Well, I finally took the maiden voyage with my h23 Sunday... What a blast. Being a novice, I am confused where the Jib sheet should be run. I have a 110 jib. I have attached the sheet on the clew then ran the line on the inside of the spreader stay wires, through the block near the side stay chain plate and then to the rear winch. I did this on both sides. When I pull the sheet in real tight everything is fine, but when I let it out the jib hits the side stay wires and if I let it out a lot, the tack area of the jib hits the front stancions and life line. Is this right??? If I go on the outside of the spreader guys, I don't think I could sheet the jib in far enough. Sorry to ask dumb questions, but I have few sailors around here to ask. Also, the sheet line for the jib was 1/2 inch line. God this seems heavy and barely fits under the cleats in the cockpit. Seems like 5/16 or 3/8 would be plenty
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Jib sheet routing
Hi Ward, On my 23, I route the sheets outside the shrouds, inside the lifelines. I don't have any problems sheeting in the jib far enough; I'f I'm pulling the sheet in that tight, I find the boat tends to sail more sideways than forward due to the wing keel. Occasionally, I will run the sheet directly from the sail to the winches, outside the lifelines, for a downwind run (I use my boathook as a makeshift whisker pole). This usually requires a bit of pre-planning, but the jib sheet puts a bit of stress on the lifelines if I don't re-route it for downwind running. I agree, your sheets may be a touch large. If I recall correctly, the recommendation I got was to use 5/16" Sta-set lines (available at West Marine) for the jib sheets. Congratulations on your maiden voyage! Sounds like yours went better than mine... I discovered my leaky cockpit drain thru-hull after, oh, 8 or 9 hours of sailing... My cabin sole boards were floating in about 2" of water when I went to pull the boat out of the water! Be sure to check this particular thru-hull, as well as the lower rudder support pin- These two points are notorious for leaking on the 23, and can rot the wood core in the transom (or sink your boat!) if they go unchecked. --Jon Bastien H23 '2 Sheets to the Wind'
Hi Ward, On my 23, I route the sheets outside the shrouds, inside the lifelines. I don't have any problems sheeting in the jib far enough; I'f I'm pulling the sheet in that tight, I find the boat tends to sail more sideways than forward due to the wing keel. Occasionally, I will run the sheet directly from the sail to the winches, outside the lifelines, for a downwind run (I use my boathook as a makeshift whisker pole). This usually requires a bit of pre-planning, but the jib sheet puts a bit of stress on the lifelines if I don't re-route it for downwind running. I agree, your sheets may be a touch large. If I recall correctly, the recommendation I got was to use 5/16" Sta-set lines (available at West Marine) for the jib sheets. Congratulations on your maiden voyage! Sounds like yours went better than mine... I discovered my leaky cockpit drain thru-hull after, oh, 8 or 9 hours of sailing... My cabin sole boards were floating in about 2" of water when I went to pull the boat out of the water! Be sure to check this particular thru-hull, as well as the lower rudder support pin- These two points are notorious for leaking on the 23, and can rot the wood core in the transom (or sink your boat!) if they go unchecked. --Jon Bastien H23 '2 Sheets to the Wind'
Alternate opinion (of course)
Ward, I've tried every possible route for the jib sheet and come to the conclusion that inside the shrouds is best. With a 23 you must protect you pointing ability and upwind performance. Off wind, well it's a 23 right! This applies to the 110 only. When you go larger you must move the sheets outside the shrouds. As to the sheet size, mine also came with 1/2-inch sheets (main and jib). You do get a better grip and doesn’t hurt any thing unless in very light conditions. But they did look a little pretentious. Mine are hanging in the garage waiting for the bigger boat. I've gone to that new stretch free single braid (5/16). It works well and lets my ratchet block actually ratchet. Now if I can just figure out how to put an eye in it that doesn't look like I did it! Greg
Ward, I've tried every possible route for the jib sheet and come to the conclusion that inside the shrouds is best. With a 23 you must protect you pointing ability and upwind performance. Off wind, well it's a 23 right! This applies to the 110 only. When you go larger you must move the sheets outside the shrouds. As to the sheet size, mine also came with 1/2-inch sheets (main and jib). You do get a better grip and doesn’t hurt any thing unless in very light conditions. But they did look a little pretentious. Mine are hanging in the garage waiting for the bigger boat. I've gone to that new stretch free single braid (5/16). It works well and lets my ratchet block actually ratchet. Now if I can just figure out how to put an eye in it that doesn't look like I did it! Greg
Outside the shrouds
