I need to replace the hoses on my 1983 H31 -- hope to solve the odor problem! The hose going to the deck pumpout fitting is the problem. The cut out in the hull liner is just big enough for the hose -- too small for a clamp. The hole in the deck (I'm guessing) is also too small to get a hose clamp through. Questions: 1. Is there a hose clamp on it now? Suggestions for removal. 2. How to attach a new hose clamp? 3. Do I really need a hose clamp if I use the really heavy waste hose?
- Status
- Not open for further replies.
P
Peggie Hall/Head Mistress
You're not the first to run into this problem
Yes, there's a hose clamp on it now...in fact, there should be TWO hose clamps on it now. Yes, you really need TWO hose clamps on it, no matter how heavy the hose is...the weight of the hose has nothing to do with it...the hose clamps are what keep the hose on the fitting, And yes, I'm afraid the deck opening is too small to for the hose clamps to fit through. Which is just as well, 'cuz you'd have to rebed the fitting unless you want to create a deck leak. But as for how you get the bloomin' hose clamps on and off...I know one person here has done it. But I wouldn't blame you if you had a few words with Hunter over a definite lack of planning for future maintenance when they built this model. Btw...if you only wan to do this job once in the entire time you own the boat, I strongly recommend you use SeaLand "OdorSafe" brand hose. It's a white hose that's over $8/ft, but it has a "skin" on it that's proving to be completely bullet proof...in the 5-6 years it's been on the market, I've yet to hear of a single case of odor permeation failure. I just replaced all the hoses on my own boat with it. Yes...it's expensive. But which costs more--$3.50/ft every couple of years...or $8/ft once?
Yes, there's a hose clamp on it now...in fact, there should be TWO hose clamps on it now. Yes, you really need TWO hose clamps on it, no matter how heavy the hose is...the weight of the hose has nothing to do with it...the hose clamps are what keep the hose on the fitting, And yes, I'm afraid the deck opening is too small to for the hose clamps to fit through. Which is just as well, 'cuz you'd have to rebed the fitting unless you want to create a deck leak. But as for how you get the bloomin' hose clamps on and off...I know one person here has done it. But I wouldn't blame you if you had a few words with Hunter over a definite lack of planning for future maintenance when they built this model. Btw...if you only wan to do this job once in the entire time you own the boat, I strongly recommend you use SeaLand "OdorSafe" brand hose. It's a white hose that's over $8/ft, but it has a "skin" on it that's proving to be completely bullet proof...in the 5-6 years it's been on the market, I've yet to hear of a single case of odor permeation failure. I just replaced all the hoses on my own boat with it. Yes...it's expensive. But which costs more--$3.50/ft every couple of years...or $8/ft once?
R
Rod Leonard
Hose Replacement
Before you start changing your hoses check the hand pump for pump out the Diaphragm rots out and lets things leak out that we shouldn't talk about.
Before you start changing your hoses check the hand pump for pump out the Diaphragm rots out and lets things leak out that we shouldn't talk about.
P
Peggie Hall/Head Mistress
Rehosing 101
Unless you've winterized and the entire system is clean and dry, pump out the tank and run LOTS of fresh water and either white vinegar or C.P. through all the hoses and pumps. And put a big bowl or a bucket under fittings to catch any spills as you take the hoses off. You'll find it to be a lot more pleasant job to work on a clean system than one that isn't...and be a lot happier if you're not chasing odor from spills after the job is done. To remove hose from fittings: loosen hose clamps...warm the hose with a blow dryer or heat gun to expand it. Work it off carefully. If some doofus used pipe dope, silicon, 5200 or anything else except teflon tape, the hose isn't gonna come off..or if it does, it''ll require more effort than it's worth to save the price of a new fitting.. In that case--using a serrated knife--cut the hose off right behind the fitting and replace the fitting. While the system is apart is a good time to put a rebuild kit in the head...replace the impeller in your macerator or a new diaphragm kit in your manual pump. Do it now, and you eliminate the risk of having to take it apart again later to fix what broke or clogged. Getting new hose onto a fitting can be a challenge...especially onto 1.5" fittings. Avoid 1.5" gray pvc plumbing fittings...instead use nylon. Why? Because for some reason all nominal 1.5" thread x 1.5" barbed pvc plumbing ffittings are actualy 1.5" thread x 1 5/8" barbed...a poor fit for a 1.5" ID hose. This problem only pertains to 1.5", and doesn't exist with nylon fittings. Never mix metal fittings with a plastic tank or vice versa...metal