Require new/refurbished transmission Yanmar YSE8

[CaptainCalimari]

I have a CS 27
The engine is 8hp Yanmar ( YSE – Model 160)


I have had some serious transmission problems this season.
Here's what happened and the outcome.
I need to replace or rebuild my transmission.
I have a mechanic booked for the 11th September.
Should I rebuild or replace the transmission


Problems
Last season I noticed what looked like engine oil had come from the engine compartment and emulsified with sea water in the bilges.
I kept cleaning it out- there was a lot of it....but it kept recurring.
There was no leak visible. The engine oil is topped up and changed regularly.
The dipstick was constant in the engine oil and always at pressure and to the cross hatched area.



After investigating at length I discovered what appeared to be an aspiration hose on the port side of the engine, just behind the starter motor. Lodged in the recess where the end of the hose protruded downwards was ..wait for it..a 1970's baked bean tin can.


This was full of thick black engine oil and had what looked like a very old wad of steel wool in the top....just under the surface of the oil.
I removed it and emptied it-at the time I assumed it was an overflow of some sort. I replaced the can but it never rested in the same position and the oil leak into the bilges continued.



This season the same problem persisted.
I changed the throttle and transmission shifter from a single handle to the two red/black handle shifter recently.
I can/could get reverse gear in huge power.
I was having difficulty getting any forward gear- huge revs and rpm but no power.


I finally remembered the transmission dipstick and oil port on the starboard rear of the engine. The cap to the plug/dipstick ( yellow) was firmly stuck. I was unable to move it. Eventually after much WD 40 application it gave and I was able to unscrew it.


Inside the plug it looked melted and the dipstick steel was missing.
Obviously the oil came from the transmission ( I have learned it takes a half pint of engine oil- W10-30?).... and the transmission had obviously got so hot that it had melted the steel shaft of the dipstick out of the plug cap and it had dropped down inside the transmission.

I took some advice from a mechanic.
He thought I might be lucky and get away with my foolish errors.

Plan A: was to buy a flexible magnet and try and recover the steel shaft from the transmission sump/well.
I tried this with two different magnets but no luck. I think I can detect the shaft but it may have gone horizontal and may be impossible to remove this way.


Plan B
: Assuming the recovery of the shaft was to fill up with oil and see if the transmission will work.
I know the risk is that the (cone?) clutch may have got so hot it could have glazed and then it's a $1000 rebuild and all the labour.

Plan C was to see if I can get the engine forward and dismantle the transmission, remove the shaft and then resort to Plan B.

The mechanic who gave me advice suggested we briefly try the engine- it started and turned over - I can still get reverse.

I regret not thinking of the transmission/oily bilge link before.
In my defence the previous owner indicated transmission oil should never/hardly ever need changing- ok it's not much of a defence but it's all I have!


It seems certain now the clutches are ‘glazed’ and slipping in forward gear.


1. Does anyone know of a place where I can order a new/refurbished transmission for the above engine please?
Holland Marine Products in Canada ( East Coast) are closed for three weeks in the summer and I cannot find a supplier or seller?
2. Does anyone have a YSE8 Yanmar they are breaking for spares or that they wish to sell ( in reasonable condition?).
I have spoken to a couple of dealers in the Bellingham area and they both think the transmission needs re-building ?
I prefer to purchase in the USA as the local dealers are usually double the price for the same item.

I have found a YSE8 in Ontario but it’s $2000 and then the shipping( another $1000) plus fitting ( a further $1800)

3. Is there a transmission repair kit available for the YSE 8?
Thank you,

Sorry for the long post,
Chris Holmes
(Captain Caliamari)
[SV Squid Vancouver.BC]
__._,_.___

 

[NYSail]

Just throwing this out there... when you changed your throttle / shifter are you sure its fully engaging the transmission in forward? I changed my control cables this past spring.... transmission worked great in reverse, but forward was not fully engaged. I matched the cables and setting exactly, but what I did not account for was the thread on the new cable was a little longer and stopped before fully engaged in forward. I cut about a 1/4 inch off and then it would fully engage. Good Luck!

