I have a question. Folks often complain about odors from permeated hoses. Hose costs a lot, and good hoses cost much more. Why don't you see solid metal or plastic (PVC) plumbing on boats? There is a wealth of info and experience with this stuff, and the materials and components are readily available. I doubt PVC pipe would "permeate." Comments?
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PVC pipe doesn't permeate, but...
It has other drawbacks for use on boat: it doesn't bend, so every bend requires a radius fitting...every fitting creates bumps in a line that supposed to smooth so it doesn't trap stuff. it cracks easily, and boats flex and take a a lot of shock. So it's necessary to soft-couple the pipe to anything fixed (toilet, tank, y-valve, pump, through-hull) with enough hose to absorb shocks and flex as the boat flexes. That's more bumpy unions. So the only practical application for hard PVC pipe is a long straight run...and you aren't likely to find those on many sailboats. As for metal pipe, it has all the drawbacks of PVC plus a few more: urine is so corrosive that it would eat through it in a few years. it's vulnerable--and can make the boat vulnerable --to both galvanic corrosion and electrolysis. Boat builders are even more cost conscious (if that's possible) than boat owners...so if hard pipe could be used on a boat, they'd all be using it...and do use it for long straight runs in houseboats and other very large boats. But in any system that has bends and elbows, the only thing that can be used is hose.
It has other drawbacks for use on boat: it doesn't bend, so every bend requires a radius fitting...every fitting creates bumps in a line that supposed to smooth so it doesn't trap stuff. it cracks easily, and boats flex and take a a lot of shock. So it's necessary to soft-couple the pipe to anything fixed (toilet, tank, y-valve, pump, through-hull) with enough hose to absorb shocks and flex as the boat flexes. That's more bumpy unions. So the only practical application for hard PVC pipe is a long straight run...and you aren't likely to find those on many sailboats. As for metal pipe, it has all the drawbacks of PVC plus a few more: urine is so corrosive that it would eat through it in a few years. it's vulnerable--and can make the boat vulnerable --to both galvanic corrosion and electrolysis. Boat builders are even more cost conscious (if that's possible) than boat owners...so if hard pipe could be used on a boat, they'd all be using it...and do use it for long straight runs in houseboats and other very large boats. But in any system that has bends and elbows, the only thing that can be used is hose.
Yes, but...
Peggy, I see your points; but my house plumbing has a lot of bends and bumps, and it seems to work. But I can agree that thiPVC stuff will crack, and that would be a mess. I've seen soft unions in the plumbing store - the kind with a rubber sleeve and what looks like a multiple hose clamp - they seem pretty smooth inside. But they could pull out, I guess.
Peggy, I see your points; but my house plumbing has a lot of bends and bumps, and it seems to work. But I can agree that thiPVC stuff will crack, and that would be a mess. I've seen soft unions in the plumbing store - the kind with a rubber sleeve and what looks like a multiple hose clamp - they seem pretty smooth inside. But they could pull out, I guess.
There's one more issue:
Unions in hard pipe are cemented together, usually with PVC cement. Stress,flexing and shocks, plus time can cause the connections to break before the pipe does. Bite the bullet and buy the SeaLand "OdorSafe" hose. Yes, it's expensive...but it's also bullet-proof against odor permeation. So which is really more expensive--$3.50/ft every few years (not to mention the aggravation)...or $8/ft once?
Unions in hard pipe are cemented together, usually with PVC cement. Stress,flexing and shocks, plus time can cause the connections to break before the pipe does. Bite the bullet and buy the SeaLand "OdorSafe" hose. Yes, it's expensive...but it's also bullet-proof against odor permeation. So which is really more expensive--$3.50/ft every few years (not to mention the aggravation)...or $8/ft once?
House PVC is Larger!
While the sinks in your house may be 1 1/2 inches, the main lines and toilets are 4 inch. Thats over 7X the cross section if I remember my math. If not I blame the flu (thats my story and I'm sticking to it) RREgge (home sick) S/V Allie Kat
While the sinks in your house may be 1 1/2 inches, the main lines and toilets are 4 inch. Thats over 7X the cross section if I remember my math. If not I blame the flu (thats my story and I'm sticking to it) RREgge (home sick) S/V Allie Kat
Aluminum foil tape worked for me.
John, my permeated hoses have been covered with aluminum tape for 2 and 1/2 years and the stench is has not come back. This is despite the poor sanitation system design including a small and elevated holding tank and some of the hoses always keeping stuff in spite of thorough flushing. Covering the hoses with the aluminum tape, sold at Home Depot for about $15, was easy and did not require the disassembly of any hose. There was only a short segment I could not reach but fortunately, it does not have much of an effect. Peggie, I am in the Beneteau owners list. My e-mail is: jgvenegas@hotmail.com
John, my permeated hoses have been covered with aluminum tape for 2 and 1/2 years and the stench is has not come back. This is despite the poor sanitation system design including a small and elevated holding tank and some of the hoses always keeping stuff in spite of thorough flushing. Covering the hoses with the aluminum tape, sold at Home Depot for about $15, was easy and did not require the disassembly of any hose. There was only a short segment I could not reach but fortunately, it does not have much of an effect. Peggie, I am in the Beneteau owners list. My e-mail is: jgvenegas@hotmail.com
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