I own a 1984 Hunter 22' and am putting in a permanant mooring in front of my house. Chapman's says that if I'm going to use concrete (I am) it should be at least 175 pounds. The water on the Pamlico can get pretty rough. Any thoughts?
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I'd use 175 of concrete!
Have you thought about an old engine block? Good place for the fish to hide too.
Have you thought about an old engine block? Good place for the fish to hide too.
I hope your bost is insured...
You are joking with us, right? You must not think much of your boat. Concrete louses 62% of its weight when submerged in water. In order to give you the right answer I need to know: What’s the fetch like in you proposed mooring area? Any currants, if so how strong, what is tidal range, your exposure to prevailing wind and most importantly, what is the bottom condition like? 175 lbs may sound like a lot to you, but when you hook a boat that can lift several thousand pounds to an object that is in reality only 108 pounds. Do you really think your boat will still be there after the next storm?
You are joking with us, right? You must not think much of your boat. Concrete louses 62% of its weight when submerged in water. In order to give you the right answer I need to know: What’s the fetch like in you proposed mooring area? Any currants, if so how strong, what is tidal range, your exposure to prevailing wind and most importantly, what is the bottom condition like? 175 lbs may sound like a lot to you, but when you hook a boat that can lift several thousand pounds to an object that is in reality only 108 pounds. Do you really think your boat will still be there after the next storm?
Include car along with engine block
That will hold during the next blow for sure plus REALLY big fish could hide in it...
That will hold during the next blow for sure plus REALLY big fish could hide in it...
You need 1500-2000lbs.
You're nowhere near enough concrete. Here's a link: http://www.tiac.net/users/rkpthbr/mooring.html although they're wrong about dead weight vs. mushrooms.
You're nowhere near enough concrete. Here's a link: http://www.tiac.net/users/rkpthbr/mooring.html although they're wrong about dead weight vs. mushrooms.
18 year mooring
I moored a 7000 pound Sun 27 on two garbage cans full of concrete for 18 years in a cove with a 1 mile N/S fetch and only about a 200 yard E/W fetch. This was on Lake Rathbun in southern Iowa. There were about 50 other boats moored there the same way. One 40 footer managed to drag one in a 60mph thunderstorm. These moorings were given a year to settle in the mud before use.
I moored a 7000 pound Sun 27 on two garbage cans full of concrete for 18 years in a cove with a 1 mile N/S fetch and only about a 200 yard E/W fetch. This was on Lake Rathbun in southern Iowa. There were about 50 other boats moored there the same way. One 40 footer managed to drag one in a 60mph thunderstorm. These moorings were given a year to settle in the mud before use.
We Used Engine Blocks
In fact I cannot think of any of the moorings we had in Hawaii that were not set with them. The problem we had there was folks running over the mooring balls and sinking them. After we began using beer kegs and they started missing them for some reason. It was a job getting them empty though.
In fact I cannot think of any of the moorings we had in Hawaii that were not set with them. The problem we had there was folks running over the mooring balls and sinking them. After we began using beer kegs and they started missing them for some reason. It was a job getting them empty though.
Chapmans is talking about a 175lb Mushroom
The Mushroom anchor will dig it's way into the mud, 2 or even 3 hundred lbs of concrete will just drag along the bottom. Take a look at using 3 danforths bridled 120 degrees apart as described in Chapmans. That should hold nicely in the Pamlico mud and handle a hurricane.
The Mushroom anchor will dig it's way into the mud, 2 or even 3 hundred lbs of concrete will just drag along the bottom. Take a look at using 3 danforths bridled 120 degrees apart as described in Chapmans. That should hold nicely in the Pamlico mud and handle a hurricane.
I think the shape of your mooring is important
As is the type of bottom. I think the most important feature is that it will "sink into the bottom" so to speak. Even the best mooring systems have to rely on a settling in period (month or two) before it will start to approach its true holding. Concrete could work but it is not the best, obviously, until it got sunk into the bottom......I would look at a good mushroom type in the same weight you were looking for in concrete ---- or the big engine block, before I used the concrete
As is the type of bottom. I think the most important feature is that it will "sink into the bottom" so to speak. Even the best mooring systems have to rely on a settling in period (month or two) before it will start to approach its true holding. Concrete could work but it is not the best, obviously, until it got sunk into the bottom......I would look at a good mushroom type in the same weight you were looking for in concrete ---- or the big engine block, before I used the concrete
Will the concrete block did in
The question is 'will the concrete block did in or just drag along the bottom'? Everytime I go up to Bar Harbor Maine I always see someone's concrete mooring block sitting on the bar. This thing must be 4'X 4'X 3' and it dragged and did not dig in. And yes you don't have the tidal range Maine does, but I don't think I would want my boat following the block up onto the beach.
