Most of us rely on electronics -- to some degree -- aboard our boats. Minimally, most of us use depth sounders, knotmeters, VHF radios and GPS receivers. But what about backup? Is that the place for low tech? Do you carry a knotlog, a lead line, or a sextant? What about a hand bearing compass, oil navigation lights, or signal flags? Are these low tech devices simply bits of nostalgia or do you think they have use in todays boats, at least as backup? (Discussion and quiz by Trevor MacLachlan)
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Me, too ...
I have a knot log, hand bearing compass, lead line. I use my hand-held GPS to get lat and long, then plot positions on a paper chart.
I have a knot log, hand bearing compass, lead line. I use my hand-held GPS to get lat and long, then plot positions on a paper chart.
Just changed over
After 22 years with the O.E. gauges (Signent) I replaced them with Navman (now Northstar) gauges, GPS Chart-plotter, and VHF. I never liked the gauges being on the companionway bulkhead because they were always being obscured by the crew. I opted for a Navpod at the wheel and a repeater at the nav station along with my VHF. It was a lot of work - but I love the updated instrumentation! Bill on STARGAZER
After 22 years with the O.E. gauges (Signent) I replaced them with Navman (now Northstar) gauges, GPS Chart-plotter, and VHF. I never liked the gauges being on the companionway bulkhead because they were always being obscured by the crew. I opted for a Navpod at the wheel and a repeater at the nav station along with my VHF. It was a lot of work - but I love the updated instrumentation! Bill on STARGAZER
I still 'backup' using the 'old' methods ....
and verify / back-up with the 'new' stuff. Nothing can beat the accuracy of a Mark-I eyeball and a brain. I no longer make running plots but still keep an hourly Nav. log and use a pencil and charts for DR. For Inshore and 'coastal', electronic Nav is 'good enough' but when all you see is the horizon you really need a better 'idea' of where you are.
and verify / back-up with the 'new' stuff. Nothing can beat the accuracy of a Mark-I eyeball and a brain. I no longer make running plots but still keep an hourly Nav. log and use a pencil and charts for DR. For Inshore and 'coastal', electronic Nav is 'good enough' but when all you see is the horizon you really need a better 'idea' of where you are.
Belts and suspenders & backups
Even with a gps at the helm I always use my compass and who cares about speed cause when the Signet knot meter was installed it never worked so I removed it and I suppose if the gps breaks down I'll use time to figure out my speed if its that important. I do have a hand bearing compass and a hand held vhf radio and this year for a gift some sailing friends gave me portable LED lights for the dink and one thought was they could act as backup in the event I lost all power but all my nav lights on the mother ship are LED now and I'm sure they would work with a little battery voltage I've been thinking about buying a backup handheld gps on EBay in case the one at the helm craps out As far as depth sounders I installed a sounder to my existing GPS and left the original depth sounder that came with the boat so I have two systems,last year the transducer for the sounder failed (2 years old *o)and I'm glad I didn't remove the old one and if for some reason I didn't have them I would trust my paper charts for the depth
Even with a gps at the helm I always use my compass and who cares about speed cause when the Signet knot meter was installed it never worked so I removed it and I suppose if the gps breaks down I'll use time to figure out my speed if its that important. I do have a hand bearing compass and a hand held vhf radio and this year for a gift some sailing friends gave me portable LED lights for the dink and one thought was they could act as backup in the event I lost all power but all my nav lights on the mother ship are LED now and I'm sure they would work with a little battery voltage I've been thinking about buying a backup handheld gps on EBay in case the one at the helm craps out As far as depth sounders I installed a sounder to my existing GPS and left the original depth sounder that came with the boat so I have two systems,last year the transducer for the sounder failed (2 years old *o)and I'm glad I didn't remove the old one and if for some reason I didn't have them I would trust my paper charts for the depth
Use them all
Not only do we have all the "toys" Loran, radar,GPS etc. We also carry a hand held compass, paper charts, sextant and plotting tools. When we are close and can see the beach the toys take over and we plot our position using the position coordinates. I still use our sextant for postion fix's and to keep in practise.
Not only do we have all the "toys" Loran, radar,GPS etc. We also carry a hand held compass, paper charts, sextant and plotting tools. When we are close and can see the beach the toys take over and we plot our position using the position coordinates. I still use our sextant for postion fix's and to keep in practise.
