While commissioning for the coming year I checked my flare kit. All the flares are out of date, or 'expired'.While they are probably still useable, they are NOT legal. My question is , what is the proper way to dispose of the old flares ?
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David
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Steve
Keep them...
While you are required to keep flares on board that are not expired, you are right that those that have expired are still most likely usable. Keep them on board as well, never knowing when you might need them. Just be sure to keep the "fresh" ones on board for the inspections. Steve
While you are required to keep flares on board that are not expired, you are right that those that have expired are still most likely usable. Keep them on board as well, never knowing when you might need them. Just be sure to keep the "fresh" ones on board for the inspections. Steve
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Don Alexander
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David
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Pete
outdated flares
I'm not sure but check with your local township or city they may be able to dispose of them if the have a "HAZ-MAT" day where they will take haz mat for proper disposal. I have also heard of a method where you soak the fuses in water. Another possibility might be to check with the local Coast Guard station and or the manufature to see what they suggest.I'm sure lots of people would be interested to know the proper way to dispose of them maybe you could post the correct way when you find out.I would think that they are still good as back ups but at some point they need to be disposed of before they become unstable (?)Another thougth might be to check with your local police and or fire marshal as they use them all the time and must have to deal with disposal of outdated ones.
I'm not sure but check with your local township or city they may be able to dispose of them if the have a "HAZ-MAT" day where they will take haz mat for proper disposal. I have also heard of a method where you soak the fuses in water. Another possibility might be to check with the local Coast Guard station and or the manufature to see what they suggest.I'm sure lots of people would be interested to know the proper way to dispose of them maybe you could post the correct way when you find out.I would think that they are still good as back ups but at some point they need to be disposed of before they become unstable (?)Another thougth might be to check with your local police and or fire marshal as they use them all the time and must have to deal with disposal of outdated ones.
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RonD
Proper Flare Disposal
If the flares are physically in good condition, keep them aboard. They may be "expired" but perfectly useable for years. Certainly get new ones to be compliant with the USCG regs. If you get into trouble, plan to use the old ("expired") flares first. Be very careful -- disposing of old flares can present certain hazards, physical and legal. Most are magnesium-based and will burn through almost anything (including your hull if you aren't careful!) and drip off a hot slag. They'll even burn under water. They are next to impossible to put out -- they simplely burn out. So, once ignited you have a tiger by the tail! Accordingly, they are treated as hazardous materials. Best to contact your local fire department or the USCG regarding proper disposal. They might be persuaded to let you set them off in a controlled environment as a combination training/disposal event. Under no circumstances should you ignite them while out on the water, as they might be construed as an emergency signal (their intended purpose) and trigger a false-alarm rescue effort. The USCG and local law enforcement guys take a dim view of that, for sure. --Ron
If the flares are physically in good condition, keep them aboard. They may be "expired" but perfectly useable for years. Certainly get new ones to be compliant with the USCG regs. If you get into trouble, plan to use the old ("expired") flares first. Be very careful -- disposing of old flares can present certain hazards, physical and legal. Most are magnesium-based and will burn through almost anything (including your hull if you aren't careful!) and drip off a hot slag. They'll even burn under water. They are next to impossible to put out -- they simplely burn out. So, once ignited you have a tiger by the tail! Accordingly, they are treated as hazardous materials. Best to contact your local fire department or the USCG regarding proper disposal. They might be persuaded to let you set them off in a controlled environment as a combination training/disposal event. Under no circumstances should you ignite them while out on the water, as they might be construed as an emergency signal (their intended purpose) and trigger a false-alarm rescue effort. The USCG and local law enforcement guys take a dim view of that, for sure. --Ron
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Al
4th of July
The longer your in boating the more things you collect, flares are one of them. On the 4th of July several families get together at a friends in the country and if anyone has out dated flares we just light them up one or two at a time around the camp fire. the kids like to watch them burn and have a respect for how they burn.
The longer your in boating the more things you collect, flares are one of them. On the 4th of July several families get together at a friends in the country and if anyone has out dated flares we just light them up one or two at a time around the camp fire. the kids like to watch them burn and have a respect for how they burn.
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Doug Rodrigues
I'm with Al !
While other fireworks were going off, I fired a couple of 8 year old meteor flares. They worked just like brand new. This 4th of July, I'll fire-off one of my old parachute flares. If it works okay, I'll save the other two as spares.
While other fireworks were going off, I fired a couple of 8 year old meteor flares. They worked just like brand new. This 4th of July, I'll fire-off one of my old parachute flares. If it works okay, I'll save the other two as spares.
