I'm new to inboards, chargers, alternators, etc. and need some help. I've been to the archives, but couldn't find the answer. I have two house batteries & one starting battery. I also have shore power with a charger. For whatever reason, the batteries wouldn't hold a charge very long whether from an engine charge or shore power. I checked the water levels in each cell in each battery, and found them pretty much dry; at least I couldn't see any liquid. Shame on me, I should've checked them when I took delivery. I ended up adding a little less than a gallon of water total. I got some "charge", as I was able to listen to the radio the next day for a while before it cut out. The charger obviously didn't fully charge them in 24 hours. Next, after 24 hours of charge, I measured the density with a hydrometer, and all three read "charge". According to the stickers on the sides of the house bank, they were delivered in March 2002(Seaworthy Series 27 I think.) The starting battery does have enough juice to start the engine, even though the hydrometer reads charge. Should I replace all three batteries (ouch!)? Is there something else I could be overlooking, or is the hydrometer answering my question? I know it's my responsibility, but is it unreasonable to expect the surveyor would've checked and reported this?
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did you use distilled water???
Tap water kills batteries Fast!!!! Are you sure that your battery charger is working???
Tap water kills batteries Fast!!!! Are you sure that your battery charger is working???
Would you like some butter with that toast
Personaly, I would at least replace the starting battery. If you then want to play around to see if you can breath any life back into them, at least you can get home. Given you have no clue how long they were dry or how much dry charging occured, odds are not in your favor of saving them, they are probably tosted, but for the cost of battery acid why not give it a try. Are you sure your charger is OK and not cookiing the batteries? It seem a tad odd for all the batteries to be dry.
Personaly, I would at least replace the starting battery. If you then want to play around to see if you can breath any life back into them, at least you can get home. Given you have no clue how long they were dry or how much dry charging occured, odds are not in your favor of saving them, they are probably tosted, but for the cost of battery acid why not give it a try. Are you sure your charger is OK and not cookiing the batteries? It seem a tad odd for all the batteries to be dry.
Checks
Hi Harry, Hope you added distilled water - if not battery capacity will be reduced and amount depends on quality of water added. Also the batteries lost some capacity when the plates were exposed. It will take a while to fully charge battery after adding water. Most likely you should be able to fully charge batteries. You can disconnect a terminal at the battery after charging to be sure the problem is with the battery. If the battery fails to hold charge as indicated by hydrometer = replace. If the battery holds charge, then you need to find what is discharging the battery. Also need to find out what's causing loss of battery water. Shore power recharge my be overcharging or engine charger? Terminal connection. Remove, clean post and clamp and reconnect using conductive grease (avialable at Auto Supply Stores). Not related to your problem - just good pratice. Good Luck, Bob
Hi Harry, Hope you added distilled water - if not battery capacity will be reduced and amount depends on quality of water added. Also the batteries lost some capacity when the plates were exposed. It will take a while to fully charge battery after adding water. Most likely you should be able to fully charge batteries. You can disconnect a terminal at the battery after charging to be sure the problem is with the battery. If the battery fails to hold charge as indicated by hydrometer = replace. If the battery holds charge, then you need to find what is discharging the battery. Also need to find out what's causing loss of battery water. Shore power recharge my be overcharging or engine charger? Terminal connection. Remove, clean post and clamp and reconnect using conductive grease (avialable at Auto Supply Stores). Not related to your problem - just good pratice. Good Luck, Bob
Dry Batteries
Harry Bill's right, dry batteries (at least as WAY DRY as you explained) are toast. Rare will you ever be able to do anything with them, the plates are fried, if they're that low. It coudl also be that your charger isn't any good, and will take a week to recharge them. See below. I wouldn't go after the surveyor. NOt only is it bad form to "go after" people, but it sure is something that he could point out was your maintenance responsibility. If they worked when he was onboard, why would he say anything special. Did he ask you to check the fuel levels or oil level in the inboard engine? You should also determine if you have a good or bad shorepower charger. You'll be looking for a three stage charger, best recommendation has been Xantrex Statpower, either the 20 or 40 amp model, that provides the correct three stage charge to your batteries. Say your batteries are toasted, as you spend $xyz getting new ones, only to have a bad charger fry THEM next. The $ you spend in a good charger will extend the life of your new batteries and will payback almost immediately by lengthening the life of your new ones. The charger should cost about the same as 2 new quality deep cycle batteries. Once you get that sorted out, then start with understanding the alternator charging system. But, the VERY best $50 you can spend on your boat is Nigel Calder's Boatowner's Manual. In lieu of us "re-writing" books that have already been written, and explaining complicated electrical boat systems, why not try it out? You could either try a library, sit down in a marine store for an hour, or buy the book. Also, Santa's on his way! Do a forum search on Calder, you'll see tons of suggestions to "BUY THE BOOK." Good luck, congratulations on your new boat, you'll enjoy. Stu PS: for the life of me I still can't figure out why people don't tell us what KIND of boat they have