and plastic have different thermal coefficients (they expand and contract at different rates) and temperature extremes can crack either the tank or the fitting. Tank fittings are NPT standard...that means they're slightly tapered. Over-tightening will crack a tank, if not immediately, within a few months. Tighten only 1 full turn beyond hand-tight, plus enough to aim an elbow where it needs to go, even if fittings are still showing. If you opt for any hard pipe, don't connect it directly to anything else that's rigid...soft-couple to tanks, toilets, pumps, thru-hulls, using about a foot of hose to act as a shock absorber. and protect connections from stress. Never connect anything rigid directly to anything else that's rigid...iow, don't thread a macerator directly into a tank fitting. Any stress and the weaker of the two will break. If you have to go around a tighter bend than the hose wants to bend, break the hose and put in an inline radius fitting. Do NOT heat the hose to make it soft enough to go around a corner...heat weakens the hose. Use teflon tape ONLY! No other sealant!!! Double clamp all connections. When you're finished, pressure test the system by filling the tank with water, blocking the tank vent and pumping the head till you feel a good bit of resistance. Leave it...check back in a few hours or in the morning. Any leaks will be self evident....and easy to fix by simply using a bit more teflon tape. In extreme cases, a new fitting may be required...fittings aren't made to rocket science tolerances. This ought to keep you from making the worst mistakes...rehosing isn't a fun job in any circumstances, so let's try to get it right the first time.
Unless you've winterized and the entire system is clean and dry, pump out the tank and run LOTS of fresh water and either white vinegar or C.P. through all the hoses and pumps. And put a big bowl or a bucket under fittings to catch any spills as you take the hoses off. You'll find it to be a lot more pleasant job to work on a clean system than one that isn't...and be a lot happier if you're not chasing odor from spills after the job is done. To remove hose from fittings: loosen hose clamps...warm the hose with a blow dryer or heat gun to expand it. Work it off carefully. If some doofus used pipe dope, silicon, 5200 or anything else except teflon tape, the hose isn't gonna come off..or if it does, it''ll require more effort than it's worth to save the price of a new fitting.. In that case--using a serrated knife--cut the hose off right behind the fitting and replace the fitting. While the system is apart is a good time to put a rebuild kit in the head...replace the impeller in your macerator or a new diaphragm kit in your manual pump. Do it now, and you eliminate the risk of having to take it apart again later to fix what broke or clogged. Getting new hose onto a fitting can be a challenge...especially onto 1.5" fittings. Avoid 1.5" gray pvc plumbing fittings...instead use nylon. Why? Because for some reason all nominal 1.5" thread x 1.5" barbed pvc plumbing ffittings are actualy 1.5" thread x 1 5/8" barbed...a poor fit for a 1.5" ID hose. This problem only pertains to 1.5", and doesn't exist with nylon fittings. Never mix metal fittings with a plastic tank or vice versa...metal and plastic have different thermal coefficients (they expand and contract at different rates) and temperature extremes can crack either the tank or the fitting. Tank fittings are NPT standard...that means they're slightly tapered. Over-tightening will crack a tank, if not immediately, within a few months. Tighten only 1 full turn beyond hand-tight, plus enough to aim an elbow where it needs to go, even if fittings are still showing. If you opt for any hard pipe, don't connect it directly to anything else that's rigid...soft-couple to tanks, toilets, pumps, thru-hulls, using about a foot of hose to act as a shock absorber. and protect connections from stress. Never connect anything rigid directly to anything else that's rigid...iow, don't thread a macerator directly into a tank fitting. Any stress and the weaker of the two will break. If you have to go around a tighter bend than the hose wants to bend, break the hose and put in an inline radius fitting. Do NOT heat the hose to make it soft enough to go around a corner...heat weakens the hose. Use teflon tape ONLY! No other sealant!!! Double clamp all connections. When you're finished, pressure test the system by filling the tank with water, blocking the tank vent and pumping the head till you feel a good bit of resistance. Leave it...check back in a few hours or in the morning. Any leaks will be self evident....and easy to fix by simply using a bit more teflon tape. In extreme cases, a new fitting may be required...fittings aren't made to rocket science tolerances. This ought to keep you from making the worst mistakes...rehosing isn't a fun job in any circumstances, so let's try to get it right the first time.