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Rick Webb
Official Response from the Coast Guard
There are a number of options but several of the responses are definite NOT TO BE DONE Do not burn them Do not set them off just to see them burn even of the Fourth of July; big fine if they catch and prosecute you Do not throw them in the trash Here is what you can do Donate them to the local Coast Guard Station, Auxiliary Flotilla, Power Squadron, Fire Department, etc., they can use them for training. If your boat is not used for hire it is acceptable to keep them aboard so long as you have current ones. If they are needed use the old ones first and save the current ones. Hand held flare may be burned ashore but do it away from anything even remotely combustable Somwhere I have the official document explaining it better. If I find it I will place it here Harvey, if you email me through this site I will get you in touch with a guy out there who will do the Courtesy Exam on your boat and take the flares off of your hands if you wish.
There are a number of options but several of the responses are definite NOT TO BE DONE Do not burn them Do not set them off just to see them burn even of the Fourth of July; big fine if they catch and prosecute you Do not throw them in the trash Here is what you can do Donate them to the local Coast Guard Station, Auxiliary Flotilla, Power Squadron, Fire Department, etc., they can use them for training. If your boat is not used for hire it is acceptable to keep them aboard so long as you have current ones. If they are needed use the old ones first and save the current ones. Hand held flare may be burned ashore but do it away from anything even remotely combustable Somwhere I have the official document explaining it better. If I find it I will place it here Harvey, if you email me through this site I will get you in touch with a guy out there who will do the Courtesy Exam on your boat and take the flares off of your hands if you wish.
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David
Use old ones first??
I keep my old flares on the boat as spares but do not understand the rational for using them first in an emergency as outlined in several responses. An emergency is exactly the time you want them to work, not find out they really do not work after the expiry date. I for one will always use my good ones first and then if necessary have the old ones to fall back on. An emergency is not the time to try to save a few dollars.
I keep my old flares on the boat as spares but do not understand the rational for using them first in an emergency as outlined in several responses. An emergency is exactly the time you want them to work, not find out they really do not work after the expiry date. I for one will always use my good ones first and then if necessary have the old ones to fall back on. An emergency is not the time to try to save a few dollars.
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Debra B
Retire them, don't fire them
"Regulations prohibit display of visual distress signals on the water under any circumstances except when assistance is required to prevent immediate or potential danger to persons on board a vessel." http://www.usps.org/localusps/tulsa/uscoastguardsafety.htm Not sure the 4th of July exception is still in effect... "Flare launchings accounted for 29.5 percent of all false distress calls in fiscal year 2000. One of the given reasons for launching flares is because "they are expired." In response, the Coast Guard has generated a "Retire Them, Don't Fire Them" program. This program allows mariners with expired flares to turn them in and receive a new set at a 10 percent discount." costs the CG big money.... Not sure the rebate is nation wide... http://www.uscg.mil/d13/dpa/news/feature_stories/false_distress_page.htm
"Regulations prohibit display of visual distress signals on the water under any circumstances except when assistance is required to prevent immediate or potential danger to persons on board a vessel." http://www.usps.org/localusps/tulsa/uscoastguardsafety.htm Not sure the 4th of July exception is still in effect... "Flare launchings accounted for 29.5 percent of all false distress calls in fiscal year 2000. One of the given reasons for launching flares is because "they are expired." In response, the Coast Guard has generated a "Retire Them, Don't Fire Them" program. This program allows mariners with expired flares to turn them in and receive a new set at a 10 percent discount." costs the CG big money.... Not sure the rebate is nation wide... http://www.uscg.mil/d13/dpa/news/feature_stories/false_distress_page.htm
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Pops Landing
Supervised Training
I contacted the Coast Guard Auxillary in this area and they are going to do a session on proper flare use, fire-extinguisers, and other safety issues for local boaters. Boaters will be encouraged to bring expired flares for proper disposal or test firing. They will also do courtesy inspections if people want. Rather than carry expired flares on my boat, "just in case", or as "backups" I bought more new flares so I would know that they were in good condition. Flares are cheap. Priceless if needed.
I contacted the Coast Guard Auxillary in this area and they are going to do a session on proper flare use, fire-extinguisers, and other safety issues for local boaters. Boaters will be encouraged to bring expired flares for proper disposal or test firing. They will also do courtesy inspections if people want. Rather than carry expired flares on my boat, "just in case", or as "backups" I bought more new flares so I would know that they were in good condition. Flares are cheap. Priceless if needed.
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Chuck Wayne
flare disposal
according to the local CG, you can also soak them in water for a long time, and they will decompose in time, you can drain off the water and throw the residue in the trash
according to the local CG, you can also soak them in water for a long time, and they will decompose in time, you can drain off the water and throw the residue in the trash
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RonD
re: Use Old Ones First??
