Can anyone confirm whether the PVC tube that houses the cables in the 340 mast runs up the entire mast? The mast is already stepped so I can't check it now. I'm having trouble with my main halyard binding and I'm wondering if it's somehow got wrapped around that tube. The previous owner replaced the halyard recently so I'm exploring all possibilities. The tube protrudes through the step plate and through the cabin top so I can see the bottom of it.
PVC Tube in 340 Mast
- Thread starter looking2buy
- Start date
It is normal to install the tubes to run the length of the mast.
Do you have any electrical at the level of the spreaders? If so then you may have 2 pvc pipes one servicing the electrical at the spreaders.
It is possible that your halyard is somehow catching inside the mast. Some owners drill holes and insert screws in their mast. To long a screw can cause issues. But I would look at the more obvious places first.
Good luck
Do you have any electrical at the level of the spreaders? If so then you may have 2 pvc pipes one servicing the electrical at the spreaders.
It is possible that your halyard is somehow catching inside the mast. Some owners drill holes and insert screws in their mast. To long a screw can cause issues. But I would look at the more obvious places first.
- The sheaves at the mast top. Are they worn, is the halyard the correct size to fit the sheave?
- Is the halyard showing signs of chafe?
- Does the halyard have an exit box? Are the sides smooth?
- Do you run the halyards to the cockpit? Are all the lines running fair?
- Are all the turning blocks clean and is the halyard sized for all the blocks and fittings
Good luck
Jssailem,
Thank you for the feedback. The previous owner just replaced the halyard so the line is brand new so no chafe and presume it's the correct size. The halyard does have an exit box and it seems to be smooth. There is only one light and VHF antennae at the top of the mast so only 1 PVC tube (no other electronics on the mast). We hand pulled on the halyard at the mast...right hand at exit box, left hand on shackle end and very difficult to 'move' line. Seems like it has to be something between the box and/or top sheave. The only thing I can't check is the sheave at the top (the main halyard would be my bosun lift up and I'm reluctant to use it as is).
Is it possible that the halyard jumped the sheave at the mast top and is wedged or is it fairly tight up there so there is no way for the line to come off the sheave?
Thank you.
Thank you for the feedback. The previous owner just replaced the halyard so the line is brand new so no chafe and presume it's the correct size. The halyard does have an exit box and it seems to be smooth. There is only one light and VHF antennae at the top of the mast so only 1 PVC tube (no other electronics on the mast). We hand pulled on the halyard at the mast...right hand at exit box, left hand on shackle end and very difficult to 'move' line. Seems like it has to be something between the box and/or top sheave. The only thing I can't check is the sheave at the top (the main halyard would be my bosun lift up and I'm reluctant to use it as is).
Is it possible that the halyard jumped the sheave at the mast top and is wedged or is it fairly tight up there so there is no way for the line to come off the sheave?
Thank you.
Jsailem,
PS - because the previous owner replaced the halyard (and I'm not sure he even sailed it after) I'm wondering if he somehow got it wrapped around the PVC tube.
PS - because the previous owner replaced the halyard (and I'm not sure he even sailed it after) I'm wondering if he somehow got it wrapped around the PVC tube.
I've assisted in many wrapped halyard issues. The trick that I learned is to relax ALL halyards that travel inside the mast. The take up on the one that appears fouled. If it appears to no longer have the resistance that you were experiencing then you've determined the issue. Now for the culprit: Simply reapply tension one at a time to each halyard and test therein halyard after each of the other halyards is re-tensioned. Don't forget the topping lift, internal whisker pole control line( if so equipped).
Knowing my not be much help if the offending is say your Genoa halyard. But you may be able to drop the Genoa and rehoist with the spinnaker halyard. When a mast is stepped ( in column) it is very difficult to unwrap a twisted internal halyard.
Knowing my not be much help if the offending is say your Genoa halyard. But you may be able to drop the Genoa and rehoist with the spinnaker halyard. When a mast is stepped ( in column) it is very difficult to unwrap a twisted internal halyard.
sailme88,
Thank you for your input. There are only 2 lines in the mast...jib and main (along with the PVC tube). Your recommendation on relaxing ALL lines is well received. I do have the jib halyard raised while experiencing the problems with the main so maybe those are twisted. Next time at the boat I will drop the jib to see if that 'releases' the main. Fingers crossed for at least a diagnosis...as you say the fix may be the harder part.
Thank you for your input. There are only 2 lines in the mast...jib and main (along with the PVC tube). Your recommendation on relaxing ALL lines is well received. I do have the jib halyard raised while experiencing the problems with the main so maybe those are twisted. Next time at the boat I will drop the jib to see if that 'releases' the main. Fingers crossed for at least a diagnosis...as you say the fix may be the harder part.
Let me know if the relaxation works.. Unfortunately the tricks to unravel require the mast to be horizontal..
The relaxing plan is a good idea. While it is possible to have screwed up the install of a halyard, I am guessing you are going to find your answer at the sheave at the top of the mast. The halyard is too big or it may have jumped the sheave. I have been wrong before and likely will be again. But that is where I would look.
In my experience the PVC pipe would be the least likely suspect. First it should be attached to the mast with a series of rivets. You should be able to see them on the back side of the mast. You do not need to do anything with the PVC pipe to pull a halyard.
Now if the PVC pipe is a new install, well that would be a different issue. It is possible to screw up the PVC pipe install if you have not done one before.
In my experience the PVC pipe would be the least likely suspect. First it should be attached to the mast with a series of rivets. You should be able to see them on the back side of the mast. You do not need to do anything with the PVC pipe to pull a halyard.
