Just purchased my O'Day 22 this past year. She sails great - but I have an awful time loading her on the Trailer. I even bent the tongue - which now has to be completely replaced. (I have a welder lined up to do this work in the spring.) My question - Can I use rollers under the hull and keel to make the whole loading process easier? Especially when a landing is steep - I can't crank the boat forward enough so it sits in the proper position. As soon as the weight of the boat is out of the water and sitting on the trailer - it is impossible to crank ahead. Please help!
Oday 22 Trailer trouble
- Thread starter Northwoods Sailor
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To be perfectly honest with you, I've never seen an O'Day 22 on a roller trailer but that doesn't mean that your O'Day 22's hull isn't strong and thick enough to take a complete roller trailer. I would venture to even go out on a limb and say, Yes. I honestly believe that the O'Day 22s can take a roller trailer and the reason I say this is because I've seen O'Day 25s, 23s, 222s, 240s, 192s, and even a fin keel O'Day 25 on a roller trailer.
My boat came through new back in 1986 at the Boston Boat Show with a Load-Rite single axle roller trailer with 15" wheels and that boat would almost fly off that trailer as soon as I let the winch cable off after backing down the ramp with the water up to the center of the wheel hubs. I tied a long line to the bow which was made of of two of my 25' mooring lines tied together, and let the boat drift down almost to the end of our dock.
The trailer had a rack of four 12" keel rollers on 18"X5/8" pins with buddy caps. Actually the weight of the boat can sit on these keel rollers and let the hull roller support the rest of the hull.
I notice that your boat doesn't have bottom paint which is a good indication to me that you intend to trailer. I did this for eight years myself. It's great if you're young and have the energy to do it.
There are pros and cons to roller trailers and they are:
Pros: You can launch your boat at most ramps the same as launching a powerboat.
You can take your boat off the trailer easier to and from boat stands at the end and beginning of the season.
Cons:
A roller trailer is more expensive to set up or buy already set up.
Bent keel roller pins that can bind up a roller which is a direct cause of trailering over bumps in a road.
Keeping the keel rollers lubricated.
A roller should be mounted on the last cross member of the trailer to ease the bow over it as she descends into the water. The roller will prevent damage to the bow.
With that said, if your planning on leaving the boat in the water, you could get away with a flat bunk trailer that will take a 23' boat. That way, the trailer will be long enough to back down deep enough to float the boat on and off the trailer without swamping the towing vehicle. The trailer can be a powerboat trailer which is rated for the weight of your boat with longer extension brackets to support the bunks which will need to be raised to make allowance for the depth of your keel.
The keel can sit on two sandwiched pressure treated planks attached to the cross members of the trailer.
That's about it.
Joe
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I also believe the hull is strong enough for rollers, I have considered them on my trailer because yes, once the weight of the boat is on the bunks it does not want to move.
Search for roller bunks...they look interesting.
Anyway, I overcome this problem by backing the trailer way down the ramp allowing me to float the boat into it's correct position...this requires a long steep ramp and high tide.
Of course, I further overcome this problem by renting a slip, I only use the trailer to haul out for maintenance or hurricanes.
Search for roller bunks...they look interesting.
Anyway, I overcome this problem by backing the trailer way down the ramp allowing me to float the boat into it's correct position...this requires a long steep ramp and high tide.
Of course, I further overcome this problem by renting a slip, I only use the trailer to haul out for maintenance or hurricanes.
My trailer looks fairly similar to yours and has carpeted bunks.
I have to back pretty far into the water to launch and retrieve, and I have to get everything at just the right water level to float off and on. My truck is a 4x4 with tires a little taller than stock and I wind up almost up to the axle in the water. I wade in water up to my knees to get to the winch on the trailer.
I usually have a helper tend the boat so when I back in to launch I make a mental note of how far in I had to get to float off, then try to match that when it is time to retrieve. My trailer also has an extendable tongue to help facilitate shallower ramps. I haven't had to use this yet. That might be an option your welder could install.
Have your welder look over the trailer frame closely as there may be some structural issue that contributed to the bending as well.
I have to back pretty far into the water to launch and retrieve, and I have to get everything at just the right water level to float off and on. My truck is a 4x4 with tires a little taller than stock and I wind up almost up to the axle in the water. I wade in water up to my knees to get to the winch on the trailer.
I usually have a helper tend the boat so when I back in to launch I make a mental note of how far in I had to get to float off, then try to match that when it is time to retrieve. My trailer also has an extendable tongue to help facilitate shallower ramps. I haven't had to use this yet. That might be an option your welder could install.