 

[CaptainCalimari]

Thank you for the reply.
Yes I had considered that option of the problem being with the new/old shifter.
However, the only test I can do without cutting the cables etc. is by manual shifting of the transmission lever in the engine bay.
I can crank this fully forward- prior to this problem- it would engage the forward gear.
The mechanic who inspected the problem says it's the transmission- so I think I will have to go with the repair/replacement option.
Thanks again
Cap'n Calimari

 

[woodster]

try marine diesel direct they have a rebuild program and exchange program depending on your core being rebuild able

regards

woody

 

[Jalepeno]

I think you have two unrelated issues.
I have an YSM-12 which is a slightly newer version (1979) of your motor but with a larger piston. If you look in your manual (available on line or I can email you one if you can’t find it) you will see that the tube near the starter is the crank case vent. You should not normally have any large amounts of oil/vapour coming out of the vent. I have heard that piston blow-by and/or overfilling can cause oil to come out of the vent.
The reduction gear/clutch unit oil is totally separate from the motor and uses 0.7L of the same type of oil. Based on your description, it sound like your new cables may have restricted the clutch shifting and allowed the disk to slip slightly, thus overheating the unit. The dip stick looks like it is aluminum pressed into the plastic cap. You are probably looking at a big $$$$ job. You may wish to get opinions from more than one service provider. Two that I trust are “Garthside” in Sydney and “Vancouver Outboard” at T-Bird Marina.
Good luck, let us know how it work out.

 

[CaptainCalimari]

Thank you very much.
I will check them out tomorrow and see if there is anything they can help with.
They may be closed for Long Weekend I guess.
Cheers

 

[CaptainCalimari]

Thank you.

Yes I agree I think there are definitely two issues here.
I had thought the ''leak from the 'valve' was a possible overspill problem. I have a pdf. of the manual ( if anyone else needs one let me know and I can send) but have not yet looked to find that breather/overflow vent.
Don't know why I was just concentrating on getting the transmission issues resolved and figured it it was a gasket or other leak then it would get solved once the engine is taken apart.

I will look for it..it may be good news if what you say is correct; and it makes sense- then at least I don't have to deal with a major leak fixing issue.

I have an YSM-12 which is a slightly newer version (1979) of your motor but with a larger piston. If you look in your manual (available on line or I can email you one if you can’t find it) you will see that the tube near the starter is the crank case vent. You should not normally have any large amounts of oil/vapour coming out of the vent. I have heard that piston blow-by and/or overfilling can cause oil to come out of the vent.

Yes the engine oil may have been overfilled from time to time. I will measure it carefully in future

The reduction gear/clutch unit oil is totally separate from the motor and uses 0.7L of the same type of oil. Based on your description, it sound like your new cables may have restricted the clutch shifting and allowed the disk to slip slightly, thus overheating the unit.

Yes I think this may have happened. The old shifter broke and required a pair of vice grips for a couple of trips to even get the shifter moving.

The last two trips there were plenty of revs but no power at all.

The dip stick looks like it is aluminum pressed into the plastic cap.

I have a spare one for the engine oil dipstick and the shaft is mild steel and therefore magnetic. I could not retrieve it with the magnets on flexi-stalks.

If it was aluminum it may have been ground down by the gears?

You are probably looking at a big $$$$ job.
Yes I think I am !

You may wish to get opinions from more than one service provider. Two that I trust are “Garthside” in Sydney and “Vancouver Outboard” at T-Bird Marina.[/SIZE][/FONT]
Good luck, let us know how it work out.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the recommendations- that's really a big help. I will contact them next Tuesday if I can't get hold of them today.


I appreciate the help.
Cheers

 

[Jalepeno]

Let me know if you need more information.

 

[okawbow]

I can't help with the transmission problem, but I fixed the oily vent problem on my YSE8 by slipping a vinyl tube over the steel vent tube, and tying the end up higher than the engine crankcase. I haven't lost a drop of oil to the bilge since.

You may want to research old boats that had the YSE's as original equipment, and find an old, decrepit boat in some boatyard, to salvage the engine and transmission from. You may even find a "free" boat somewhere with one in it.

 

[CaptainCalimari]

That's a great solution!
Did you have overflow or a leak from the oil(y) vent too?

