Re-building mast

[dLj]

I bought a fixer-upper and am about to put in new halyards, mast wiring and all that. The mast currently has a main halyard and jib halyard in place so those will be easy to replace, hook up to existing halyards and pull new ones in. Wiring the same, I'll just pull new wiring in with removing the existing wiring.

There are two mast head pullies without lines in them. I want to put in a small line into one of these so I can pull a halyard through when I'm ready, likely next year. But since I have the mast down right now, I thought it best to take care of this now. I'd rather not drop the mast again and just get this done now.

My dilemna is, how do you thread a line into the mast if there is no line there to pull it through? I guess this is what happens when a mast is first put together. I haven't found anywhere that talks about this. Does anyone have any ideas?

I've thought of using a thin line with a iron nut on the end and using a magnet on the outside of the mast see if I can walk it down inside the mast. I've also thought of using a solid wire and pushing it through, then attaching a line to the end of that and pulling the line through.

Does anyone have any experience with this? Thoughts on how best to do this? Any and all advice is quite welcome.

Thanks,

dj

 

[dlochner]

This is pretty easy.

First you may want to removed the masthead fittings. This will give you a chance to inspect the sheaves and axles. It may be a good idea to replace them.

Get an electrician's fish tape, that is longer than your mast. These are around $20 at your local big box hardware store. Slide the fish tape up the mast, hook wires, messenger lines, what ever and pull the fish tape out of the mast with the lines attached.

 

[dLj]

Yes, I wil be taking the sheaves and axles apart to see what condition they are in, I expect to have to replace them. The boat is from 1977.

Thank you much for the input. I'll have to go look at what's available. I've got to get the mast down off the deck of the boat so I can look up the mast and see how the lines run inside currently. I have no idea if there are internal channels etc. in there... this definately looks like the way to do this job...

dj

 

[Capt jgw]

If the stays are off the mast, one of those should be stiff enough to thread up the mast. I've done it that way several times. If the masthead is not welded on, removing it makes the job much easier.

 

[Charlie Jones s/v Tehani]

I have used a length of Romex to push up the mast, then pull wires through.

 

[Gunni]

You should have a conduit attached to the inside of your mast for wiring. Keeps it clear of the internal lines.

 

[Padrone]

Using a suitable length of one inch electrical conduit (outside of the mast ) thread a line through it.
Use the stiffness of the conduit to push through the mast, this ensures the new line does not foul anything inside.
Using the just passed line through line attach the two new lines (halyards) to it and withdraw the conduit, or you can use the conduit for wiring of whatever.

 

[jssailem]

Dj
With the mast down it is easy. Now if I understand what you said, you plan to pull a new halyard through using the old halyard. Seems to me it is just as easy to pull a couple of extra lines through tied to the old halyard as it is to pull one.

 

[Joe]

The simplest way is jssailem's comment. Use one of the existing halyards. Tape two messengers to the existing halyard... one to leave for future use, the other to return the halyard.

 

[Bill Roosa]

To jssailem's comment be sure you start the messenger lines at the correct mast entrance. Also need to think about how you are going to maintain access to those emergency? messengers. If the halyard breaks how will you go up the mast to get the messenger? Since you have two you could use the other halyard but going aloft in foul weather (emergency) is not the best idea and certainly going to be a tale to tell

 

[hewebb]

I did what jssailem did and it worked great. I did use a ball bearing sheave for the mainsail halyard. Be careful not to let the lines twist around each other while installing. I tend to over do things so I used needle and thread to sew the line ends together under the tape.

 

[jssailem]

sew the line ends together under the tape.

A quick stitch is always a way to be certain the lines do not come apart in the middle of the boom. Tape the connection and up the line you are pulling to smoothe the multi line through tje mast. Spreader connections and spots like mast radar connections can be places where the lines can get hung up. Less force more examination and resolution is the order of the day.
Once the lines are pulled inside the mast, then separate them and affirm there is a fair lead (no entanglements) Best done with a helper and a good flashlight.
At the mast head you can get a piece of clothes hanger or copper wire and fish hook the line ends through the proper sheave. Or as was suggested this would be an excellent time to remove the mast head and service it.

 

[dLj]

Definitely appreciate all the input. I'll be up at the boat next week and will report back on how it worked out. I just ordered the halyards yesterday to bring up with me, already have the wire cables. I guess this might be simpler than I've been thinking. I always tend to think that working on a boat will be harder than imagined.... Just comes from past experience... I think it really depends upon what's inside the mast and how easy/difficult it is to take the mast head off. Pulling all the sheaves out may give a lot of access if I can't take the mast head off.