Ward: I have to agree with Jon on this one. I run the sheets for both my jib and my gennie outside of the shrouds and inside the lifelines. It has the drawback that it can eat up the plastic covering on the life-lines, but I think it allows better trimming of the sails. If you run inside either of the shrouds, unless you are hard on the wind, the sheet will have to go around the shround like it is a turning block - hard on the sheet and the shroud. Further, it radically alters the location of the jib lead and therefore the sail shape on most points of sail. I use the factory turning block for the jib, and 3' of track installed on each side with a car and block to give me an adjustable lead for the gennie. The track works fine with the addition of a one inch block under the sheet winch to prevent overrides by changing the vertical angle the sheet comes to the winch. Jim Kolstoe - h23 Kara's Boo
Ward: I have to agree with Jon on this one. I run the sheets for both my jib and my gennie outside of the shrouds and inside the lifelines. It has the drawback that it can eat up the plastic covering on the life-lines, but I think it allows better trimming of the sails. If you run inside either of the shrouds, unless you are hard on the wind, the sheet will have to go around the shround like it is a turning block - hard on the sheet and the shroud. Further, it radically alters the location of the jib lead and therefore the sail shape on most points of sail. I use the factory turning block for the jib, and 3' of track installed on each side with a car and block to give me an adjustable lead for the gennie. The track works fine with the addition of a one inch block under the sheet winch to prevent overrides by changing the vertical angle the sheet comes to the winch. Jim Kolstoe - h23 Kara's Boo
Double Sheet Option on Long Tacks
When staying on the same tack for hours, or even days, and finding yourself having to constantly choose between running the jib sheet in- or outside the shrouds, or up or under the lifelines, you may consider doubling up the leeward (working) sheet. The simplest way is to temporarily reroute the upwind (lazy) sheet to the leeward site while passing it through on the opposite side of the stays and/or lifeline. If you have a big jibcar both sheets may fit through simultaneously (watch out for overrrides) or you may have to rig a snatchblock. Alternatively, you can temporarily tie a third sheet to the jib clew or you can attach a jackline to the working sheet with a rolling hitch or Prusik knot (equivalent to a double or triple cow hitch; use a short piece of webbing) well forward of the offending shroud or lifeline. Similar jacklines can be used to solve tough jib sheet override problems on the winch drum. Success, Flying Dutchman
When staying on the same tack for hours, or even days, and finding yourself having to constantly choose between running the jib sheet in- or outside the shrouds, or up or under the lifelines, you may consider doubling up the leeward (working) sheet. The simplest way is to temporarily reroute the upwind (lazy) sheet to the leeward site while passing it through on the opposite side of the stays and/or lifeline. If you have a big jibcar both sheets may fit through simultaneously (watch out for overrrides) or you may have to rig a snatchblock. Alternatively, you can temporarily tie a third sheet to the jib clew or you can attach a jackline to the working sheet with a rolling hitch or Prusik knot (equivalent to a double or triple cow hitch; use a short piece of webbing) well forward of the offending shroud or lifeline. Similar jacklines can be used to solve tough jib sheet override problems on the winch drum. Success, Flying Dutchman
GREAT1 and more questions
Thanks everyone for the super responses. First, it's nice to know there isn't a 'wrong' way and it sounds like I can play around to see what works best with my 110 jib. When you speak of cars, tracks and snatch blocks, I assume these are genoa track systems that have been added after market. Mine came with one stand up swivel block mounted on each side of the deck near the rear of the cabin. This is the only choice I have for running the sheet to the cockpit. Is this a correct assumption on my part? I need to do some reading/research on lots of things like this so I can at least ask intelligent questions on what I need to change or add to this boat. The original owner had it for 12 years and didn't change or add much of anything as far as I can tell. Until I learn how to sail, I think I better not mess with stuff. Thanks again .... You guys are life savers for information
Thanks everyone for the super responses. First, it's nice to know there isn't a 'wrong' way and it sounds like I can play around to see what works best with my 110 jib. When you speak of cars, tracks and snatch blocks, I assume these are genoa track systems that have been added after market. Mine came with one stand up swivel block mounted on each side of the deck near the rear of the cabin. This is the only choice I have for running the sheet to the cockpit. Is this a correct assumption on my part? I need to do some reading/research on lots of things like this so I can at least ask intelligent questions on what I need to change or add to this boat. The original owner had it for 12 years and didn't change or add much of anything as far as I can tell. Until I learn how to sail, I think I better not mess with stuff. Thanks again .... You guys are life savers for information
Let the games begin!!
