Proper Poop Pumping Protocol?

[Stephen Trapani]

Was at a marina I frequent. Pumping out from my Lectra San like I've always done. This time a tourist saw the brown discharge going into the water. He yelled out something to me which I didn't hear. I think his grandsons were fishing for minnows right there. "What did he say?" I said to someone standing on the boat next to me, who appeared to be the tourist's son. The son just shook his head. I said something about having a Lectra San, because I assumed that's why the guy was yelling at me.

A short time later we were over at the fuel dock. A drunken guy (who I believe has a slip at the marina) comes up to me and says, "I heard you were pumping out your holding tank here at the marina!" No, I said, I have a Lectra San. "I don't care," he said. "We don't do that at this marina!" He repeated this over and over.

Make a long story short, he stayed belligerent. I acted apologetic and confused (the perfect way to act with belligerent drunks, I've found). When I asked him if he knew what a Lectra San was he said yes, but he didn't care. I didn't tell him I've been doing the same thing at "his marina" for years. I did tell him I would talk to the owner to find out what to do. I did tell him the Coast Guard inspected and passed the boat-with-Lectra-San right there at that very marina. He eventually drifted away (with his legs).

Anyway, does Peggy or anyone have a better way I could have handled this?

 

[thinwater]

There a 2 sorts of answers.

1. Is it legal. Check the local regulations, but depending on the marina it may be a zero discharge zone (see below) and thus prohibited. Have you asked the marina office or searched the internet?
2. Will your neigbors accept it. Maybe not. Clearly there is no environmental harm in your neighbor curbing his dog on your lawn, but you don't like it for entirly asthetic reasons. The waste may be sterilized and no different than throwing a bucket of dirt in the water, but it's still brown and your nieghbors don't like it.

The rest is all discussion. Focusing on whether the fellow was drunk is missdirection; you have little reason to believe he would feel differently when he is sober, though he might not be so dirrect.

http://swantownmarina.com/DocumentView.aspx?DID=23


"30. Marine Sanitation Device:

All marine sanitation devices

requiring a pump out shall be emptied at the designated

discharge facility or be pumped out by a licensed
contractor. No marine sanitation device such as, but not
limited to, porta-potties, shall be emptied in any toilet, or
restroom facility of the Marina. SWANTOWN MARINA IS
A ZERO DISCHARGE ZONE. AS SUCH, IT IS ILLEGAL
TO DISCHARGE TREATED OR UNTREATED SEWAGE
INTO MARINA WATERS AND WILL RESULT IN
IMMEDIATE TERMINATION OF MARINA DOCKAGE​

LICENSE AGREEMENT."​

 

[Stu Jackson]

C'mon, Stephen. Even if you were 100% right, why get into a pissing (PI) match for nothing. Dump when you're out of the marina.

Simple.

Heck, ya got the danged BOLT off, this one should be easy.

All the best,

Stu

 

[seadaddler]

Maybe

I think lots of people don't really understand about your system,maybe you should also check the law and rules at your marina.
But maybe to play it safe and keep people happy pump iy out into a pump station when ever in a marina.
Nick

 

[Stephen Trapani]

C'mon, Stephen. Even if you were 100% right, why get into a pissing (PI) match for nothing. Dump when you're out of the marina.

Simple.

Heck, ya got the danged BOLT off, this one should be easy.

All the best,

Stu

Well, I stay at this Marina a lot with my family, so I need a definitive answer, which I will get from the owner. Hard not to discharge with the family on board. This Marina has no pumpout station.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

The discharge shouldn't be brown!

The discharge from the LectraSan should look like HIGHLY diluted skim milk with just the faintest tinge of tan. It shouldn't even be noticeable to anyone who isn't sitting right next to the thru-hull. So if yours is putting out a brown discharge that people on a dock or far enough away from it to be fishing, it ain't treating!

THAT''s the first thing you need to deal with!

 

[Head Master18695]

Re: The discharge shouldn't be brown!

The color of the discharge coming out of the Lectra/San will vary according to how long it's been inside the unit and exposed to the chlorine solution generated by the Lectra/San. It can range anywhere in color from brown to milky white. The longer it's inside before coming out, the more the color will be bleached. As was earlier mentioned, it may still be considered to be "distasteful" (choice of wording?) to those who see it coming out of the boat, even though it has been sanitized and isn't harmful to people or the environment.

But on a larger note, if the document that Thinwater produced, applies to the marina in question, then the use of a Lectra/San in that marina is not allowed, even though it is Coast Guard-certified. The rules as produced in that document, say no discharge of sewage into the water, regardless of whether it has been treated or not. Ya can't get much plainer than that... And ya can't argue with it. It's right there in their rules and regulations for the marina. In a privately-owned marina, the dockmaster is king, and his word is law!

 

[Stephen Trapani]

The color of the discharge coming out of the Lectra/San will vary according to how long it's been inside the unit and exposed to the chlorine solution generated by the Lectra/San. It can range anywhere in color from brown to milky white. The longer it's inside before coming out, the more the color will be bleached. As was earlier mentioned, it may still be considered to be "distasteful" (choice of wording?) to those who see it coming out of the boat, even though it has been sanitized and isn't harmful to people or the environment.

But on a larger note, if the document that Thinwater produced, applies to the marina in question, then the use of a Lectra/San in that marina is not allowed, even though it is Coast Guard-certified. The rules as produced in that document, say no discharge of sewage into the water, regardless of whether it has been treated or not. Ya can't get much plainer than that... And ya can't argue with it. It's right there in their rules and regulations for the marina. In a privately-owned marina, the dockmaster is king, and his word is law!