Harry Bill's right, dry batteries (at least as WAY DRY as you explained) are toast. Rare will you ever be able to do anything with them, the plates are fried, if they're that low. It coudl also be that your charger isn't any good, and will take a week to recharge them. See below. I wouldn't go after the surveyor. NOt only is it bad form to "go after" people, but it sure is something that he could point out was your maintenance responsibility. If they worked when he was onboard, why would he say anything special. Did he ask you to check the fuel levels or oil level in the inboard engine? You should also determine if you have a good or bad shorepower charger. You'll be looking for a three stage charger, best recommendation has been Xantrex Statpower, either the 20 or 40 amp model, that provides the correct three stage charge to your batteries. Say your batteries are toasted, as you spend $xyz getting new ones, only to have a bad charger fry THEM next. The $ you spend in a good charger will extend the life of your new batteries and will payback almost immediately by lengthening the life of your new ones. The charger should cost about the same as 2 new quality deep cycle batteries. Once you get that sorted out, then start with understanding the alternator charging system. But, the VERY best $50 you can spend on your boat is Nigel Calder's Boatowner's Manual. In lieu of us "re-writing" books that have already been written, and explaining complicated electrical boat systems, why not try it out? You could either try a library, sit down in a marine store for an hour, or buy the book. Also, Santa's on his way! Do a forum search on Calder, you'll see tons of suggestions to "BUY THE BOOK." Good luck, congratulations on your new boat, you'll enjoy. Stu PS: for the life of me I still can't figure out why people don't tell us what KIND of boat they have
Batteries or Charger?
You may be simply outa luck. Since all three were low on water, it is probably not a result of a single bad battery but rather a "systemic" problem. Ask yourself why all three had low water? Some questions: 1) What sort of charger do you have? Some of the cheapies can severely overcharge a battery and "boil" off the water. 2) Re above - was the charger on all the time? 3) How the batteries connected together - in normal operation and while charging? 4) Do you have any way of monitoring current in/out of the battery? 4) It may be too late, but can you do an equalize charge with your charger?
You may be simply outa luck. Since all three were low on water, it is probably not a result of a single bad battery but rather a "systemic" problem. Ask yourself why all three had low water? Some questions: 1) What sort of charger do you have? Some of the cheapies can severely overcharge a battery and "boil" off the water. 2) Re above - was the charger on all the time? 3) How the batteries connected together - in normal operation and while charging? 4) Do you have any way of monitoring current in/out of the battery? 4) It may be too late, but can you do an equalize charge with your charger?
Your batteries might be toast if
they get very warm or hot while being charged. Good batteries do not get hot.
they get very warm or hot while being charged. Good batteries do not get hot.
Battery Problems
I have the same problem, I checked the diodes, a sort of electrical check vavle that in case prevents the alternator from being a load, "we" blow these by turning the ignition key to stop the diesel engine when, in fact, choking the fuel supply is the proper way to stop the engine. Could this be your problem? You should be able to check continuity across the open battery leads, open meaning not terminated, you should not have continuity. Good luck Ron
I have the same problem, I checked the diodes, a sort of electrical check vavle that in case prevents the alternator from being a load, "we" blow these by turning the ignition key to stop the diesel engine when, in fact, choking the fuel supply is the proper way to stop the engine. Could this be your problem? You should be able to check continuity across the open battery leads, open meaning not terminated, you should not have continuity. Good luck Ron
Take them out of the boat and have them tested.
Harry: Take them out of the boat and have them tested. A garage will put them on a commercial charger and load test them. Even if it appears that a battery is charged they can get a surface charge and really not have any AMPS left. There are places like Costco, Sam Club etc that sell deep cycle batteries at very reasonable prices. It is just about the time of year to winterize the boat, so I would wait until next season to replace them unless you are going to leave her in the water. In that case, just replace your starter battery and use it for the bilge pump and what little you will need until the spring launch.