Murphy isn't my co-pilot
but he lives next door. When coastal, I don't worry much about anything more than eyeball navigation, as I know the local waters very well. In areas I am not familiar with, or on longer passages, I use a chart plotter, with built in depth, speed and all the other bells and whistles which I trust totally, so far. For back up, I have the OE speed and depth on the boat, which work but are marginal, a hand held GPS, paper charts, charting tools and a lead line are aboard. Have never used a sextant, and just too damn old to change. I do have the ability to keep position in my head at all times, within a short distance. This is pretty easy to do, and if I have been sleeping and come on watch, I mentally figure time, speed, and course, then check the GPS to see how close I am. No one mentioned a good pair of binoculars, which can be very important when coming in from offshore and picking up landmarks.
but he lives next door. When coastal, I don't worry much about anything more than eyeball navigation, as I know the local waters very well. In areas I am not familiar with, or on longer passages, I use a chart plotter, with built in depth, speed and all the other bells and whistles which I trust totally, so far. For back up, I have the OE speed and depth on the boat, which work but are marginal, a hand held GPS, paper charts, charting tools and a lead line are aboard. Have never used a sextant, and just too damn old to change. I do have the ability to keep position in my head at all times, within a short distance. This is pretty easy to do, and if I have been sleeping and come on watch, I mentally figure time, speed, and course, then check the GPS to see how close I am. No one mentioned a good pair of binoculars, which can be very important when coming in from offshore and picking up landmarks.
I am strictly old school
I have no electrical system battery or electronics on my boat. My cabin lights are fueled by alcohol so is my stove. My running lights are self contained battery powered. My outboard is a pull start. My vhf is hand held MY head is an Oak bucket. I decided I was tired of changing head gasket kits a long time ago I navigate by dead reconing. Charts dividers hand bearing compass old walker taffrail log. is what I have. I do not want or need any gadgets. Im strictly old school and have cruised this way for 50 years. There is nothing on my boat that I cant fix myself. If I cant fix it I dont want it. That dosent mean that the newer stuff isnt for others Anyone who likes the newer technology should by all means go for it. Sloop Whitecap 1975 P26W #76
I have no electrical system battery or electronics on my boat. My cabin lights are fueled by alcohol so is my stove. My running lights are self contained battery powered. My outboard is a pull start. My vhf is hand held MY head is an Oak bucket. I decided I was tired of changing head gasket kits a long time ago I navigate by dead reconing. Charts dividers hand bearing compass old walker taffrail log. is what I have. I do not want or need any gadgets. Im strictly old school and have cruised this way for 50 years. There is nothing on my boat that I cant fix myself. If I cant fix it I dont want it. That dosent mean that the newer stuff isnt for others Anyone who likes the newer technology should by all means go for it. Sloop Whitecap 1975 P26W #76
Some Old School...
I sail on The Chesapeake Bay, an inland water, so I am not too likely to be lost at sea in terms of navigation. I keep paper charts and both main and hand bearing compasses on board. I also have all the required safety gear, flares, horn, etc., and I carry a cell phone as a backup to VHF (cell coverage is nearly complete on The Bay).
I sail on The Chesapeake Bay, an inland water, so I am not too likely to be lost at sea in terms of navigation. I keep paper charts and both main and hand bearing compasses on board. I also have all the required safety gear, flares, horn, etc., and I carry a cell phone as a backup to VHF (cell coverage is nearly complete on The Bay).
Some new and some old........
