Question for liveaboards...

[Warren Milberg]

I've only had one friend who lived aboard his boat year round in a cold climate (Boston Harbor). My question is how to deal with winterizing, or not, your engine. The first year my friend lived aboard during winter, he did not winterize his Yanmar engine. He depended on ambient heat in the cabin (and engine compartment) supplied to a number of ceramic heaters run by shoreside electric power. (He has since added a diesel cabin heater). Yet during an ice storm that first winter, his marina lost power and he had neither cabin heat nor a way to keep the raw water side of his engine from freezing. As a result he ran his engine a lot just to keep it warm. Now, since he really doesn't use the engine during winter, he winterizes the engine with antifreeze, like I do just before my boat is hauled. He keeps his batteries up thru a combo of solar panels and a small generator.

What do others do who live aboard in a cold climates?

 

[KD3PC]

Warren

Timely, we just had a dusting of snow here in Roanoke this morning and overnite temps well in to the 30's.

This will be the first year that we winterize the whole boat, as liveaboards. We may still fire up the engine and then "re-winterize" if the weather breaks and we can sail a few days.

The risk to the heads, the water system, gennie and engine are just too much for me. It seldom gets really cold enough on the bay to "freeze" things, but previous boats we had did, luckily, push out some water lines and connectors and bulge some supply lines.

Our marina suggests strongly that at least the engines be done, as the marina has lost power for several days in years past.

We keep one delonghi running in the main salon which should keep things in range.

It is a risk though, no matter which way you go...

dad

 

[Mike B]

Warren, while we're not officially live aboards we have spent almost every weekend aboard year round for the last 6 yrs. We also know a number of live aboards at our marina in Baltimore. I always winterize the engine in the fall. We rely on either the house heat which is a reverse cycle AC/Heat unit or space heaters when the water temps drop too low. One of our live aboard friends installed a diesel heat system that doesn't rely on the engine. They're very happy with it. As for water systems I drain and cap off any water lines that are in cockpit lockers to prevent them from freezing. Leaving the hot water heater on, turning off the water pump and opening all the water taps, showerheads takes enough water from the system to prevent split lines should the heat fail. I also keep a couple of gallons of the pink antifreeze handy to pour down the toilet, drains, etc. prior to leaving the boat. So far it's worked for us. The only issue came as a result of my failing to drain the swim platform shower head and water line. The plastic internal valve split when it froze.
Mike

 

[Jim]

Warren, why didn't he buy a generator?

That what I would have done. A cheap gas one would work well!

 

[Franklin]

I would think that a couple lightbulbs in the engine compartment would help while the owner is at work if he doesn't have shore power to run a heater.

 

[Ross]

I just made an observation that might shed some light on this question. On my back porch railing I have two plastic bottles that I keep there for watering a few plant pots. One bottle is nearly full and the other is less than a third full. There is no ice in the full one but the partially full one is about 50 per cent frozen. I think that the thermal mass of the larger water filled stuff on a boat will require much longer to freeze than the exposed pipes and tubes. I know that it takes several days of below freezing temperatures to freeze solid a bag in box wine bag filled with water but a small tin can will freeze over night.

 

[Mike B]

Ross, try another experiment. Fill the one jug to capaicity and place a cap in it. Fill the other to 50% and place a cap on it. Allow both to freeze. Let's see which one expands beyond the container's capacity and splits open. Want to take a guess?
Mike

 

[Bill Roosa]

Winterizing engines

I hate to be the one to inform youall but that green or orange stuff you put in the engine is ANTI-freeze. Just like your car that you do not winterize, your "freshwater" cooled engine does not need attention unless it will get below the freezing point of the anti in the engine. The raw water system and the fresh drinking water system needs to be addressed but since I noticed that even when the Bay freezes there is liquid water right around the boat hull I'm willing to bet that all the other salt water in the boat is not frozen. The fresh drinking water tankage and plumbing must, of course, be in "heated" spaces. Stern showers might be a problem.

 

[Ross]

Ross, try another experiment. Fill the one jug to capaicity and place a cap in it. Fill the other to 50% and place a cap on it. Allow both to freeze. Let's see which one expands beyond the container's capacity and splits open. Want to take a guess?
Mike

Mike , Been there and done that. With glass it is absolute! with plastic they stretch and bulge. Try it with an open top food can. They freeze from the top down and will push the bottom out of the can. Five gallon buckets work the same way and split the bottom.

 

[Mike B]

Re: Winterizing engines

Bill, just to clarify, when I winterize my engine I only use the biodegradable type antifreeze. I believe the purple will give you a few more degrees of protection over the pink. In no case have I, nor would ever think of, using an antifreeze designed for use in a closed loop engine system. Their toxicity is clearly marked and should be well know.
Mike

 

[Mike B]

Ross, I'm sure glad beer doesn't freeze as quick
Mike

 

[Jim]

Ross, you have a point. The higher the mass the longer it takes to change state therefore allowing you more time before the pipe burst. Humm? I still don't like the idea but you have science on your side.

I would get an generator and a protection system like a tempature alarm that warns you via cell phone or an ABT and auto start for the generator.

 

[Ross]

Ross, you have a point. The higher the mass the longer it takes to change state therefore allowing you more time before the pipe burst. Humm? I still don't like the idea but you have science on your side.

I would get an generator and a protection system like a tempature alarm that warns you via cell phone or an ABT and auto start for the generator.

Jim, If you live aboard you don't need a telephone to know when the boat is getting too cold. A kerosine lantern with a 7/8 inch wick will have a heat output of 1400 BTU's which is about equivilant to a 450 watt electric heater.

 

[Warren Milberg]

For Bill Roosa: While I generally agree with your comments about just how cold it needs to get in order to threaten the raw water side of your engine with freezing, be aware that it does sometimes get this cold at Herrington. Not sure how long you have been at Herrington (I've had a boat there since 1993), but the one year I left a boat in the water there in the mid-1990s, it froze solid in its slip. I mean solid. I could not pull the boat over to the finger pier. I could not move it all. Herrington also lost power due to an ice storm that took the power lines down. Those boaters depending on bubblers t had no bubbles, and were frozen in, like me. Fortunately, the boat I owned at the time was outboard powered and the engine was in my basement. I feel certain that if I had an inboard, and the raw water side was not winterized with anti-freeze, the engine would have been frozen solid, too.

Maybe we have something to be thankful for in regards to global warming, as I don't think its gotten that cold since....

Have a good winter.

 

[Ross]

Remember there was a time in the mid '70's that they had to use ice breakers to deliver fuel to Smith Island. The winter of 1989-1990 wasn't to be scoffed at either. I think that we are due for another cold winter soon.