Ward; Welcome to the Smaller Boats forum. I too got a great deal of valuable help here while in the early stages of getting to know my H23. I am still gettin to know the boat, so I am far from being an expert. A lot of how you go about tweaking your boat for better performance will depend on which mast and spreaders you have (there are at least two possible masts, Kenyon and Z-Spar, and either 26" or 36" spreaders). If you haven't already done so, you might want to spend some time reading the old posts in the archives. Good luck and happy sailing!! Peter s/v Raven
Ward; Welcome to the Smaller Boats forum. I too got a great deal of valuable help here while in the early stages of getting to know my H23. I am still gettin to know the boat, so I am far from being an expert. A lot of how you go about tweaking your boat for better performance will depend on which mast and spreaders you have (there are at least two possible masts, Kenyon and Z-Spar, and either 26" or 36" spreaders). If you haven't already done so, you might want to spend some time reading the old posts in the archives. Good luck and happy sailing!! Peter s/v Raven
mast & archives
Peter I have a Z Spar mast with 36" spreaders. I have a split backstay adjuster, but have not tuned the rigging yet. I have actually read EVERY archive on the h23 and h23.5..... WOW did my eyes get tired. I printed all the posts concerning tuning and have the owners manual. I plan on using both to tune the mast before I take it out again. Like I said earlier, things are pretty much standard except for a few cleats and the backstay adjuster (I think) so I am open to all suggestions on tweaks and adders
Peter I have a Z Spar mast with 36" spreaders. I have a split backstay adjuster, but have not tuned the rigging yet. I have actually read EVERY archive on the h23 and h23.5..... WOW did my eyes get tired. I printed all the posts concerning tuning and have the owners manual. I plan on using both to tune the mast before I take it out again. Like I said earlier, things are pretty much standard except for a few cleats and the backstay adjuster (I think) so I am open to all suggestions on tweaks and adders
Don't forget to get the Cliff's Notes
Cliff Ruckstuhl knows a great deal about tuning this rig, and he has shared a lot of good advice with people in the Smaller Boats forum based on his experiences in transforming his H23 (with the same mast and spreaders that we have) from also-ran to killer sportboat (smile, Cliff). If you send out a call for help, he will respond. He has e-mailed me quite a few good tips, which I would be more than happy to forward to you, provided it's OK with him. It's not that I think he would mind, I just prefer to be courteous. Hang in there! Peter s/v raven
Cliff Ruckstuhl knows a great deal about tuning this rig, and he has shared a lot of good advice with people in the Smaller Boats forum based on his experiences in transforming his H23 (with the same mast and spreaders that we have) from also-ran to killer sportboat (smile, Cliff). If you send out a call for help, he will respond. He has e-mailed me quite a few good tips, which I would be more than happy to forward to you, provided it's OK with him. It's not that I think he would mind, I just prefer to be courteous. Hang in there! Peter s/v raven
Got Cliff notes
Thanks Peter.. Printed all posts that cliff did... esp. about tuning mast. To be honest, I am waiting for an experienced friend to help cause I am still clueless.
Thanks Peter.. Printed all posts that cliff did... esp. about tuning mast. To be honest, I am waiting for an experienced friend to help cause I am still clueless.
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