Harry: Take them out of the boat and have them tested. A garage will put them on a commercial charger and load test them. Even if it appears that a battery is charged they can get a surface charge and really not have any AMPS left. There are places like Costco, Sam Club etc that sell deep cycle batteries at very reasonable prices. It is just about the time of year to winterize the boat, so I would wait until next season to replace them unless you are going to leave her in the water. In that case, just replace your starter battery and use it for the bilge pump and what little you will need until the spring launch.
well water is bad!!!
Batteries work by changing around ions which are charged particles. Well water usually has a lot of ions that can interfere. calcium and magnesium ions are probably the worst and are usually present in well water. They compete with the lead in the battery and form sludge. Chlorine or fluorine bind to lead and form sludge. Always use the purest water you can find to fill batteries. If you buy purified water at the grocery store make sure that they haven't added magnesium back to the water as this makes it taste better.
Batteries work by changing around ions which are charged particles. Well water usually has a lot of ions that can interfere. calcium and magnesium ions are probably the worst and are usually present in well water. They compete with the lead in the battery and form sludge. Chlorine or fluorine bind to lead and form sludge. Always use the purest water you can find to fill batteries. If you buy purified water at the grocery store make sure that they haven't added magnesium back to the water as this makes it taste better.
Good responses EXCEPT for
All the responses are all good information except adding battery acid to the dry battery , never do this. Repeat after me, I WILL NEVER ADD BATTERY ACID TO A BATTERY THAT HAS DRIED UP, EVER!! This will create too concentrated level off sulfuric acid and the battery will die in short order . When a battery is dry only the water has left the acid solution in the battery, the sulfuric acid electrolyte remains. Repeat after me, I WILL GO OUT AND BUY NIGEL CALDERS BOOK (BIBLE) TODAY. Good luck, Tim
All the responses are all good information except adding battery acid to the dry battery , never do this. Repeat after me, I WILL NEVER ADD BATTERY ACID TO A BATTERY THAT HAS DRIED UP, EVER!! This will create too concentrated level off sulfuric acid and the battery will die in short order . When a battery is dry only the water has left the acid solution in the battery, the sulfuric acid electrolyte remains. Repeat after me, I WILL GO OUT AND BUY NIGEL CALDERS BOOK (BIBLE) TODAY. Good luck, Tim
When he says "purest" water you can find
he means "distilled" water. You can find that in most grocery stores. (it shouldn't taste good...it should be kind of bland tasting). I am not sure how much of your battery plates were exposed to air and for how long. But I have actually been able to keep using some batteries that had the water "boil" out and expose some plates. They probably weren't as strong as before, but they seemed to work fine for me. Refill the batteries with distilled water and try to Equalize the batteries a few times. One more question. Do you have a "real" 3-stage marine charger installed? What brand/type?
he means "distilled" water. You can find that in most grocery stores. (it shouldn't taste good...it should be kind of bland tasting). I am not sure how much of your battery plates were exposed to air and for how long. But I have actually been able to keep using some batteries that had the water "boil" out and expose some plates. They probably weren't as strong as before, but they seemed to work fine for me. Refill the batteries with distilled water and try to Equalize the batteries a few times. One more question. Do you have a "real" 3-stage marine charger installed? What brand/type?
Their SHOT!
I had the same thing happen to me. Be sure and check your charger. Your batteries have been cooked and will need to be replaced. Take a hard look at your charger. If it is an older one,purchase one of the new computerized step chargers. They are not that expensive and well worth the money.
I had the same thing happen to me. Be sure and check your charger. Your batteries have been cooked and will need to be replaced. Take a hard look at your charger. If it is an older one,purchase one of the new computerized step chargers. They are not that expensive and well worth the money.
Tom, I have a Guest 2608 charger
The owners mauual says it is a three stage charger. How would I test it to determine if it is working properly?
The owners mauual says it is a three stage charger. How would I test it to determine if it is working properly?
Guest charger
The guest charger is marginal capcity for the 3 batteries you have . It would take 40 hours to fully charge from flat given the output as advertised. Is it set up with 2 bank curcuits? The health of the batteries most likely have some internal short minimising recharge and allowing self discharge problems. The charger would be less overwhelmed if you only charged one bank at a time regarding recharge time. Review the usage of the d.c. system and you may find you really do want a higher charge rate charger to maintain the system and monthly equalize.
The guest charger is marginal capcity for the 3 batteries you have . It would take 40 hours to fully charge from flat given the output as advertised. Is it set up with 2 bank curcuits? The health of the batteries most likely have some internal short minimising recharge and allowing self discharge problems. The charger would be less overwhelmed if you only charged one bank at a time regarding recharge time. Review the usage of the d.c. system and you may find you really do want a higher charge rate charger to maintain the system and monthly equalize.
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