Pettit Hydrocoat SR major fail

[bugbitten]

I've had my S2 9.2A since 2011. A friend painted the bottom for me when it was still on the hard in Cambridge, MD. I kept the boat at the southern end of the James River, in Newport News, for five years, then put it on the hard for an extended period to take care of a lot of things. The bottom still was in good shape after all that time. I had a diver clean it maybe two or three times a season, probably not at all the first year. Unfortunately, there is no record of what paint was used.

So, based on what I read a year or so ago, I bought some Pettit Hydrocoat SR. Folks seemed to think it was a good paint for the southern end of the Chesapeake (the boat is now in Hampton and sailed exclusively on the Bay). It requires cleaning almost monthly. I broke down and bought a hookah system to offset some of the diver costs, but I'd sure rather have effective paint than have to get in there and scrub the damned thing myself.

Part of the problem is that I'm not sailing as often, maybe only every other week on average. Another issue is that I put in a bow thruster (all by myself!) when it was on the hard (obviously) and the leading edge of the tunnel (where I built up a bit of a lip) has a nearly constant beard of grass growing on it.

So, I'm looking for recommendations for a new paint, as I'm going to have to have the boat hauled soon (I keep it in the water year round). I'm wondering if I should put a heavy coat of hard paint around the thruster tunnel opening, and then use some compatible ablative for the rest of the hull. The Pettit has been in the water about 15 months. I get fairly heavy growth at the waterline, some barnacles, I had a huge clam making a home in the thruster tunnel (when I finally pried it loose, it had about an eighth of an inch of Pettit stuck to its underside - I'd gooped up the tunnel pretty thoroughly), and pretty heavy slime elsewhere.

I'm seeing some thumbs up for ACT in some forums, Trinidad in others. I don't mind paying more for a good product, but, given my earlier experience, it sure seems I should be able to get at least three years, with regular cleaning, from a decent product. (The boat was at Leeward Marina, by the James River Bridge, the first five years. It's now at Southall Landings, for what it's worth.)

Thanks.

John the Long-winded

 

[jssailem]

I would check out the paint article in Practical Sailor. You may find the nirvana you seek there.
One of the sites. Maybe Jamestown or BoatUS posts a survey of boaters from various parts of the country saying what they use to paint their bottom. That may also be a good source.
Finally, have you asked the locals in your marina what they recommend?

 

[Mark Maulden]

You should take this out of the S2 forum and into the all sailors forum. Wider distribution and not an S2 specific issue

 

[bugbitten]

I have talked to the locals. Not as many as I should, but I'm working on it. I had one vote for ACT. There was some enthusiasm for Micron. The others weren't that crazy about what they had. I trust the yard where she gets hauled, so I'll recheck there, too. When last I was there, they were lamenting the removal of Irgarol from their favorites. It's back, but I'm not sure if folks have really had a chance to give the new formulations a real test.

Oddly enough, the reviews on Jamestown's site were what encouraged me to try the Hydrocoat. They were pretty favorable.

Let me research things a bit more, then maybe I'll repost this, as Mark suggests, in the general forum. I'd really like input on what to do around the thruster tunnel.

John

 

[bugbitten]

Oh, and it seemed to me the recent rest results from Practical Sailor didn't show any outstanding products, which I think they blamed on the widespread reformulations. I'll go back and reread some of that. I was at the boat today, doing a bit more hurricane prep, and was just so frustrated with the beard on the tunnel that I had to vent.

And, as a side note, totally unrelated, to Mark: I believe it was you who had a windlass installed on your 11.0A, which inspired me to do one on my 9.2A. It is a big help to this old, solo sailor.

John

 

[jssailem]

Underwater stuff that involves sea life is a constant moving target. We have different water and temps so what I is likely to be of little use to you.
Thanks for the comment about the windlass. I did install a new Lewmar windlass. It is great. I do not have a S2 I have a Cal35C It is about 11 M so in a similar category of boat as the llA's. I am also a solo sailor most of the time. It is a great way to get peace in ones life.
Good luck with the coming storm. Check out the new Weather and forecasting forum. (https://forums.sailboatowners.com/index.php?forums/weather-and-forecasting.281/) We are hoping it helps fellow boaters. Getting a bit of a test with Florence.

 

[justsomeguy]

a constant moving target.

Ayup, one more variable to account for.

 

[Warren Milberg]

I've used Hydrocoat in the mid-bay for years and have had good results. I really like it being a water-based ablative as clean up is much easier. One thing you do not want to do is apply a modified hard epoxy-based paint (i.e., Trinidad) over an ablative without doing a LOT of sanding/paint removal first. I think ACT and Hydrocoat are about of the same quality. As with just about any painting chore, preparation is often the key to success.

 

[Gunni]

Probably not Pettit Hydrocoat SR. The SR additive was not available last year (Ingarol) and Pettit was not selling Hydrocoat SR. Not surprised got bio growth. It is back on the market now. My suggestion is to save yourself a world of hurt and try again with HydroCoat SR.

 

[bugbitten]

Probably not Pettit Hydrocoat SR. The SR additive was not available last year (Ingarol) and Pettit was not selling Hydrocoat SR. Not surprised got bio growth. It is back on the market now. My suggestion is to save yourself a world of hurt and try again with HydroCoat SR.

It was definitely the SR variety I'd used. I think I still have a quart sitting around. Part of the issue may have been that it'd been sitting in the garage for a year or so before I put it on. I did thoroughly (I thought) mix it with a drill, but not with a paint shaker.

 

[Warren Milberg]

To me, a lot depends on where you keep your boat and how you use it. I've found that using the boat 1-2 times per week obviates the need to spend extra for bottom paints with algae/slime additives in them.