On my Pearson 26 on the Chesapeake Bay I have a Garmin 76 w/BlueChart, A Richie Mariner bulkhead mount compass, a Humminbird depth finder, and the large Chesapeake Bay chartbook. I was on the navigation team of the USS Charleston LKA-113 for 4 years and navigated it around the world and into 56 ports, through the Panama Canal, The Straights of Malacca, around The Cape of Good Hope, and most of the Caribean. My skipper was an Ensign at Pearl Harbor in 1941 and he required a proper chart on the bridge of wherever we were. (He didn't always trust harbor pilots.) We had a Loran but I don't think he ever looked at it. So, I guess I'm more old school. I have a feel for where I am and keep attention. Never had a problem with navigation. One dark night coming up Harris Creek the red light at the narrows was out. I almost hit it! I work at West Marine in Woodbridge, Va and am up on all the latest toys but I can't help but remember the guy coming up the Potomac when his electronics went out. He was so affraid that he threw over the hook and sat until daybreak. Couldn't read a chart or determine his position at night. That won't happen to me. David
On my Pearson 26 on the Chesapeake Bay I have a Garmin 76 w/BlueChart, A Richie Mariner bulkhead mount compass, a Humminbird depth finder, and the large Chesapeake Bay chartbook. I was on the navigation team of the USS Charleston LKA-113 for 4 years and navigated it around the world and into 56 ports, through the Panama Canal, The Straights of Malacca, around The Cape of Good Hope, and most of the Caribean. My skipper was an Ensign at Pearl Harbor in 1941 and he required a proper chart on the bridge of wherever we were. (He didn't always trust harbor pilots.) We had a Loran but I don't think he ever looked at it. So, I guess I'm more old school. I have a feel for where I am and keep attention. Never had a problem with navigation. One dark night coming up Harris Creek the red light at the narrows was out. I almost hit it! I work at West Marine in Woodbridge, Va and am up on all the latest toys but I can't help but remember the guy coming up the Potomac when his electronics went out. He was so affraid that he threw over the hook and sat until daybreak. Couldn't read a chart or determine his position at night. That won't happen to me. David
Is good to know the old methods,
to use as back ups but let's face it there is nothing glamorous in doing things the hard way. It is of no use to learn a language if nobody else knows it; that is the problem with flags. 98% of sailors a out there will not know if you are signalling for medical help or margarita mix. The cost, maintenace and simplicity of a 12V battery electrical system to operate lamps is much superior to the use of fossil fuels lanterns. They can be smelly, a fire hazard, may provide poor lightning and be quite costly. A $3.95 kerosene lamp may be a poor choice but cannot see paying $150 for a gimballed oil lamp. A compass is a very useful device but a handheld GPS or chartplotter will run circles around it. My beef about some of the old navigating equipment is that it may require frequent calibration to really be useful. There is no substitute for paper chart and dead reckoning but the use of a lead line is a lost art or fruitless chore. Wood stoves for heat and cooking are dirty an inneficient. Why go through the trouble when there is propane. I compare the old ways to wooden boats and new ways to fiberglass boats; why spend your time sanding and oiling when you could be out sailing.
to use as back ups but let's face it there is nothing glamorous in doing things the hard way. It is of no use to learn a language if nobody else knows it; that is the problem with flags. 98% of sailors a out there will not know if you are signalling for medical help or margarita mix. The cost, maintenace and simplicity of a 12V battery electrical system to operate lamps is much superior to the use of fossil fuels lanterns. They can be smelly, a fire hazard, may provide poor lightning and be quite costly. A $3.95 kerosene lamp may be a poor choice but cannot see paying $150 for a gimballed oil lamp. A compass is a very useful device but a handheld GPS or chartplotter will run circles around it. My beef about some of the old navigating equipment is that it may require frequent calibration to really be useful. There is no substitute for paper chart and dead reckoning but the use of a lead line is a lost art or fruitless chore. Wood stoves for heat and cooking are dirty an inneficient. Why go through the trouble when there is propane. I compare the old ways to wooden boats and new ways to fiberglass boats; why spend your time sanding and oiling when you could be out sailing.
woah! hang on there.
You can't compare a hand-bearing compass with a leadline, et cetera. Go on any America's Cup yacht, and you'll find the tactician wearing a "hockey puck" hand-bearing compass, even though there's not likely to be a sextant, et cetera, onboard. A magnetic compass is NOT an outmoded piece of equipment. Anyone who goes to sea without at least a binnacle compass as well as a hand-bearing compass just doesn't get the navigation thing. ...and having an oil-powered anchor light on board is just plain cool.
You can't compare a hand-bearing compass with a leadline, et cetera. Go on any America's Cup yacht, and you'll find the tactician wearing a "hockey puck" hand-bearing compass, even though there's not likely to be a sextant, et cetera, onboard. A magnetic compass is NOT an outmoded piece of equipment. Anyone who goes to sea without at least a binnacle compass as well as a hand-bearing compass just doesn't get the navigation thing. ...and having an oil-powered anchor light on board is just plain cool.
Benny, If lighting were my only reason for having batteries
it would be the worst posible use of money. The battery cost 130 dollars, the wire to connect the battery to the light cost 5 dollars, the engine to turn the alternator to charge the battery cost 5000 dollars, the fuel to make the engine turn the alternator costs 4.25 per gallon. My kerosine lantern cost 35 dollars and burns 12 ounces in 14 hours.
it would be the worst posible use of money. The battery cost 130 dollars, the wire to connect the battery to the light cost 5 dollars, the engine to turn the alternator to charge the battery cost 5000 dollars, the fuel to make the engine turn the alternator costs 4.25 per gallon. My kerosine lantern cost 35 dollars and burns 12 ounces in 14 hours.