First off, it is illegal (Felony offense; $5,000 fine + actual USCG response costs) to set off distress signals unless there is a real emergency. That includes 4th of July & New Year's Eve events. Over land & out of sight of water -- well, that's a local law enforcement issue. --- Rationale for using the old ones first: 1. The USCG Regs for recreational vessels prescribe the minimum number & types to be carried. For recreational vessels they recognize the trade-off between costs vs need to carry more, so servicable but expired devices are allowed to be carried as long as there are sufficient unexpired devices aboard. By serviceable, it means they have been kept dry, protected from physical damage, not leaking, etc. 2. A prudent skipper would want to optimize his chances & leave as many options open for as long as possible. A real on-the-water emergency for which you would use these devices will require some intelligent management by the distressed skipper. First off, it may take a few attempts to even attract the attention of someone to start a rescue operation. Second, the distressed skipper will want to help vector any approaching rescue craft to their location. So, this will involve use of multiple devices -- e.g., high-altitude parachute/meteor devices for attracting attention, flares for vectoring rescue craft. 3. That said, launching an "expired" device first leaves a reserve of supposedly higher reliability devices for later. If it fails to ignite, you can quickly attempt to use another. If they do ignite, well -- you have that reserve available for other options. --Ron
First off, it is illegal (Felony offense; $5,000 fine + actual USCG response costs) to set off distress signals unless there is a real emergency. That includes 4th of July & New Year's Eve events. Over land & out of sight of water -- well, that's a local law enforcement issue. --- Rationale for using the old ones first: 1. The USCG Regs for recreational vessels prescribe the minimum number & types to be carried. For recreational vessels they recognize the trade-off between costs vs need to carry more, so servicable but expired devices are allowed to be carried as long as there are sufficient unexpired devices aboard. By serviceable, it means they have been kept dry, protected from physical damage, not leaking, etc. 2. A prudent skipper would want to optimize his chances & leave as many options open for as long as possible. A real on-the-water emergency for which you would use these devices will require some intelligent management by the distressed skipper. First off, it may take a few attempts to even attract the attention of someone to start a rescue operation. Second, the distressed skipper will want to help vector any approaching rescue craft to their location. So, this will involve use of multiple devices -- e.g., high-altitude parachute/meteor devices for attracting attention, flares for vectoring rescue craft. 3. That said, launching an "expired" device first leaves a reserve of supposedly higher reliability devices for later. If it fails to ignite, you can quickly attempt to use another. If they do ignite, well -- you have that reserve available for other options. --Ron
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Jim A
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RonD
Underwriter's Lab Study
I saw a note on the USCG Marine Safety Website some time ago that discussed the results of a USCG sponsored study of pyrotechnic devices. The purpose of the study was to look into the degradation of these devices over time, since the expiration period (42 months) was under review. [BTW: The USCG uses 42 months to allow a certain delivery/shelf period in the retail chain plus three boating seasons. Canada uses 48 months from date of manufacture.] UL determined that the chemical mix in pyrotechnic devices does decay over time. Their sample was insufficient to accurately fix the decay period; they tested some over 6 years old that worked fine, yet some only one year old failed totally. However, they did note that the gradual chemical decay over time did reduce the illumination intensity and burn time even though the devices fired properly. Further, they noted that exposure to moisture, extreme heat and cold, and physical abuse were major factors affecting the decay rate. So, the recommendation to retain any servicable expired devices, but use them first, still stands. Added to it is the suggestion to keep them in sealed plastic bags (e.g., Ziplock freezer bags) and to watch the storage temperature environment. --Ron
I saw a note on the USCG Marine Safety Website some time ago that discussed the results of a USCG sponsored study of pyrotechnic devices. The purpose of the study was to look into the degradation of these devices over time, since the expiration period (42 months) was under review. [BTW: The USCG uses 42 months to allow a certain delivery/shelf period in the retail chain plus three boating seasons. Canada uses 48 months from date of manufacture.] UL determined that the chemical mix in pyrotechnic devices does decay over time. Their sample was insufficient to accurately fix the decay period; they tested some over 6 years old that worked fine, yet some only one year old failed totally. However, they did note that the gradual chemical decay over time did reduce the illumination intensity and burn time even though the devices fired properly. Further, they noted that exposure to moisture, extreme heat and cold, and physical abuse were major factors affecting the decay rate. So, the recommendation to retain any servicable expired devices, but use them first, still stands. Added to it is the suggestion to keep them in sealed plastic bags (e.g., Ziplock freezer bags) and to watch the storage temperature environment. --Ron
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