The question is 'will the concrete block did in or just drag along the bottom'? Everytime I go up to Bar Harbor Maine I always see someone's concrete mooring block sitting on the bar. This thing must be 4'X 4'X 3' and it dragged and did not dig in. And yes you don't have the tidal range Maine does, but I don't think I would want my boat following the block up onto the beach.
Ken: Just a thought...
..call Catalina Mooring Service. Catalina Island, California. They use concrete on sandy bottoms to moor boats of all lengths and rarely lose one. They must have in the neighborhood of a thousand and have had them for half a century, so it's reasonable to assume they have a clue. I have personally watched a hundred boats in 60 knot winds and 6 foot swells for 48 hours and there wasn't much dragging. RD
..call Catalina Mooring Service. Catalina Island, California. They use concrete on sandy bottoms to moor boats of all lengths and rarely lose one. They must have in the neighborhood of a thousand and have had them for half a century, so it's reasonable to assume they have a clue. I have personally watched a hundred boats in 60 knot winds and 6 foot swells for 48 hours and there wasn't much dragging. RD
Railroad Wheel
In the Northeast, many moorings are made from old railroad wheels. They are solid, about 500# and settle flat into the bottom. You will have to call around to find one (or 2 chained together), but they work well. Also, a mushroom (about 250#) would suit you purpose. It too, will settle into the mud and won't budge an inch,
In the Northeast, many moorings are made from old railroad wheels. They are solid, about 500# and settle flat into the bottom. You will have to call around to find one (or 2 chained together), but they work well. Also, a mushroom (about 250#) would suit you purpose. It too, will settle into the mud and won't budge an inch,
Balloons
My parents had a monsterous concrete mooring set in Mexico. It was from an old Moorings dock in Puerto Escondido & they hired guys to move it over to an appropriate spot in the bay. The guys used big balloons & just floated it over to the right spot & slowly let the air out. I'm trying to find out how big that chunk was - I'll let you know. LaDonna
My parents had a monsterous concrete mooring set in Mexico. It was from an old Moorings dock in Puerto Escondido & they hired guys to move it over to an appropriate spot in the bay. The guys used big balloons & just floated it over to the right spot & slowly let the air out. I'm trying to find out how big that chunk was - I'll let you know. LaDonna
Boatman's Handbook
Boatman's Handbook Revised Edition recomends for a 25 foot crusing type sailboat the permenent moorings should be at least; 175 lb mushroom anchor, 30 feet of 3/4 inch heavy chain, 20 feet (minimum) 5/16 inch light chain, and a 7/8 inch nylon or 9/32 inch stainless steel pennant.
Boatman's Handbook Revised Edition recomends for a 25 foot crusing type sailboat the permenent moorings should be at least; 175 lb mushroom anchor, 30 feet of 3/4 inch heavy chain, 20 feet (minimum) 5/16 inch light chain, and a 7/8 inch nylon or 9/32 inch stainless steel pennant.
175# sounds right
175 lbs sounds fine. The shape is critical, as Tom stated above. The bottom near you is mud (excellent holding), The bottom of the mooring should not be completely flat, it should come to a mild point or be slightly rounded. This will allow it to continue setting as the boat applies movement to it. Also it should have most of the weight at the bottom to maintain proper orientation, and thread your chain into the concrete and put pieces of rebar through the links to further support it. Good luck
175 lbs sounds fine. The shape is critical, as Tom stated above. The bottom near you is mud (excellent holding), The bottom of the mooring should not be completely flat, it should come to a mild point or be slightly rounded. This will allow it to continue setting as the boat applies movement to it. Also it should have most of the weight at the bottom to maintain proper orientation, and thread your chain into the concrete and put pieces of rebar through the links to further support it. Good luck
Heavy-duty stuff.