Old school with a mix
I sailed for a few years on the yacht Iolaire. Her skipper/owner, Don Street, has written several cruising guides for the Caribbean, and worked with Imray charting the Caribe (Imray-Iolaire charts). Iolaire is an older boat - 100 years old now - with no engine, no electronics and a taff-rail generator for power to the radio. All of our navigation was by hand and sight. I grew up in a Navy family, and so had to learn flags, star-charts, and how to use a sextant and compass from early on. I never considered NOT using my compass and sextant on Iolaire, and was pleased to have the opportunity to learn to hand chart a course. All of my previous sailing had been west coast - San Diego Yacht Club, and east coast - Chesapeake Bay, Patomac River, and coastal Maine. With the exception of foggy days, we didn't need much more than a good pair of binoculars, but drop the fog and out came compass! When my father died, the first things I asked for were his sextant, hand-held compass, and chart nav tools. When I boarded Iolaire, they boarded with me. When we sailed through Hugo and Andrew, we were sure glad we hadn't had to rely on electronic gear! Sure, I now have a hand-held GPS and an electronic compass. And sure, I am probably of an aging minority. But the truth for me will always be that sextant, compass, stars, lead line and hand charting will always be as much a part of sailing as the sails themselves. Equally sure is that in case of an electronic emergency - dismasting, knockdown, abandoning ship, someone should be able to read a compass and use a sextant. But that's just one woman's opinion.
I sailed for a few years on the yacht Iolaire. Her skipper/owner, Don Street, has written several cruising guides for the Caribbean, and worked with Imray charting the Caribe (Imray-Iolaire charts). Iolaire is an older boat - 100 years old now - with no engine, no electronics and a taff-rail generator for power to the radio. All of our navigation was by hand and sight. I grew up in a Navy family, and so had to learn flags, star-charts, and how to use a sextant and compass from early on. I never considered NOT using my compass and sextant on Iolaire, and was pleased to have the opportunity to learn to hand chart a course. All of my previous sailing had been west coast - San Diego Yacht Club, and east coast - Chesapeake Bay, Patomac River, and coastal Maine. With the exception of foggy days, we didn't need much more than a good pair of binoculars, but drop the fog and out came compass! When my father died, the first things I asked for were his sextant, hand-held compass, and chart nav tools. When I boarded Iolaire, they boarded with me. When we sailed through Hugo and Andrew, we were sure glad we hadn't had to rely on electronic gear! Sure, I now have a hand-held GPS and an electronic compass. And sure, I am probably of an aging minority. But the truth for me will always be that sextant, compass, stars, lead line and hand charting will always be as much a part of sailing as the sails themselves. Equally sure is that in case of an electronic emergency - dismasting, knockdown, abandoning ship, someone should be able to read a compass and use a sextant. But that's just one woman's opinion.
Whoa! Hang on to that sextant
Regarding your comment about the America's Cup and sextant! I had the very great pleasure to crew on Tenacious, skippered by its new owner, but the tactical was handled by the original owner. Yes, he had his hockey puck, but he also brought aboard his Mark IV - battered but well calibrated - and yes, it WAS needed! I have also been aboard several other America's Cup boats; ALL of them have a sextant in place of honour.
Regarding your comment about the America's Cup and sextant! I had the very great pleasure to crew on Tenacious, skippered by its new owner, but the tactical was handled by the original owner. Yes, he had his hockey puck, but he also brought aboard his Mark IV - battered but well calibrated - and yes, it WAS needed! I have also been aboard several other America's Cup boats; ALL of them have a sextant in place of honour.
RDF
What happens if all the electronics go out because someone on the boat left the battery on and it went dead not to mention loosing the charts overboard? I wanted to send the fellow to Davey Jone's locker. It was getting dark and fog started to roll in. This occoured in 1981 before the day of GPS and cell phone after passing the Bay Bridge tunnel. What I have told everyone, look at what you have on board. I had a small am-fm radio that was working and a VA state highway road map that had the Chesapeake Bay on it as well. Knowing that AM signals act as an RDF (Radio directional finder), I turned the radio to get the strongest signals and cross plotted on the state highway road map. It brought me within 500 feet where I was headed to 25 miles later. I like carrying a small am-fm radio on board when sailing overnight and yes some think it is funny to have a highway road map but that saved my big ole buzzle butt once. Food for thought.
