Laura Gainey, the daughter of Hockey Hall of Famer and Montreal Canadiens general manager Bob Gainey, was swept overboard from a ship by a wave and remained lost in the Atlantic ocean on Sunday. Gainey, 25, was washed overboard by a rogue wave 700 kilometres southeast of Cape Cod on Friday evening, triggering a massive air and sea search by Canadian and U.S. rescuers. Hopes of finding Gainey, who was not wearing a life jacket, were fading after more than 40 hours but rescuers said they would continue to search through Sunday night.
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womething is bothering me
I mean no disrespect, but why didn't she have on a life jacket, at night? Her father is a multimillionaire and sospenders are so inexpensive, I wonder why she didn't have these lightweight things on. As well as a light tube, strobe, whistle, or flashlight. Nothing. Would any of you sail at night, in rough seas (the Captain said they went through a few gales already), without these simple precations? My, at least clip on to a life line when on deck. In my opinion, the Captain should lose his licence, be fined, and spend some jail time here if the facts are so simple as she was washed overboard.
I mean no disrespect, but why didn't she have on a life jacket, at night? Her father is a multimillionaire and sospenders are so inexpensive, I wonder why she didn't have these lightweight things on. As well as a light tube, strobe, whistle, or flashlight. Nothing. Would any of you sail at night, in rough seas (the Captain said they went through a few gales already), without these simple precations? My, at least clip on to a life line when on deck. In my opinion, the Captain should lose his licence, be fined, and spend some jail time here if the facts are so simple as she was washed overboard.
Very Extensive Coverage Here
The Canadian press has covered this very extensively. She was swept off a partially covered deck on the stern, and over the fixed rails. The wave was described as rogue, although the winds were in the 40-50 knot range and waves of about 20 feet. She was quite an experienced tall ship sailor, having spent 3 months on the same ship previously. I doubt that it is possible to be tethered on a ship this large and still serve a useful function; the distances are just too big. PFD and strobe? Don't see why not if there is a gale blowing and you are on deck.
The Canadian press has covered this very extensively. She was swept off a partially covered deck on the stern, and over the fixed rails. The wave was described as rogue, although the winds were in the 40-50 knot range and waves of about 20 feet. She was quite an experienced tall ship sailor, having spent 3 months on the same ship previously. I doubt that it is possible to be tethered on a ship this large and still serve a useful function; the distances are just too big. PFD and strobe? Don't see why not if there is a gale blowing and you are on deck.
Well Spoken Ross? Come on!!
Don't you wear a seat belt? And being in your car is like being below on a ship. WHat if it were a motorcycle instead? Would you wear leathers or some protection from the elements when it is rainy, windy, and cold, including a helmet? It isn't an Ocean Liner, but when one of those suckers gets hit by a rogue wave, EVERYONE is required to put on a life jacket. So, why not do it as a precaution, before disaster hits on a smaller ship like the PC? Ever been out on the ocean in 20 foot seas, with 40 knot winds? Sounds like potential trouble to me and not a trip to the corner grocery store. Lastly, the PC came into Cleveland last summer for the Tall Ships festival and I can assure you, it isn't that big. Not big enough anyway for me to not wear something for survival at night in not so fair conditions. Well said Tom.
Don't you wear a seat belt? And being in your car is like being below on a ship. WHat if it were a motorcycle instead? Would you wear leathers or some protection from the elements when it is rainy, windy, and cold, including a helmet? It isn't an Ocean Liner, but when one of those suckers gets hit by a rogue wave, EVERYONE is required to put on a life jacket. So, why not do it as a precaution, before disaster hits on a smaller ship like the PC? Ever been out on the ocean in 20 foot seas, with 40 knot winds? Sounds like potential trouble to me and not a trip to the corner grocery store. Lastly, the PC came into Cleveland last summer for the Tall Ships festival and I can assure you, it isn't that big. Not big enough anyway for me to not wear something for survival at night in not so fair conditions. Well said Tom.
