. Fifty three bucks and your troubles are over. Your charger won't even know the fridge is there and your batteries will thank you for it.
You don't need a big bucks charger. You have the problem described by Ralph Johnstone. What you need is a separate 12 volt power supply running off 110 volt shore power for use when you are on the dock. Go to www.radioshack.com and order the following: 13.8Vdc,11A/8A Power Supply Price $49.99 Brand: Samlex Model: SEC11 Cat.#: 910-0450 Only available online. and DPDT Flip Switch 12 Volts, 20 amps Price $2.99 Cat.#: 275-710 Connect your fridge to the and - central terminals of the switch. Connect one side to the and ground side of your battery circuit and the other side to the and - terminals of the power supply. If the power supply doesn't have a fuse or a circuit breaker, add one. Put an appropriately sized fuse in the line between the switch and the fridge. If the current demand by the fridge is greater go back to the radioshack catalog and get the next larger size supply. Fifty three bucks and your troubles are over. Your charger won't even know the fridge is there and your batteries will thank you for it.
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bob howard
re: wait a minute
Please listen to Mr Kollman. The Danfoss BD compressors and electronic modules are NOT designed to work off of power supplies alone. There must always be a battery tied into the system. True, in some cases it may work, but a $300.00 control module is an expensive experiment. The only power supply acceptable is far too heavy and expensive, (being heavily filtered and lab quality) to make it feasible for use on a sailboat. Do yourself a favor, get good quality batteries, the proper charger to manage them, wire the fridge as specified and READ YOUR OWNERS MANUALS.
Please listen to Mr Kollman. The Danfoss BD compressors and electronic modules are NOT designed to work off of power supplies alone. There must always be a battery tied into the system. True, in some cases it may work, but a $300.00 control module is an expensive experiment. The only power supply acceptable is far too heavy and expensive, (being heavily filtered and lab quality) to make it feasible for use on a sailboat. Do yourself a favor, get good quality batteries, the proper charger to manage them, wire the fridge as specified and READ YOUR OWNERS MANUALS.
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Alex
Rectifier -for 12V fridge on shore power
bought- for my Coolmatic/Waeco new 12V boat fridge with standard 35 compressor, a unit called Rectifier made by Mobitronics/Waeco , which connect to both baterry bank and shore power , and which opperate the compressor from shore power directly , whenever available ; when not ,it turn back to 12V. It is actually mentioned it fridge owner manual as optional addition .. it costs around 50$ , bought in Europe .
bought- for my Coolmatic/Waeco new 12V boat fridge with standard 35 compressor, a unit called Rectifier made by Mobitronics/Waeco , which connect to both baterry bank and shore power , and which opperate the compressor from shore power directly , whenever available ; when not ,it turn back to 12V. It is actually mentioned it fridge owner manual as optional addition .. it costs around 50$ , bought in Europe .
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Derek Rowell
Backwoods Solar is now much more expensive.....
I just called BackWoods Solar. Their price on the StatPower TrueCharge 40 is now $522, which is way above the $389 at www.onlinemarine.com or even West Marine. They said they had a 50% in price from StatPower (Xantrex). Derek
I just called BackWoods Solar. Their price on the StatPower TrueCharge 40 is now $522, which is way above the $389 at www.onlinemarine.com or even West Marine. They said they had a 50% in price from StatPower (Xantrex). Derek
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