Have your welder look over the trailer frame closely as there may be some structural issue that contributed to the bending as well.
Right - I was going to mention that bending the tongue does not seem like a normal thing that should happen and really has nothing to do with the difficulties of loading/unloading. I had mine reinforced with two angle brackets welded under the tongue ( to make a T).
Wow!
I think I'm going to like this web site!!
I'm so glad to hear that I should be able to go the roller trailer route...
Daydreamer is right - if everything isn't perfectly positioned at the landing - forget it!
One of my favorite lakes (Plum Lake in Vilas County) has a very steep landing. When attempting to load - the nose of the boat hits the bow rest (because the bow rest support is angled toward the water) way before the boat is in the correct position over the bunks. When the trailer is pulled out of the water, the boat is approximately 1 foot too far back resulting in very little tongue weight. Gotta get this fixed!
Thank you so much for the detailed response.
I think I'm going to like this web site!!
I'm so glad to hear that I should be able to go the roller trailer route...
Daydreamer is right - if everything isn't perfectly positioned at the landing - forget it!
One of my favorite lakes (Plum Lake in Vilas County) has a very steep landing. When attempting to load - the nose of the boat hits the bow rest (because the bow rest support is angled toward the water) way before the boat is in the correct position over the bunks. When the trailer is pulled out of the water, the boat is approximately 1 foot too far back resulting in very little tongue weight. Gotta get this fixed!
Thank you so much for the detailed response.
Ken,
That's really the best way to combat the problem. I did the very same thing. I joined a YC on the river and later on started using bottom paint so I wouldn't have to keep pulling my boat out of the water and cleaning the bottom.
I loved my roller trailer but as it got older it started to nickle and diming me to death. I replaced leaf springs, square stock galvy tubing, pins and keel rollers. My roller trailer bit the dust one day as I was loading my boat on it. The trailer frame bent and I was forced to buy a new trailer, pronto. So I opted for a Long Tandem Aluminum bunk trailer. Today my trailer still looks as new as the day I bought it because I'm only using it about twice a year. I hose it down and leave it in my yard and it goes up on blocks at the end of the year. This year I left the boat on the trailer and jacked it up on blocks so that the tires are up off the ground.
In the spring I'll put Trinkka on my stands and spot paint the bottom.
The problem with loading the boat on a steep ramp with a bunk trailer arises because the trailer is on a steep angle in relation to the floating boat. You can tighten the snot out of the trailer winch and get the bow of the boat up tight against the stanchion roller, but as soon as you pull the trailer up the ramp, the front of the keel digs into the trailer's keel board which prevents the keel from sliding forward. Consequently, when the boat settles down on the keel, the bow is short of the stanchion roller by 3 or 4". So you have two choices you can make. You can back the trailer down again and stomp on the breaks and give it the "MacGregor Bump." or just try backing down and winching her tighter again.
My friend Wayne came up with an idea of using a regular cheap bottle jack with a roller attached to it. He has to get into the water and jack up the bow so that the bow eye comes even with the cable as it comes off the winch in the same way it would be when the trailer is on level ground. I have a picture of it but I can't seem to find it right now. When I do, I'll post it.
Joe
Joe the "MacGregor Bump"? I sense a storey here. I bet it's a good one to. Have you and Penny been out kayaking lately? Hang in there.
George
Have you and Penny been out kayaking lately? Hang in there.George
No, not really George. I learned about the "McGregor Bump" from the guys on "Trailer Sailor" forum a few years ago.Joe the "MacGregor Bump"? I sense a storey here. I bet it's a good one to.
George
A lot of times when we're trying to load our boat on the trailer at the ramp, we curse the reckless boater out there making large wakes as they go by the club, but I think that sometimes a wake or two can be advantageous as we pull the trailer up the ramp. It could mean the difference of the boat's keel sliding up on the keel board so that the bow of the boat is against the stanchion roller as it should be after we pulled the trailer up to the top of the ramp.
You know? I wanted to go kayaking so bad, but when I woke up on Thanksgiving morning, my back was killing me and it kept bothering me for a whole week. Between taking extra strength Tylenol, doing back exercises to get it back in place, and taking five mile walks at 1:00 AM, it finally went back in place yesterday. Honest to God, it was like having a tooth ache that never quits. I probably screwed my back up raking and picking up leaves in my yard. As it stands now, the favored tides for kayaking and beach combing won't be right until a week from this Saturday. So I'm going to have to wait I guess.