180 ft is small for ocean
180 feet is not all that big. I was on a 700 feet cruise ship one December. The 50kt wind and 30ft wave came up one night and we have to hang on the rail to walk. That was an order of magnitute larger and heavier ship with computer controlled stablizer. Young people have a tendency to feel invincible. It is the captain's job to instill safety practice to all on board. Strong swimmer or not is not the issue. A person wash overboard may hit something on the way and became unconscious. Wearing a PFD might have saved her. A strobe would help locate her in the dark. It's a sad story.
180 feet is not all that big. I was on a 700 feet cruise ship one December. The 50kt wind and 30ft wave came up one night and we have to hang on the rail to walk. That was an order of magnitute larger and heavier ship with computer controlled stablizer. Young people have a tendency to feel invincible. It is the captain's job to instill safety practice to all on board. Strong swimmer or not is not the issue. A person wash overboard may hit something on the way and became unconscious. Wearing a PFD might have saved her. A strobe would help locate her in the dark. It's a sad story.
Sorry guys, but I have to agree with Tom...
Heavy weather and big seas dictate safety equipment when on deck. We do it on our own boats, this is nothing different. And comparing it to a trip down to the corner store is downright ridiculous. Cheers, Bob
Heavy weather and big seas dictate safety equipment when on deck. We do it on our own boats, this is nothing different. And comparing it to a trip down to the corner store is downright ridiculous. Cheers, Bob
Required to Lock through
The corps of engineers requires PFD to lock through. A lock is a lot smaller and calmer than the sea in a gale. It is so hard to find someone in rough conditions. We lost a diver one time and it took a couple of hours with 4 boats searching a fairly small area. The waves were only 4-5' but that is enough to keep someone in the water out of sight most of the time. We were about to call for a helicopter when the diver was found. He had a pretty wild look on his face after only a couple of hours alone in deep water. Without a PFD and in gale conditions she probably was dead withing an hour. It's hard to breath in rough conditions even with a PFD without one even an expert swimmer would quickly tire.
The corps of engineers requires PFD to lock through. A lock is a lot smaller and calmer than the sea in a gale. It is so hard to find someone in rough conditions. We lost a diver one time and it took a couple of hours with 4 boats searching a fairly small area. The waves were only 4-5' but that is enough to keep someone in the water out of sight most of the time. We were about to call for a helicopter when the diver was found. He had a pretty wild look on his face after only a couple of hours alone in deep water. Without a PFD and in gale conditions she probably was dead withing an hour. It's hard to breath in rough conditions even with a PFD without one even an expert swimmer would quickly tire.
Yep....sad
But what I don't understand is what that ship is doing out this time of the year that far north. The other thing that worries me is, I am starting to hear more and more about Rogue waves happening. If they really are that common, I wonder how many sailboats have been swallowed up by them.
But what I don't understand is what that ship is doing out this time of the year that far north. The other thing that worries me is, I am starting to hear more and more about Rogue waves happening. If they really are that common, I wonder how many sailboats have been swallowed up by them.
My Own Boat PFD Policy
After reading for years about the freak accidents that the sea can cause, this summer I finally instituted a policy of Mustangs On Deck on my boat. Basically, before we leave the dock the auto-inflate Mustangs go on. Or in the dink. All on board. Mandatory. At anchor they come off. Buying 4 of them was not exactly cheap but no issue when compared with the risk of loss-of-life or serious injury. When wearing my Mustang now, I do not even notice it. There is more to this story. She was a troubled young woman at one time.
After reading for years about the freak accidents that the sea can cause, this summer I finally instituted a policy of Mustangs On Deck on my boat. Basically, before we leave the dock the auto-inflate Mustangs go on. Or in the dink. All on board. Mandatory. At anchor they come off. Buying 4 of them was not exactly cheap but no issue when compared with the risk of loss-of-life or serious injury. When wearing my Mustang now, I do not even notice it. There is more to this story. She was a troubled young woman at one time.
Franklin, There is a term seldom heard
these days. "Went Missing". Many boats "went missing" on ocean crossings before radio communication was so available. Joshua Slocum "went missing" after his famous around alone voyage. We will never know why they went missing. The term was used because the boat left one port and never was reported to have arrived in another port.
these days. "Went Missing". Many boats "went missing" on ocean crossings before radio communication was so available. Joshua Slocum "went missing" after his famous around alone voyage. We will never know why they went missing. The term was used because the boat left one port and never was reported to have arrived in another port.