We moored our Hunter 25 to an old (4-cyl, probably Gray) engine block in the back channel of the Delaware River at Burlington. There was plenty of tide, storm water, and marine traffic and the boat never dragged. But it was pretty scary watching 250-ft barges go close by it! We just took off the oil pan, pulled one piston out and looped 3/8" chain through the hole, then floated it out on a piece of pontoon (dock) and stood clear as it was shoved over. We lost it about two winters later when the plastic float wore out. But right now there is a floating pontoon there holding about 15-20 boats. I don't know what they have down there but the dock is NOT tied to the shore and it is a safe and popular summer mooring. And duhhh-- the bigger, the better. Stuff like railroad wheels ought to be dragged out UNDER the boat– that's right, IN the water, where it is like 1/8 the weight (or whatever). Hang it from two or three lines (chain or cable if it's heavy) under the boat and let go all but the rode to lower it into place. What I learned from the engine-block episode is that the whole thought of carrying something heavy out to a watery grave and then having to shove it overboard with that whipping chain, etc. just scares the jeebies out of me. Avoid it if you can. JC
We moored our Hunter 25 to an old (4-cyl, probably Gray) engine block in the back channel of the Delaware River at Burlington. There was plenty of tide, storm water, and marine traffic and the boat never dragged. But it was pretty scary watching 250-ft barges go close by it! We just took off the oil pan, pulled one piston out and looped 3/8" chain through the hole, then floated it out on a piece of pontoon (dock) and stood clear as it was shoved over. We lost it about two winters later when the plastic float wore out. But right now there is a floating pontoon there holding about 15-20 boats. I don't know what they have down there but the dock is NOT tied to the shore and it is a safe and popular summer mooring. And duhhh-- the bigger, the better. Stuff like railroad wheels ought to be dragged out UNDER the boat– that's right, IN the water, where it is like 1/8 the weight (or whatever). Hang it from two or three lines (chain or cable if it's heavy) under the boat and let go all but the rode to lower it into place. What I learned from the engine-block episode is that the whole thought of carrying something heavy out to a watery grave and then having to shove it overboard with that whipping chain, etc. just scares the jeebies out of me. Avoid it if you can. JC
I HAVE THE SOLUTION
FIRST YOU SHOP AROUND FOR AN OLD STEEL BASKET, THE SIZE OF A WOOD SKID, THE TYPE THEY USE FOR STORING JUNK MAT'L, AND CAN FOLD, TIE SOME FLOATS ON IT SO IT CAN'T SINK, TAKE IT OUT TO THE RIGHT SPOT, SECURE A 10' PC OF 3/8" CHAIN TO THE CENTER OF THE BOTTOM, AND EACH DAY, YOU LOOKFOR STEEL JUNK, SMALL ENGINE, CRANKS, CASTING, AND EACH DAY YOU FILL A COUPLE OF BUCKETS, AND DUMP THEM INTO THE BASKET, BY THE WAY START WITH YOUR CHAPMAN BOOK, IT'S JUNK, WHEN YOU FILL THE BASKET, THEN IT'S TIME TO BRING OUT A BAG OR TWO OF CEMENT, EACH DAY AND LINE THE SIDES OF THE BASKET WITH THE BAGS OF CEMENT, THE WATER WILL PENETRATE THE PAPER, THE CEMENT WILL HARDEN, THE PAPER WILL DESOLVE, THEN TOP THE WHOLE THING WITH CEMENT BAGSA, BUT CUT OPEN, TO FORM ONE HEAVY MOTHER OF A MOORING ANCHOR.
FIRST YOU SHOP AROUND FOR AN OLD STEEL BASKET, THE SIZE OF A WOOD SKID, THE TYPE THEY USE FOR STORING JUNK MAT'L, AND CAN FOLD, TIE SOME FLOATS ON IT SO IT CAN'T SINK, TAKE IT OUT TO THE RIGHT SPOT, SECURE A 10' PC OF 3/8" CHAIN TO THE CENTER OF THE BOTTOM, AND EACH DAY, YOU LOOKFOR STEEL JUNK, SMALL ENGINE, CRANKS, CASTING, AND EACH DAY YOU FILL A COUPLE OF BUCKETS, AND DUMP THEM INTO THE BASKET, BY THE WAY START WITH YOUR CHAPMAN BOOK, IT'S JUNK, WHEN YOU FILL THE BASKET, THEN IT'S TIME TO BRING OUT A BAG OR TWO OF CEMENT, EACH DAY AND LINE THE SIDES OF THE BASKET WITH THE BAGS OF CEMENT, THE WATER WILL PENETRATE THE PAPER, THE CEMENT WILL HARDEN, THE PAPER WILL DESOLVE, THEN TOP THE WHOLE THING WITH CEMENT BAGSA, BUT CUT OPEN, TO FORM ONE HEAVY MOTHER OF A MOORING ANCHOR.
My folks mooring in Mexico
My folks' mooring in Mexico was supposedly about 5000 lbs. of concrete. Dad suspects it wasn't that heavy but close enough. Held through 10 years of Chubascos. And the moorings in La Paz are old engine blocks too. LaDonna
My folks' mooring in Mexico was supposedly about 5000 lbs. of concrete. Dad suspects it wasn't that heavy but close enough. Held through 10 years of Chubascos. And the moorings in La Paz are old engine blocks too. LaDonna
Tom From Florida. Do you have the solution for
ALL CAPITAL LETTERS ? p.s. I'll listen to a hundred years of knowledge put into Chapmans -- It's conservative, but usually based on good experience.
ALL CAPITAL LETTERS ? p.s. I'll listen to a hundred years of knowledge put into Chapmans -- It's conservative, but usually based on good experience.
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