Ahoy!
Joe
I'm really sorry about that Joe, it sounds very painful. This getting old sh#t ain't for sissy's! I know with something like that no matter what you do, you just cannot get out from under neither that pain. Glad that it's better my friend. Remember when you do get out kayaking to be very careful with sharp objects, and bring plenty of bandages so we don't have to worry about you. Hang in there Joe.
George
Hang in there Joe.George
"Remember when you do get out kayaking to be very careful with sharp objects, and bring plenty of bandages so we don't have to worry about you." It's funny that you should mention that George because last summer I learned that one the hard way. I had just got over to the other side of the river with my kayak and started splitting some wood that I had cut previously on my last visit and had hidden in the bushes for a campfire. I had just bought my new Fiskers hatchet and was trying it out. Like a dumbbell, I sliced my thumb real good. Fortunately I had my "bug-out bag" with me with some bandages and tape,- "thank the good lord for small favors",- and was able to patch my thumb up and stop the bleeding. There was blood all over the place.
We never think of things like this until it's too late. There's a lot of glass and debris on that side of the river and I always carry bandages and tape just in case Penny cuts her foot. I even made a doggy boot out of denim with a piece of rawhide attached to it.
You're right though George. This old age business isn't what it's cut out to be. I just turned 69 last Sunday. Time sure flies when you're having fun! :dance:
We never think of things like this until it's too late. There's a lot of glass and debris on that side of the river and I always carry bandages and tape just in case Penny cuts her foot. I even made a doggy boot out of denim with a piece of rawhide attached to it.
You're right though George. This old age business isn't what it's cut out to be. I just turned 69 last Sunday. Time sure flies when you're having fun! :dance:
I keep my '74 (skeg keel) O22 on a single-axle roller trailer. The trailer was specifically designed and constructed around the boat by Loadrite in 1992. I bought the boat two years later and have never had a problem. I trailer sailed it the first several years of owning it, but now keep in the water Spring-Fall, so it doesn't see the abuse it used to.
It's hard to tell but the only issue the boat might have regarding the trailer is there might be slight deformation of the hull where it sits on a couple of the central rollers... so slight, it plays on your eyes. I can't measure it with a straight edge. I think it's more of an illusion. Besides, my boat as a thousand other issues before I begin worrying about the concrete-sidewalk strength of that hull. The rollers and trailer have no issues after all these years and doing a minimum of maintenance on it... good trailer.
It's hard to tell but the only issue the boat might have regarding the trailer is there might be slight deformation of the hull where it sits on a couple of the central rollers... so slight, it plays on your eyes. I can't measure it with a straight edge. I think it's more of an illusion. Besides, my boat as a thousand other issues before I begin worrying about the concrete-sidewalk strength of that hull. The rollers and trailer have no issues after all these years and doing a minimum of maintenance on it... good trailer.
Northwoods Sailer...
Here are pictures of my O22 on the roller trailer... Please don't laugh at the hull's finish! Started buffing out the oxidation and need to finish up in the spring.
Feel free to ask questions.
Here are pictures of my O22 on the roller trailer... Please don't laugh at the hull's finish! Started buffing out the oxidation and need to finish up in the spring.
Feel free to ask questions.
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Harry,
Your LR trailer is very similar to the LR trailer that came with my 86 O'Day 222 when I bought it new. Only mine had a rack with four 12" rollers for the keel. The pins were 18" long.
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If you check out the second picture of the two pics I posted, the square stock tube is held to the trailer's cross member with just two "U" bolts. I think the tube is 1.5" square stock.
Also, if you look close you'll see some small holes in each of the rollers. There was no other way to lubricate the pins with WD-40 other than to use these holes that I drilled.
If you build this rack for your keel rollers, all you need to do is shim up under the mounts of your main rollers to get the proper hull support. The keel rollers can take most of the weight of the boat. That was the way my trailer was set up. If you can get your trailer set up like mine, that boat will literally fly off that trailer. When my rollers were lubed I couldn't release the winch hook from the bow eye after backing down the ramp. The boat kept sliding down off the trailer.
The cure to that problem was to tie a 50' line to my Port bow cleat and take a large bight of that line and take two wraps around the winch stanchion to take the strain of the boat until I could get enough slack to remove the hook from the bow eye with one hand while holding the rope with my other hand. Then, all I had to do was let go of the line and the bight would quickly unwrap from the stanchion as the boat slid off the trailer.