I think the term "rogue wave"...
...has become much overused and abused since the film "The Perfect Storm." Nowadays, everytime a boat or ship pitches or rolls it's because of a rogue wave. There are so many rogue waves these days that I think at this point the common wave has become rare.
...has become much overused and abused since the film "The Perfect Storm." Nowadays, everytime a boat or ship pitches or rolls it's because of a rogue wave. There are so many rogue waves these days that I think at this point the common wave has become rare.
Wearing PFD's underway.
Hi folk's, like Tula's Skipper said, the policy on my boat will be PFD's while underway. If you are thrown in the water without it on who knows how long the crew will take to get you back on...assuming they know you went off. Was SCUBA diving once, came up wwaayy behind the boat, managed to grab the line that floats out a couple hundred yards behind, and I was about that far back. (Current was racing, thats how I got that far back there in the first place.) If only I would have had a snorkle...which anyone with any sence will have...but I was a super diver back then...couldn't tell me squat...I would have have been able to breathe without sucking half the Bahamian water down my throat. Came ral close to running out of strength and buying the farm. Lesson learned...it's called a safety divice...only if it is used. And yes, I know they are not the most comfortable or stylish things to wear, and there are folks that will say I'm nuts or crazy...Hey, I hear that all the time! lol Jack Hart SEA-YA!
Hi folk's, like Tula's Skipper said, the policy on my boat will be PFD's while underway. If you are thrown in the water without it on who knows how long the crew will take to get you back on...assuming they know you went off. Was SCUBA diving once, came up wwaayy behind the boat, managed to grab the line that floats out a couple hundred yards behind, and I was about that far back. (Current was racing, thats how I got that far back there in the first place.) If only I would have had a snorkle...which anyone with any sence will have...but I was a super diver back then...couldn't tell me squat...I would have have been able to breathe without sucking half the Bahamian water down my throat. Came ral close to running out of strength and buying the farm. Lesson learned...it's called a safety divice...only if it is used. And yes, I know they are not the most comfortable or stylish things to wear, and there are folks that will say I'm nuts or crazy...Hey, I hear that all the time! lol Jack Hart SEA-YA!
Statistics On Waves
There are statistics on how frequently a wave will be X number of times higher than the average wave. The larger the X the less frequent the event. But waves 4-5 times larger than average are not rare. So in a sea with 10' waves being average you should expect a 20 -30' wave to appear. Also it is a pattern thing. You don't get a 40' wave that marches horizon to horizon, rather it appears briefly and then disappears. If you are lucky to be at the spot it appears when it appears "good luck". The water depth is also critical. A large wave in open water might go unnoticed but in shallower water it would be a dangerous breaking wave. Back in my beach boat days I pitchpoled coming back through the surf one time. I was out in deeper water and didn't really notice that it was much rougher until trying to return to shore. Everyone has noticed that it gets much rougher when you are trying to enter an inlet on a falling tide. The current really makes the waves stand up tall and steep. I've been known to wait until the tide starts to flood back in if it's rough outside.
There are statistics on how frequently a wave will be X number of times higher than the average wave. The larger the X the less frequent the event. But waves 4-5 times larger than average are not rare. So in a sea with 10' waves being average you should expect a 20 -30' wave to appear. Also it is a pattern thing. You don't get a 40' wave that marches horizon to horizon, rather it appears briefly and then disappears. If you are lucky to be at the spot it appears when it appears "good luck". The water depth is also critical. A large wave in open water might go unnoticed but in shallower water it would be a dangerous breaking wave. Back in my beach boat days I pitchpoled coming back through the surf one time. I was out in deeper water and didn't really notice that it was much rougher until trying to return to shore. Everyone has noticed that it gets much rougher when you are trying to enter an inlet on a falling tide. The current really makes the waves stand up tall and steep. I've been known to wait until the tide starts to flood back in if it's rough outside.
Picton Castle was the setting for the recent book "Fair Wind and Plenty of It". Anyone interested in learning more about the captain, the ship or its mission (or who just likes sailing) should pick up a copy. The narrator of the book explains why Picton Castle was in the winter North Atlantic for his voyage; maybe it's the same reason as why she is there now as well.