The Marina in question was not Swantown, but Boston Harbor Marina.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

I stand corrected about the color...

But it really doesn't matter 'cuz Boston Harbor and most of the rest of MA waters are No Discharge, which makes it illegal to use your LS...that would apply to all the marinas too. See the EPA NDZ list by state here, http://water.epa.gov/polwaste/vwd/vsdnozone.cfm

Or...wait a sec...your profile puts you in WA, not MA...is there another Boston Harbor in WA???

If there is, and if you find yourself in a "no discharge" marina where pumpout facilities are scarce, you might want to add the "hold 'n' treat" controls to your system...not the complete package, just the controls, which can be retrofitted to any existing system. Check that out here:

http://www.raritaneng.com/products/waste_treatment/holdntreat.html

 

[Lee Coller]

There is a Boston Harbor, WA: http://www.bostonharbormarina.com/

 

[Stephen Trapani]

There is a Boston Harbor, WA: http://www.bostonharbormarina.com/

That's it.

 

[rpwillia]

Discharge

Not trying to be controversial, but here on the Potomac and the Chesapeake the big problem, as I understand it, is all the nutrients. Even if it is treated the discharge is still full of nutrients, which could cause algae blooms. Just because you can doesn't mean that you should, and as you have found out it is tough to alter peoples perceptions. My $0.02

 

[Rick D]

Hey, Peggy, Is This True?

"Even if it is treated the discharge is still full of nutrients"

I don't have a horse in this race, but that got my curiosity going.

 

[shipwreck66]

pump out somewhere else, geez, where has courtesy gone?

 

[Stephen Trapani]

pump out somewhere else, geez, where has courtesy gone?

You get that we don't have a holding tank, right? Essentially we can't use the toilet and so can't stay at that Marina if no discharge is allowed.

 

[Les]

I understand that you have no holding tank. And pumping out in the marina is not acceptable. However, our marina has bathrooms, toilets just for the those that dock here. Doesn't yours? We just walk to the restroom at the head of the dock and use it.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

"Even if it is treated the discharge is still full of nutrients"

I don't have a horse in this race, but that got my curiosity going.

That's a favorite myth of the "no discharge" crowd. The BOD in the discharge from the LectraSan and PuraSan is the equivilant of that in 4 oak leaves landing in the water. Just ONE illegally dumped tank has more negative environmental impact than 1000 boats equipped with LS and PS all sitting in in the same anchorage for 24 hours. So if he's worried about algae blooms on the Bay, he should be looking at the number of macerator pumps on boats instead of treatment devices. He'll find that macerators outnumber treatment devices by about 100-1.

But even faithfully pumping out is no guarantee that tank contents won't land in the water UNtreated during the next sewage treatment plant spill. I've always thought it was the ultimate irony that the very DAY the RI statewide NDZ law went into a effect, a massive sewage treatment plant spill closed all the beaches and shellfish beds in Narragansett Bay for a week.

Right now a sewage treatment plant up the Hudson River from NYC is pumping 5 MILLION gallons of untreated sewage a DAY into the Hudson while damage from a fire to the plant is being repaired. The very same Hudson river that became almost entirely "no discharge" to great ballyhoo and fanfare a few years ago. And a report was just released that Avalon Harbor at Catalina Island--which has the strictest "no discharge" policy in the country--is the dirtiest harbor in the US...their sewer system is full of broken pipes that are pouring all the island's raw sewage into the harbor. So it really makes a lot of sense to make all boats hold their waste so it can be pumped out and THEN discharged into the water in large concentrated untreated quantities instead of allowing boats to discharge one treated small treated flush at a time.

So the truth is, the nutrients in the discharge from the LS or PS is actually LOWER than what's already in most of the waters in which LectraSans are discharging.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

You prob'ly should install a small one, Steve...

You get that we don't have a holding tank, right? Essentially we can't use the toilet and so can't stay at that Marina if no discharge is allowed.

There aren't very many NDZs in your neck of the woods, but there are a few--several Canadian Provincial Park anchorages and maybe a few marinas. It's not a big deal to install 12-15 gallon tank to prevent hassles and also make your boat "legal" no matter where you want to go. Add in the hold 'n' treat controls and you wouldn't even have to mess with pumpouts...just don't turn it on till you're out of the marina.

 

[Stephen Trapani]

There aren't very many NDZs in your neck of the woods, but there are a few--several Canadian Provincial Park anchorages and maybe a few marinas. It's not a big deal to install 12-15 gallon tank to prevent hassles and also make your boat "legal" no matter where you want to go. Add in the hold 'n' treat controls and you wouldn't even have to mess with pumpouts...just don't turn it on till you're out of the marina.

Hmm. Might not be a bad idea. As you said the NDZs here are few and far between. Til now (five years of occasional cruising) have never been in one and never had an issue. I'm waiting for an answer back from the owner of Boston Harbor Marina. I do have a space issue and I am loath to use any of it for a tank I would almost never use. What is the smallest size that would work for overnight? I have tucked the LS into the cabinetry in the head so I feel like I've been having my, um, cake and uh eating it too.

 

[fstbttms]

I understand that you have no holding tank. And pumping out in the marina is not acceptable. However, our marina has bathrooms, toilets just for the those that dock here. Doesn't yours? We just walk to the restroom at the head of the dock and use it.

+1

Of course it has restrooms. But it's just so much easier to be inconsiderate of those working and recreating around you than it is to do the right thing.