Is it designed to cope with overflow do you think? Or is it for some other purpose ?
As I said I had a tin can from the 1970's lodged on the transmission case under the vent - so this must have been happening for decades.
One other thing i noted is that fibreglass in the bilges had recently begun to delaminate with all of the oil emulsified into the bilge.
I guess I will have to re-glass this once I am done with fixing the whole thing.
I missed out last year when a colleague fitted an electric engine and gave away a YSE8 to another colleague.
Recently I found another CS27 for only $4000.
I'm reluctant right now to go and buy another boat just for parts for my present one- it may be a costlier exercise than putting the fix in but I am hopeful of finding a transmission.
I wanted to explore the non-marine option as the engines are old tractor engines from Yanmar- then I think Kaboda then/now I think Mistsubishi?
As with anything the word '' marine'' in front of 'engine' quadruples the price- but I don't know of any Japanese breaker yards or suppliers of after market parts..other than the kind suggestions above.

This forum rocks....the CS forum...no-one even answered my two queries!

Thanks everyone.

I can't help with the transmission problem, but I fixed the oily vent problem on my YSE8 by slipping a vinyl tube over the steel vent tube, and tying the end up higher than the engine crankcase. I haven't lost a drop of oil to the bilge since.

You may want to research old boats that had the YSE's as original equipment, and find an old, decrepit boat in some boatyard, to salvage the engine and transmission from. You may even find a "free" boat somewhere with one in it.

 

[okawbow]

I think I was overfilling the engine oil. Then, the oil would blow out the breather pipe when the engine was run hard, or was run when the boat was heeled over a little. The tube still allowed the crankcase to "breath", but no oil escapes.

My YSE8 is in a Bristol 24. The previous owner used 30wt Rotella in the motor, but used Mobile 1 synthetic in the transmission. I continue to use it also, and a few years ago, I motored over 800 miles on a river trip with no problems.

 

[Jalepeno]

Have you checked http://www.gartsidemarine.com/ for used/rebuilt units or to repair yours?
Also ask at http://www.bcboatnet.org/ for local solutions.
In my opinion, it is useless to by a used boat for the motor. What do you do with the rest of it? You can't go and sink it. A cheap solution is to put an outboard on the back but I don't think I would ever be happy with that in our waters.
I love my sailboat and if I had to repower with new, I would probably go with a Beta 14 with custom feet. There is a link on the Garthside site.

 

[CaptainCalimari]

Great- thank you I will check these sites .Great they are local.
Yes I thought of the outboard solution but the CS has a fairly large external rudder and I am not sure, even with an outboard offset to the max that it would be a viable solution.
Then there is the mixed/gas fuel tank problem and the accesibiity hanging off the back to steer and reverse.
Also you make a good point about the safety in BC waters.
I have not seriously considered the purchase of a new boat. It would be a liability and the cost and what to do with it after stripping out an engine- unless it's a boat for scrap on a free transfer- would be major headaches.

Thanks again for the local links.
Don't know the BEta 14- another CS 27 re-powered last year with a new engine- it cost 17$K in total- he's an offshore race fanatic- but it's a lot of money!

Have you checked http://www.gartsidemarine.com/ for used/rebuilt units or to repair yours?
Also ask at http://www.bcboatnet.org/ for local solutions.
In my opinion, it is useless to by a used boat for the motor. What do you do with the rest of it? You can't go and sink it. A cheap solution is to put an outboard on the back but I don't think I would ever be happy with that in our waters.
I love my sailboat and if I had to repower with new, I would probably go with a Beta 14 with custom feet. There is a link on the Garthside site.

 

[CaptainCalimari]

Trans-Mission Update

After following up all of the leads given by kind members I am somewhat closer to a solution to the transmission problem.
I found an old YSE8 engine in Ontario- the sale price was $2K- plus shipping as going to be another $1K or more.
I phoned all the local leads in BC and luckily found an engine shop in Sydney on Vancouver Island who have a transmission that may well fit.
The mechanic I am using has scheduled the work to begin on 11th of September- so I am waiting to check the gear ratios on my engine ( it should be 2.5 or 2.6) and then will go and get the transmission if it's the correct one.


So thanks one and all and I feel I have learned a lot from this exercise- especially al of the hints and helps on the site here.
I will post a later update once the work is under way( hopefully). . I hope this thread helps someone else one day to.

Cheers

Cap'n Calimari

SV Squid