Ditto Tula's Skipper
No one rides in my boat without a PFD on. Don't want to wear one? Then get off my boat. The state-of-the-art in inflatable PFDs is such that there is no excuse for not wearing one. Unless, of course, you are like the dummies who want to ride motorcycles with no helmets and have us all pick up the tab for their brain surgery. Or the morons who ski out-of-bounds and expect the Search & Rescue to come find them. Give your loved ones a break. At least wear a PFD for them.
No one rides in my boat without a PFD on. Don't want to wear one? Then get off my boat. The state-of-the-art in inflatable PFDs is such that there is no excuse for not wearing one. Unless, of course, you are like the dummies who want to ride motorcycles with no helmets and have us all pick up the tab for their brain surgery. Or the morons who ski out-of-bounds and expect the Search & Rescue to come find them. Give your loved ones a break. At least wear a PFD for them.
Good Site on Rogue Waves
Great article from the European Satellite Agency, which conducted a world wide oceanic survey. Site is linked below. Based on their defination, this incident was not a monster, ship sinking wave, but was probably just a 4x normal height one. Scary enough for me. "Severe weather has sunk more than 200 supertankers and container ships exceeding 200 metres in length during the last two decades. Rogue waves are believed to be the major cause in many such cases. Mariners who survived similar encounters have had remarkable stories to tell. In February 1995 the cruiser liner Queen Elizabeth II met a 29-metre high rogue wave during a hurricane in the North Atlantic that Captain Ronald Warwick described as "a great wall of water… it looked as if we were going into the White Cliffs of Dover." And within the week between February and March 2001 two hardened tourist cruisers – the Bremen and the Caledonian Star – had their bridge windows smashed by 30-metre rogue waves in the South Atlantic, the former ship left drifting without navigation or propulsion for a period of two hours. Damage done by a rogue wave "The incidents occurred less than a thousand kilometres apart from each other," said Wolfgang Rosenthal - Senior Scientist with the GKSS Forschungszentrum GmbH research centre, located in Geesthacht in Germany - who has studied rogue waves for years. "All the electronics were switched off on the Bremen as they drifted parallel to the waves, and until they were turned on again the crew were thinking it could have been their last day alive. "The same phenomenon could have sunk many less lucky vessels: two large ships sink every week on average, but the cause is never studied to the same detail as an air crash. It simply gets put down to 'bad weather'." Offshore platforms have also been struck: on 1 January 1995 the Draupner oil rig in the North Sea was hit by a wave whose height was measured by an onboard laser device at 26 metres, with the highest waves around it reaching 12 metres."
Great article from the European Satellite Agency, which conducted a world wide oceanic survey. Site is linked below. Based on their defination, this incident was not a monster, ship sinking wave, but was probably just a 4x normal height one. Scary enough for me. "Severe weather has sunk more than 200 supertankers and container ships exceeding 200 metres in length during the last two decades. Rogue waves are believed to be the major cause in many such cases. Mariners who survived similar encounters have had remarkable stories to tell. In February 1995 the cruiser liner Queen Elizabeth II met a 29-metre high rogue wave during a hurricane in the North Atlantic that Captain Ronald Warwick described as "a great wall of water… it looked as if we were going into the White Cliffs of Dover." And within the week between February and March 2001 two hardened tourist cruisers – the Bremen and the Caledonian Star – had their bridge windows smashed by 30-metre rogue waves in the South Atlantic, the former ship left drifting without navigation or propulsion for a period of two hours. Damage done by a rogue wave "The incidents occurred less than a thousand kilometres apart from each other," said Wolfgang Rosenthal - Senior Scientist with the GKSS Forschungszentrum GmbH research centre, located in Geesthacht in Germany - who has studied rogue waves for years. "All the electronics were switched off on the Bremen as they drifted parallel to the waves, and until they were turned on again the crew were thinking it could have been their last day alive. "The same phenomenon could have sunk many less lucky vessels: two large ships sink every week on average, but the cause is never studied to the same detail as an air crash. It simply gets put down to 'bad weather'." Offshore platforms have also been struck: on 1 January 1995 the Draupner oil rig in the North Sea was hit by a wave whose height was measured by an onboard laser device at 26 metres, with the highest waves around it reaching 12 metres."
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