Planning new standing rigging.

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Jun 2, 2004
5,802
Hunter 37-cutter, '79 41 23' 30"N 82 33' 20"W--------Huron, OH
My boat was delivered by truck yesterday so obviously the mast is horizontal. I plan to replace all standing rigging so I have been checking wire prices. The difference in cost is hard to believe. Example of the unit cost of 9/32", 1x19, 316 stainless: WM = $5.36, D = $3.39, R-O = $2.02

Can this be right? I guess I had better call and confirm.
 
Jun 8, 2004
83
Kirie-Elite Elite 37 Niceville, FL
Cost difference

I recently had to replace the 3/16 stainless 316 steering cable on my boat and noted the same difference. I asked WM to price match, but they refused, so I purchased from the low cost vendor. I compared samples of all and I couldn't tell the difference, other than the low cost cable was manufactured in China.
 
Nov 22, 2008
3,562
Endeavour 32 Portland, Maine
low cost cable was manufactured in China.
After having a Chinese main sheet shackle (Suncore) explode on me this summer, I've gotten a bit skeptical about Chinese stainless. The Winchard's I replaced all my main sheet shackles with were four times the price but I feel a lot better when the boat is going hard in a tight spot.

I'm about to start planning a full standing rigging replacement as well so there will probably be more discussion.
 
Jun 2, 2004
5,802
Hunter 37-cutter, '79 41 23' 30"N 82 33' 20"W--------Huron, OH
Those China comments do bother me. I reread the intro to Rigging-Only's wire section: http://www.riggingonly.com/wire.htm#WIRE . The paragraph "Buying Wire" gives one some confidence but does not mention the location of the mill or twister. WM uses Loos Co. wire which I think is a U.S. manufacturer.
 
Dec 2, 1999
15,184
Hunter Vision-36 Rio Vista, CA.
Ed:

You may want to check with Seco South. They were the OEM mfg for Hunter. A friend just got a quote on all new standing rigging for a H'376 ($1650) plus freight.
 
Nov 6, 2006
10,050
Hunter 34 Mandeville Louisiana
While I was working as an Injun-Ear, we had several problems where the fasteners and welding consumables that we sourced from US vendors turned out to be from China and was not what we ordered.. Stainless (300 series) was the biggest problem.. Same with wire rope that we used for crane roving. Lots of issues with not meeting testing standards.. Got to where we did our own metal chemical analysis and marked the stuff with paint so that when it showed up, we could easily see that an item had been analyzed and was what it was supposed to be. Yes, the paint was special and no it was not available at the job site! We had one incident (lmid '90's) where three persons were killed because the alloy in use was not stainless when it was supposed to be. The company got a lot more interested in metals verification after that.. We even had problems with shops in India.. On a few big pressure vessels, they weld overlaid correct material on substandard material. The nuclear analyzer said it was fine .. until we ground down a little and found the bad stuff.. very sneaky ! It was only caught because one of our zealous welding inspectors thought it looked funny and pressed further.
In our new "Global Marketplace" it pays to be cautious !
Ed, you should be able to trace where the wire came from and what it actually is, from the spool numbers that you should be able to get from the supplier to the rigging company.. Good luck..
EDIT.. I want to add that we found a lot of good stuff being made in China.. and the company did not stop buying there ..but we used a more rigorous testing procedure on items that were from there. We found in one case an Italian supplier who had substituted some Italian substandard metal in an order that was supposed to be filled from a Chinese manufacturer. Amazing!
 
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higgs

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Aug 24, 2005
3,704
Nassau 34 Olcott, NY
I would not get chinese wire under any circumstances. If you look at that country's recent history - dry wall, lead paint - they seem to lack consistent quality control.
 
Dec 2, 1999
15,184
Hunter Vision-36 Rio Vista, CA.
Higgs:

I am NOT disagreeing with you about Chinese products. I always try to avoid them whenever possible.

The difference is if we have a US or European mfg that is making their products over there vs the US or Europe. If you have a company that is making quality products there should be some assurance that you are getting a quality product. Many of the best mfg. in the world are multinational and have factories all over the world.
 
Jun 2, 2004
5,802
Hunter 37-cutter, '79 41 23' 30"N 82 33' 20"W--------Huron, OH
Good point Steve. I checked the Seco South price for 9/32", $1.53 ! I have to believe that Seco and Rigging-Only wire is made offshore. A product can have a label on it that turns out to be a supplier, not a manufacturer. Or you can have wire made offshore but twisted in the U.S. so it has that manufacturer's label. I'm not sure you can really know unless you call and they are forthcoming.
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
Hamilton Marine lists Loos 9/32 1-19 by the foot for 3.62 By the 250 foot reel $539.99
 

Rick D

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Jun 14, 2008
7,182
Hunter Legend 40.5 Shoreline Marina Long Beach CA
FWIW, my rigger said Seco South uses good quality domestic wire. I have no way to independently verify that; just passing on what I was told.
 
Jun 2, 2004
5,802
Hunter 37-cutter, '79 41 23' 30"N 82 33' 20"W--------Huron, OH
We are talking here about three hundred feet of wire or more(two stays, four lower shrouds, and two uppers). I wasn't going to do the baby stay or running backstays. A dollar and a half additional per foot starts to add up. And that doesn't include a hundred and fifty feet of lifeline.

What started this analysis was when my marina said they could do it for a lot less than WM. I sent them a copy of my spreadsheet with all the pricing that I have from Seco South and Rigging-Only. That includes all the terminals, basically eight turnbuckles with studs and eight eyes. That totals around $1050. not counting any labor.
 
Dec 2, 1999
15,184
Hunter Vision-36 Rio Vista, CA.
Ed:

The price that I quoted from Seco South was for complete standing rigging. I believe that the top fittings are swedged & the bottom ones are mechanical.
 
May 24, 2004
7,164
CC 30 South Florida
It's hard to tell where something is manufactured anymore. I guess you may find good quality and bad quality everywhere. I would pay the extra bucks to get my riggin from a reputable company in the US and if anything breaks prematurely I'll know which tree to go barking up.
 

Joe

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Jun 1, 2004
8,163
Catalina 27 Mission Bay, San Diego
My boat was delivered by truck yesterday so obviously the mast is horizontal. I plan to replace all standing rigging so I have been checking wire prices. The difference in cost is hard to believe. Example of the unit cost of 9/32", 1x19, 316 stainless: WM = $5.36, D = $3.39, R-O = $2.02

Can this be right? I guess I had better call and confirm.
All this discussion is moot when you include west marine in the mix.... they will always be way higher than anyone else becaues they're ... West Marine. I found a local rigging shop whose quote was significantly less than any online or national store price. Go local.
 
Sep 25, 2008
544
Bristol 43.3 Perth Amboy
Seco South

When you order from Defender, they are having Secco South make it up.
 
Jan 22, 2008
1,483
Hunter 37 C sloop Punta Gorda FL
re" gives one some confidence but does not mention the location of the mill or twister. WM uses Loos Co. wire which I think is a U.S. manufacturer.
Loos is a Florida headquartered company. No telling where thier wire mill is or if they make their own.
 
Jan 22, 2008
880
Fed up w/ personal attacks I'm done with SBO
Back in the 80's one of the knocks on the beautiful Taiwan boats (Hans Christians, Babas, etc.) were the metals, 100% of them had to be replaced due to grossly inferior quality. This included rigging, chainplates, tanks, the works.

Sounds like not much has changed in 25 years.
 
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