Questions about the Vega now I have been to sea in her!

btfag0s · Jun 17, 2012

2. Weather helm - a reef in the main will sort that out. You'll also sail faster and more upright.

3. backstay tensioner - fine on a racing boat for bending the mast aft so you can point higher, but I've not felt the need for one on a Vega, except perhaps to make up for a sloppy forestay on a roller furling system.

4. slapping wires - I wouldn't tension them, it won't stop the slapping and risks breaking the conductors.

Alisdair

timoheikkinen · Jun 17, 2012

On 17.6.2012 22:12, John Denney wrote:

tim_klynn · Jun 17, 2012

As Alisdair says, reefing the main should reduce weather helm. Basically, weather helm is caused by the main having too much power compared to the jib/genoa.

Too much mast rake will also cause weather helm.
Check for incorrect genoa trim (Arvel Gentry has a good explanation of the finer points of foresail trim: http://www.arvelgentry.com/tuft.htm) orincorrect main trim.

Before reefing, you could try flattening the main by tensioning the outhaul and tightening the main halyard/cunningham. Flattening the main will help depower the main and allow you to sail faster/point higher.

Letting the traveler down to leeward will also depower the main, as will loosening the boom vang and easing the main sheet. These adjustments will let the top of the main twist off to leeward and lose power
up high where it most effects the heeling force on the boat.

On a boat with a bendy mast (not so much the Vega), you can use backstay tension to bend the mast to further flatten the main (and jib on a masthead rig).
I tighten my backstay going up wind in stronger conditions, loosen it for light air and downwind sailing. As noted, putting on tension will tighten up the forestay and reduce sagging (allow for higher pointing and more speed in windy conditions).
In light air, you want a fuller, more powerful shape, so some sag in the forestay is desirable at times. Think of full, sagging sails as low gear in a car and flat sails as overdrive and the wind as the accelerator pedal. You start out in a low gear (full sails), and as you
accelerate, you shift into higher gears (flatten sails). Dealing with waves is like a car going up hills, you need a lower gear for more power. Of course, all of this assumes that you have sails that you can actually shape and not just "white triangles" of dacron.....I agree Alisdair on "don't tension the wires".

Other than getting a zillion cans of spray in expanding foam and foaming in your mast solid (and making everyone that deals with your mast in the future hate you), I don't know of any way to quiet the wires without pulling the mast.
I used electrical zip ties on my wires in a radiating pattern like Alisdair did on his. Works great. To create a strain relief (so the wires weren't hanging off the terminals) I took a 2 foot or so piece of stainless wire, unraveled it, lashed the unraveled strands around the wires where the would be near the top of the mast

Next I drilled a hole in the top of the mast, tapped it then drilled a hole down a stainless bolt, pulled the stainless wire through the hole, slipped the bolt down over the stainless, screwed the bolt into the mast top, pulled the wires up to where they wanted to be, and finally crimped a stop on the stainless wire above the bolt. Now, the wires hang off the stainless strain relief with slack in the electrical wires that go to the masthead light etc.Most of the lakes where I sail have kind of a high gallows set up to act like a crane to raise and lower the mast.

I think it takes me about and hour to drop or raise the mast.

A friend that has a Catalina 25 tall mast (about the same rig as the Vega) made up an "A" frame out of electrical conduit the he uses to step and unstep his mast. It takes him about an hour as well.
The first times I stepped/unstepped the mast it seemed like a big deal, now it is no big thing. I think it is harder to fish wires and such up the mast than it is to drop the mast.

I'd just buy a bunch of beer and try to lure some buddies into giving you a hand to drop the mast and fix the wires...-Tim________________________________
From: John Denney johndenney1@...
To: AlbinVega@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2012 1:12 PM
Subject: [AlbinVega] Questions about the Vega now I have been to sea in her!

Hi all, I think I have managed to put my Vega back together about right (ish)but a couple of things are worrying me!

1. The MD6 / combi seems to work fine now but I am not sure if it is doing exactly what it should do. When I advance the throttle the engine revs increase and the prop blades start to coarsen but I need to push the throttle quite far forward before the prop really starts to "bite" and the boat starts to move forward at just under 6 knots (GPS reading - slack water). If I advance the throttle a little further the prop really bites into the water and the engine is under quite a load - in fact the revs decrease slightly - just like a car going up a hill.
In reverse the prop seems to bite at a much earlier stage and produces a lot of thrust with a fairly modest throttle setting in comparison to going forward.

Is this the same as others? It all works fine I just want confirmation that it's operation is in line with other Vega's.

2. Weather helm? Mine seems to have quite a bit of weather helm - it is manageable but in a brisk breeze I need constant pressure on the tiller to keep her "straight". Is this normal? I am a little concerned because I will need to use the Navik (and the autohelm) a lot and I have been told that they both work best if the yacht is "balanced". How is weather helm adjusted on a Vega?

3. Back stay tension? I have a tensioning device for the double backstay arrangement (just a pulley system that can be tensioned and pulls the twin back-stays together). Any advice on what to do with it? Not really sure what it is for or when to use it!

4. Wires slapping about inside the mast! Any ideas how I could cure this without removing the mast? I feel such a fool for not doing it when I had it in my shed but I never even thought about it! I can try to tension the wires a bit but I do not think this will be a cure.

Any comments or advise will be much appreciated. Off to the boat tomorrow to have a major sort out and to try out the Navik - hope I can get it to work!

Thanks in advance.

John

pjacobs55 · Jun 17, 2012

Hi John,
With the Navik I "dial in" a bit of weather helm to suit wind and sailing conditions. If conditions change you'll feel it in the boat and can make further adjustments.

I won't trouble you with the finer points of use but here are a few tips that may be helpful:

Watch the paddle in the water. If it's spending too much time way over to the weather side, shorten the weather side tiller line until the paddle averages a mid position, not perpendicular to the water, but perpendicular to the boat. Sometimes when on a long beat I don't bother connecting the lee line to the tiller, but it's handy when you tack. Weather helm keeps the single line tight.

When you're ready to tack, if you have a bit of weather helm dialed in, adjust the tiller lines so they'll have similar weather helm dialed in on the other tack, step back and turn the Navik head to the other heading, (on the control head I've put a couple of pencil marks where optimum port and starboard tacks are) and man the jib sheets. I find the Navik does a far better job of tacking than I can, smoother and doesn't loose as much momentum. I just sit there, wait for the boom to start over, and work the jib sheets, usually only needing the winch for final adjustment.

It takes a bit of practice and fiddling to get on to, but the freedom it gives one to do other things is amazing, and it'll hold a better course than I ever will. You can cook a meal, use the head, read a book, splice some lines, whatever, while the boat steers itself. It also frees you up to play with sail trim while holding a steady course.

Just make sure you stay on the boat; it'll keep sailing into the sunset without you!

Here's a link to a short Navik video with Sin Tacha:

Good luck, and congratulations on getting out on the water after all the work you did!
Peter
www.sintacha.com

araujo318 · Jun 18, 2012

The picture you posted the mast was significantly raked aft. This makes for a pleasing looking yacht but it is the cause of your weather helm. The mast should be only slightly raked aft. At a quick glance it should look almost straight up and down. When set up like this the helm is very light.

The back stay tensioner should be used with care. The forces generated by pulling a line perpendicular to its axis is very large. The mechanical advantage the pulley pulling the line sideways and the mechanical advantage of the blocks pulling the pulleys can generate thousands of pounds force.

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Questions about the Vega now I have been to sea in her!

John Denney

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btfag0s

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timoheikkinen

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tim_klynn

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pjacobs55

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araujo318

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