I found the links below on the APS web site. Very nice demo of how to attach to an existing halyard to pull through something behind it.

http://www.apsltd.com/aps-advisor/sailing-knowledgebase/page/3/
http://www.apsltd.com/aps-advisor/install-remove-sailboat-halyards-expert-advice/

dj

 

[Charlie Jones s/v Tehani]

Begining to think I have a good deal with a wooden mast Of course, it's only 56 years old

 

[jssailem]

what's inside the mast

DJ,
PB Blaster, drill with screw extraction bit, vice grips, die and tap sets, impact driver, and various sized screw drivers and punches are all tools of the trade. You might list more. Inside the mast you will likely find more than just rope and wire. We removed bird nests, wasp nest, foam insulation, 6 inches of dust from rotten foam insulation, and some things that could not be explained. My best guess, my mast had been up for 43 years.
Took a good vacuum and a water pressure hose to clean out everything. Then there was a pretty good sized tube to start putting it all back inside. You might be ready to install another conduit for electrical wire should you be putting more wire in the mast than the current conduit can contain. (my experience) Conduit I used was thin wall PVC attached to the mast with rivets.
As you install what ever you are planning, be sure all lines that will be running through the mast have a clean unobstructed lead from top to bottom. No twists, wraps or chafing. Nothing is worse than to raise the mast and find that new halyard sticks when you try to raise the sail.

 

[dLj]

Begining to think I have a good deal with a wooden mast Of course, it's only 56 years old

You know, I always wonder about wooden masts. I've only had one boat with a wooden mast. All the rest have been aluminum. A lot of boats have gone around the world with wooden masts ... Not sure but you are right... Can't really put my finger on why I think an aluminum mast is preferrible. Perhaps it isn't...

dj

 

[dLj]

DJ,
PB Blaster, drill with screw extraction bit, vice grips, die and tap sets, impact driver, and various sized screw drivers and punches are all tools of the trade. You might list more. Inside the mast you will likely find more than just rope and wire. We removed bird nests, wasp nest, foam insulation, 6 inches of dust from rotten foam insulation, and some things that could not be explained. My best guess, my mast had been up for 43 years.
Took a good vacuum and a water pressure hose to clean out everything. Then there was a pretty good sized tube to start putting it all back inside. You might be ready to install another conduit for electrical wire should you be putting more wire in the mast than the current conduit can contain. (my experience) Conduit I used was thin wall PVC attached to the mast with rivets.
As you install what ever you are planning, be sure all lines that will be running through the mast have a clean unobstructed lead from top to bottom. No twists, wraps or chafing. Nothing is worse than to raise the mast and find that new halyard sticks when you try to raise the sail.

Your description has me just savoring the idea of the mast rebuild... NOT.... But it must be done.

I'm only running essentially three wires, one for the mast head anchor light, one for the mid-mast steaming light and fore-deck illumination and then one co-axial line for the mast head mounted antenna.

I intend to run the halyards into the mast, attach the ends and run them as if they are a continuous "belt" just to check for smooth running. Then undo the splice of the two ends and tie them off. Once the mast is on the boat, then I'll run them and see how much extra I have and finish the bitter end... I need a splice kit. Any suggestions?

dj

 

[Charlie Jones s/v Tehani]

You know, I always wonder about wooden masts. I've only had one boat with a wooden mast. All the rest have been aluminum. A lot of boats have gone around the world with wooden masts ... Not sure but you are right... Can't really put my finger on why I think an aluminum mast is preferrible. Perhaps it isn't...

dj

If I need a new mast I'll build one, using the Birdmouth technique. I've built 20 of them so far

Load testing a 30 footer for a gaff rigged boat

 

[jssailem]

DJ, I uses standard fid kit. Low cost and functional. I've seen and heard about the Brian Toss snare tool. A cleaver tool but more mone than I wanted to spend when I bought the fids. Also get a sailors palm, needles and twine to whip the ends. Plenty of YouTube videos to help instruct you in the skills of seamanship.

Know the issue "It a must do task". I began my mast and boom refit Jan 2016. And finally completed the ready to sail tuning First part of July 2017. Very happy now with the outcome.

Good luck to you.

 

[justsomeguy]

If I need a new mast I'll build one, using the Birdmouth technique.

What kind of glue do you use?