 

[bugbitten]

To me, a lot depends on where you keep your boat and how you use it. I've found that using the boat 1-2 times per week obviates the need to spend extra for bottom paints with algae/slime additives in them.

Warren, are you toward the upper or lower Bay? That'll have an impact. I'm about as far down as you can get, with the Chesapeake Bay Bridge Tunnel in sight for most of my sails.

I do agree that a lack of use may be part of the issue for me. Where I had the boat berthed before, it was a floating dock. In most conditions, it was much simpler (as I nearly always am solo) getting in and out of the slip than where I'm at now. As a result, I would probably sail the boat twice as often from the previous marina (although for somewhat shorter trips, on average).

Also, if it weren't for the persistent growth around the thruster tunnel opening, which I installed after the move, I'd probably think the Hydrocoat was doing okay, if not great. And, even though I haven't moved the boat far, the biome (?) may be different enough to account for some of the disappointing results. There's a Bristol 40 next to me, and its bottom seems to be doing better. Unfortunately, it was painted by the PO and the current owner doesn't know what was used.

I sanded the boat pretty thoroughly before applying the Hydrocoat SR, and there wasn't much build up. Given my issues around the thruster, I'm tempted to try a hard paint, like Trinidad SR, thinking it'll be a few reapplications before it all has to be stripped. But then again, it's anti-fouling properties might not be all that different from what I've got, just less likely to wear off.

John

 

[Warren Milberg]

Yes, I keep the boat in the mid-bay area around Deale, Md., about 15 mi south of Annapolis. I would describe this area as brackish and that algae/slime growth only seems to be a problem with boats that sit unused for long periods of time. I used Trinidad on a previous boat and found it to be a very good performing bottom paint. To me, it's only disadvantage is that, while you may get a number of seasons out it, it is very hard to remove when that inevitable time comes. That is why I switched to ablatives.

 

[thinwater]

... being a water-based ablative as clean up is much easier.

I don't understand.

• You don't clean up rollers, even with water paint. They simply don't work as well the second time, and who wants to waste expensive paint?
  
• Cleaning rollers with water is basically illegal. The cleaning water requires special treatment.
• You throw away chip brushes. Same reason.
• I just let the rollor pan dry and use it the next year. Again, cleaning it would be illegal. Same with mixers etc. Again, they cannot be cleaned.
• You shouldn't have it on your skin either way. Long sleeves or Tyvexs.
• Drop clothes etc. just dry.

So exactly how does it help? I'm not being sarcastic; because the paint is toxic, you can't just wash stuff of anyway. I can't think of anything I would need to clean up that I can clean up. In fact, I suspect for small smudges, solvent is probably easier.

 

[bugbitten]

I actually have to agree that there doesn't seem to be a huge advantage to the water-based stuff. This was my first rodeo as far as bottom painting went, so I'm as big a newbie as you'll find. "Easy clean up" sounded good, and the reviews were favorable, so I went with it. After using it, though, I have to say it was damned messy stuff, and I can't see how solvent-based would be much worse. I wonder, too, if a solvent-based paint would've been a bit easier to thin and mix, particularly after the extended storage my paint had had.

 

[SG]

A few years ago we switched from Mictron’s highly rated ablative paint to a harder racing paint. Two years ago we switched against to Trinidad SR. It is a hard (not ablative) paint.

I found that ablative paints really don’t perform very well, now the scrubbing or even wiping of them is banned because of the pollution issues. In Annapolis most (if not all) marinas won’t allow divers to work on boats with ablative paint.

ThevTrinidad has the highest copper content. It takes a light wiping to remove the fuzz.

The ablative paints don’t really ablate unless your going a lot faster than a sailboat.

 

[LeeandRick]

Put a timer on the thruster so it comes on for a few seconds every few days in both directions. Just make sure the bow mooring lines are snug. This will also agitate the water around the boat lessening fowling.

 

[bugbitten]

A few years ago we switched from Mictron’s highly rated ablative paint to a harder racing paint. Two years ago we switched against to Trinidad SR. It is a hard (not ablative) paint.

I found that ablative paints really don’t perform very well, now the scrubbing or even wiping of them is banned because of the pollution issues. In Annapolis most (if not all) marinas won’t allow divers to work on boats with ablative paint.

ThevTrinidad has the highest copper content. It takes a light wiping to remove the fuzz.

The ablative paints don’t really ablate unless your going a lot faster than a sailboat.

I had read that ablatives really don't ablate below seven knots. While I might hit seven knots now and again, I sure don't cruise along at that speed. Even though there are no restrictions, as far as I know, in my area against divers cleaning ablative-painted bottoms, I still am leaning toward a hard-paint solution, probably your Trinidad SR. I need to check with Pettit about how bare I need to get the bottom to make the switch.

 

[bugbitten]

Put a timer on the thruster so it comes on for a few seconds every few days in both directions. Just make sure the bow mooring lines are snug. This will also agitate the water around the boat lessening fowling.

Boy, that's an interesting idea. Lewmar definitely recommends having the thruster on a master switch, turned to "off" when you're not using it. I guess the thought is to prevent any chance someone cleaning the boat might get their fingers clipped. Still, if I hung a warning sign on the bow, it would seem the chances of an accident would be pretty small (divers do occasionally clean the wrong hull!). If you get a chance, I'd appreciate your PMing me some details of the timer install. I've got a somewhat fussy, live-aboard neighbor in the next slip, who might not be thrilled with the thruster kicking off in the middle of the night, though! Due to space limitations, I had to mount it closer than optimal to the waterline, so there's a fair amount of noise and prop wash.

Thanks.

John

 

[Gunni]

Boy, that's an interesting idea.

And also completely uninformed.