J
Johnnie Poole
Deck Fitting Cutout
I did this job this past summer. The deck is cutout to allow the hose clamp to wiggle through. Just barely, but it worked on my 84 h31. The hard part is to get the new hose into the compartment under the v-berth. Take off the door to the head, the door to the sink, and the door under the v-berth. You can do the job while working around them, but it's nuts to do so. It is definitely a two-man (and I mean Strong-handed man) job to bend and force new premium hose through the small holes Hunter used. Unless you live in South Florida, the hose will be too stiff to work with until July. Dittos on Peggie Hall's advice about cleaning up the system and preparing to catch all leaks. I'd recommend that you stuff the area between the hull and liner running aft from the v-berth floor with paper towels. Hunter used a makeshift gray pvc barbed tee upstream from the pump that is glued on. This is a low point in the system and must be flushed well with good stuff. You will probably end up cuting off the hoses and trashing this tee. While you're at it, that hand pump mounted above the tee is for overboard discharge where it's legal and has been sitting there soaking up the juice for 17 years. Rub the diaphragm with a clean paper towel and then take the towel outside and have someone else smell it. (You will be so familiar with the odor that you may not be able to tell.) After the fistfight is over, replace the pump. I installed a Y-valve where the tee was and relocated my new electric overboard diaphragm pump ($250) to the area above the inspection port under the starboard side of the v-berth. The valve allows me to isolate the deck fitting or the discharge pump for maintenance or regulatory reasons. In other words when the Coasties or the Florida Marine Patrol want to lock out the overboard pump, No Problem. Changing the hoses was one of the best 'liveability' investments I've made. Now when I open the hatch all I get is a nice clean aroma. Good Luck, Hope I've helped. Johnnie Poole S/V 'Jazz' SN 329
I did this job this past summer. The deck is cutout to allow the hose clamp to wiggle through. Just barely, but it worked on my 84 h31. The hard part is to get the new hose into the compartment under the v-berth. Take off the door to the head, the door to the sink, and the door under the v-berth. You can do the job while working around them, but it's nuts to do so. It is definitely a two-man (and I mean Strong-handed man) job to bend and force new premium hose through the small holes Hunter used. Unless you live in South Florida, the hose will be too stiff to work with until July. Dittos on Peggie Hall's advice about cleaning up the system and preparing to catch all leaks. I'd recommend that you stuff the area between the hull and liner running aft from the v-berth floor with paper towels. Hunter used a makeshift gray pvc barbed tee upstream from the pump that is glued on. This is a low point in the system and must be flushed well with good stuff. You will probably end up cuting off the hoses and trashing this tee. While you're at it, that hand pump mounted above the tee is for overboard discharge where it's legal and has been sitting there soaking up the juice for 17 years. Rub the diaphragm with a clean paper towel and then take the towel outside and have someone else smell it. (You will be so familiar with the odor that you may not be able to tell.) After the fistfight is over, replace the pump. I installed a Y-valve where the tee was and relocated my new electric overboard diaphragm pump ($250) to the area above the inspection port under the starboard side of the v-berth. The valve allows me to isolate the deck fitting or the discharge pump for maintenance or regulatory reasons. In other words when the Coasties or the Florida Marine Patrol want to lock out the overboard pump, No Problem. Changing the hoses was one of the best 'liveability' investments I've made. Now when I open the hatch all I get is a nice clean aroma. Good Luck, Hope I've helped. Johnnie Poole S/V 'Jazz' SN 329
J
John
Leave that part of the hose
I replaced the hoses on my 83 H31 last year. It smells so much better now, and be sure to listen to Peggy about using the good hoses. Someone had already replaced hoses once on my boat, and had cut the large diameter pump-out hose just below the access hole going up to the deck. They put a plastic coupling in to connect the new hose with the 8 inches (or so) of old hose. This worked, because that portion of the old hose only contacts bad stuff during pump outs, and was still in good shape. It's the portion of the hose at the bottom that bathes in the pooh pooh that gets nasty and smelly. Use a connector, and save the grief.
I replaced the hoses on my 83 H31 last year. It smells so much better now, and be sure to listen to Peggy about using the good hoses. Someone had already replaced hoses once on my boat, and had cut the large diameter pump-out hose just below the access hole going up to the deck. They put a plastic coupling in to connect the new hose with the 8 inches (or so) of old hose. This worked, because that portion of the old hose only contacts bad stuff during pump outs, and was still in good shape. It's the portion of the hose at the bottom that bathes in the pooh pooh that gets nasty and smelly. Use a connector, and save the grief.
- Status
- Not open for further replies.