What happens if all the electronics go out because someone on the boat left the battery on and it went dead not to mention loosing the charts overboard? I wanted to send the fellow to Davey Jone's locker. It was getting dark and fog started to roll in. This occoured in 1981 before the day of GPS and cell phone after passing the Bay Bridge tunnel. What I have told everyone, look at what you have on board. I had a small am-fm radio that was working and a VA state highway road map that had the Chesapeake Bay on it as well. Knowing that AM signals act as an RDF (Radio directional finder), I turned the radio to get the strongest signals and cross plotted on the state highway road map. It brought me within 500 feet where I was headed to 25 miles later. I like carrying a small am-fm radio on board when sailing overnight and yes some think it is funny to have a highway road map but that saved my big ole buzzle butt once. Food for thought.
Best of Both
I have a lead line and a hand held compass. Of course, i also have a GPS and depth finder. GPS lat/lon gets plotted on my chart when i get in the Pacific. Guess it's best for me to have a little of both worlds, old and new.
I have a lead line and a hand held compass. Of course, i also have a GPS and depth finder. GPS lat/lon gets plotted on my chart when i get in the Pacific. Guess it's best for me to have a little of both worlds, old and new.
Never let pride or complacency endanger your vessel
Many moons ago, I was crew on a 26 foot sailboat returning to Vallejo from a day of racing in Central San Francisco Bay. By the time we rounded the 'brothers' a thick fog had settled in and visibility was reduced to a couple of hundred feet. We posted lookouts, stopped the engine every 10 minutes or so to listen, and began a dead reconing line on the chart by compass and speed. It was hard to tell where the water stopped and the fog started, and daylight was fading fast. I quietly left my lookout post at the bow, and went back to ask the Skipper "how much trouble are we in 'really'?" He showed me the depth finder where he was slowly criss-crossing the edge of the shipping channel. 30Ft then 7 Ft then 26FT etc. We made it home no problem! By myself, I would have been stuck in the mud somewhere waiting for daylight. Today, my boat has a beautiful chart plotter and 2 back-ups with extra batteries. We have a 16 mile radar, VHF and SSB radio, and 3 built in compasses. We carry paper charts and pencils, and plot our coarse at least once every watch change. Knowledge and experience are what makes a sailor. Know how to use what you have. Make it a practise to have more than you need.
Many moons ago, I was crew on a 26 foot sailboat returning to Vallejo from a day of racing in Central San Francisco Bay. By the time we rounded the 'brothers' a thick fog had settled in and visibility was reduced to a couple of hundred feet. We posted lookouts, stopped the engine every 10 minutes or so to listen, and began a dead reconing line on the chart by compass and speed. It was hard to tell where the water stopped and the fog started, and daylight was fading fast. I quietly left my lookout post at the bow, and went back to ask the Skipper "how much trouble are we in 'really'?" He showed me the depth finder where he was slowly criss-crossing the edge of the shipping channel. 30Ft then 7 Ft then 26FT etc. We made it home no problem! By myself, I would have been stuck in the mud somewhere waiting for daylight. Today, my boat has a beautiful chart plotter and 2 back-ups with extra batteries. We have a 16 mile radar, VHF and SSB radio, and 3 built in compasses. We carry paper charts and pencils, and plot our coarse at least once every watch change. Knowledge and experience are what makes a sailor. Know how to use what you have. Make it a practise to have more than you need.
Electronics
We cruise in the San Juans. Evreything in that area is fairly close so no wide open seas. I have a chartplotter right at the helm and it is a constant source of navigation information including location, depth, hazards, etc. My next purchase is a handheld chartplotter for backup. Yes, we have paper charts, a compass, and lots of books on the areas we cruise. But, the electronics are the primary tools once underway. Another benefit is that the Chartplotter is hooked up to the VHF so we have full DSC capabilities. No paper chart will do that. For us, paper charts are strictly a backup in case the electronics fail and the paper charts are nice for overall trip planning.
We cruise in the San Juans. Evreything in that area is fairly close so no wide open seas. I have a chartplotter right at the helm and it is a constant source of navigation information including location, depth, hazards, etc. My next purchase is a handheld chartplotter for backup. Yes, we have paper charts, a compass, and lots of books on the areas we cruise. But, the electronics are the primary tools once underway. Another benefit is that the Chartplotter is hooked up to the VHF so we have full DSC capabilities. No paper chart will do that. For us, paper charts are strictly a backup in case the electronics fail and the paper charts are nice for overall trip planning.
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