Now if the PVC pipe is a new install, well that would be a different issue. It is possible to screw up the PVC pipe install if you have not done one before.
jssailem,
I suspect you may be right about the sheave. Is there enough space at the sheave for the halyard to jump out? I'm going to bring my drone down to the boat and see what I can see up at the top. I'm also going to look through the exit boxes to see if that reveals anything. The PVC tube does not seem to be attached to the mast because it will slide up and down inside the mast and I can push it up from inside the cabin where it goes through the deck plate. I'm speculating that it is just loose inside the mast with only the friction of the electrical wires keeping it from falling out completely when vertical. Attached is picture of the tube just resting on the track side of the mast (definitely not secured to back side).
I suspect you may be right about the sheave. Is there enough space at the sheave for the halyard to jump out? I'm going to bring my drone down to the boat and see what I can see up at the top. I'm also going to look through the exit boxes to see if that reveals anything. The PVC tube does not seem to be attached to the mast because it will slide up and down inside the mast and I can push it up from inside the cabin where it goes through the deck plate. I'm speculating that it is just loose inside the mast with only the friction of the electrical wires keeping it from falling out completely when vertical. Attached is picture of the tube just resting on the track side of the mast (definitely not secured to back side).
Attachments
OK then the installer missed an important step. You want to secure the pvc so there is no banging in the mast. The easiest technique is to use pop rivets. They just keep the pvc in place and out of the way.
Here is a picture of my mast head. The green/white halyard (jib halyard) is exiting the forward sheave on my mast. You can see the fore stay mast fitting resting on top of the halyard and sheave. The sheave is the tan item under the line. The line is the same size as he width of the sheave. The blue/white halyard is spinnaker halyard.
Here is a picture of my mast head. The green/white halyard (jib halyard) is exiting the forward sheave on my mast. You can see the fore stay mast fitting resting on top of the halyard and sheave. The sheave is the tan item under the line. The line is the same size as he width of the sheave. The blue/white halyard is spinnaker halyard.
I got the sail to the top of the mast... a little harder than would have expected/liked but it raised. My concern now is that when we release the main halyard the sail doesn't drop. The mainsail needs to be pulled down because the halyard doesn't move free enough. Anyone else have this problem? Could it be because it's having to slide through the rake in the mast and thus rubbing on the inside aft portion of the mast?
Not likely.
Two possibilities. One the halyard could be sticking as it goes through he sheave. Too big for the sheave / and the sheave may not be turning.
Two if you have cars that ride on a track the cars sometimes get twisted. They bind in the track. You need to make sure there in no dirt in the track and that all the screws holding the track to the mast are secure.
jssailem, pretty sure all the cars are straight so probably no that. The track is a slot extruded right into the mast so there is no screws to secure to the mast. I'm thinking most likely up at the sheave since the halyard is difficult to move anyways. I'm going up in the bosun to see if I can diagnose the problem but will be hard because the halyard will be tight with me attached. I'll try and suspend my weight by holding onto the top of the mast and wrapping my legs to see if the sheave is 'free'. Either way I'll hit it with some Super Lube spray to make sure it's turning. I appreciate your input, thank you.
Do you have a "Topping Lift and a Jib halyard?
You do not want to trust the Main Halyard to get to the top of the mast. Use the Topping lift to hold the bosun chair. use the jib halyard as a safety line. And have a line wraped around the mast and wrapped around you. You slide the line that is bowline knotted to your body up the mast as you go. You have someone belaying the jib halyard. And you get cranked up by the topping lift. You have a transition at the spreaders where you have to untie the bowline to get it above the spreader ( again when you want to come down. But that is a minor inconvenience to be safe at the top. Note your jibe halyard stops short of the mast top. That is when the person on belay lets you climb past the top of the jib and eases the line out as you go. It can be clamped tight and slow your fall should something go wrong.
Safety first. We do not want to hear any "Splat" stories.
You do not want to trust the Main Halyard to get to the top of the mast. Use the Topping lift to hold the bosun chair. use the jib halyard as a safety line. And have a line wraped around the mast and wrapped around you. You slide the line that is bowline knotted to your body up the mast as you go. You have someone belaying the jib halyard. And you get cranked up by the topping lift. You have a transition at the spreaders where you have to untie the bowline to get it above the spreader ( again when you want to come down. But that is a minor inconvenience to be safe at the top. Note your jibe halyard stops short of the mast top. That is when the person on belay lets you climb past the top of the jib and eases the line out as you go. It can be clamped tight and slow your fall should something go wrong.
Safety first. We do not want to hear any "Splat" stories.
jssailem & others,
What a great day! Went to the boat and had the marina go up in the boom lift and check out the sheaves. The main halyard sheave apparently had a screw head or some other hard item wedged in the side against the aluminum....the sheave wouldn't turn or was very difficult to turn. They took a screwdriver and picked it out. Sprayed with some Super Lube and now turns like a top! Main halyard moves free and easy! Crisis averted....like I said, what a great day!
Thank you everyone for your suggestions and input. Very reassuring to have your support and knowledge just a few keystrokes away!
What a great day! Went to the boat and had the marina go up in the boom lift and check out the sheaves. The main halyard sheave apparently had a screw head or some other hard item wedged in the side against the aluminum....the sheave wouldn't turn or was very difficult to turn. They took a screwdriver and picked it out. Sprayed with some Super Lube and now turns like a top! Main halyard moves free and easy! Crisis averted....like I said, what a great day!
Thank you everyone for your suggestions and input. Very reassuring to have your support and knowledge just a few keystrokes away!