There is only one important thing that I can add that can save you some grief. Years ago I noticed that my bow was getting chewed up by something just under the bow eye. Come to find out, the bow was hitting the last cross member of my trailer as she was sliding off. I had to add a roller to it to soften up the blow. This only happened when I launched the boat because the boat was sliding off the trailer really, too fast. As far as I was concerned though, the faster she came off the trailer the better. People standing around near the ramp were always amazed that my boat would slide of that trailer so fast and be down the end of the dock quicker than most powerboats of any size. The 50' rope length allowed me to quickly get on the dock and follow the boat to a place that I could tie her up to.
In closing I just want to say that a sailboat trailer that is set up this way makes for great trailer sailing. I know because I did it for eight years almost every weekend in the summer.
Good Luck!
Joe
Joe,
Interesting set-up with the keel rollers. My set up doesn't allow the keel to come into contact with the trailer at all. The rollers completely support the boat. The clearance between my keel and the axle concerned me when I first got it as it is tight enough that I thought the axle might bounce into it causing damage, but my springs are so stiff that never happened. I still keep the axle wrapped in carpet just in case, though.
Also, there is enough resistance in my rollers that the boat can be backed down my local ramp with the winch disconnected and it won't roll off the trailer until she is almost fully floating... but that's because we don't have a steep ramp, and I don't lubricate my rollers except lightly to keep corrosion at bay.
I love the trailer. I could easily float my 22 onto a bunk trailer where I launch/retrieve but it came with the boat. It was a blessing when I used to trailer sail it regionally, from local lakes in SE PA, Ocean City DE Back bays, and especially the Chesapeake.
Interesting set-up with the keel rollers. My set up doesn't allow the keel to come into contact with the trailer at all. The rollers completely support the boat. The clearance between my keel and the axle concerned me when I first got it as it is tight enough that I thought the axle might bounce into it causing damage, but my springs are so stiff that never happened. I still keep the axle wrapped in carpet just in case, though.
Also, there is enough resistance in my rollers that the boat can be backed down my local ramp with the winch disconnected and it won't roll off the trailer until she is almost fully floating... but that's because we don't have a steep ramp, and I don't lubricate my rollers except lightly to keep corrosion at bay.
I love the trailer. I could easily float my 22 onto a bunk trailer where I launch/retrieve but it came with the boat. It was a blessing when I used to trailer sail it regionally, from local lakes in SE PA, Ocean City DE Back bays, and especially the Chesapeake.
Harry,
I loved my LR trailer but as it got older it started nickle and diming me to death as far as replacing parts. First it was the springs and then one of the square stock tubes needed replacing. Pins got bent and needed replacing.
Later on I got tired of trailering so I joined a YC and only put the boat in when I wanted to use it. I was able to leave the boat sitting on the trailer with the mast up in the club yard. I had no bottom paint on the boat.
After that, I decided to bottom paint the boat and just leave it in the water.
One day I went to take the boat out of the water and while I was winching her on the trailer, the trailer frame bent in half. later on I looked under the trailer and discovered that the cross members were eaten away by rust. I aborted that attempt and put the boat back on the mooring and decided to bite the bullet and buy a new trailer.
I wanted to get away from rollers and go to a tandem axle bunk trailer. I went to a dealer in nearby RI and bought the Long Trailer. The trailer has an Aluminum frame is is good for 4600 LBS. It's built to carry a 23' boat. The dealer told me to buy a trailer that will take a longer boat of at least one foot, and I'll be able to float her on and off without swamping the towing vehicle. He was right. If you look close at the picture you can see the winch stanchion mounted on the tongue inside of the "A" frame and there's plenty of length on this trailer to float her off and on.
So I'm only using the trailer about twice a year.
This trailer by the way is a powerboat trailer that I converted for this boat. All I needed was the 24" bunk extension brackets and two pressure treated planks sandwiched together for the keel.
The Long Trailer Co. in NC went out of business several years ago. What a shame. I honestly believe that they built the best bunk extension brackets on the market today. I can't understand for the life of me why some manufacturer doesn't started building these brackets for the folks who have keel centerboard sloops. All that is needed is a powerboat trailer that is rated for the weight of the boat, the brackets, keel board, and Voila you have a sailboat trailer!:dance:
I loved my LR trailer but as it got older it started nickle and diming me to death as far as replacing parts. First it was the springs and then one of the square stock tubes needed replacing. Pins got bent and needed replacing.
Later on I got tired of trailering so I joined a YC and only put the boat in when I wanted to use it. I was able to leave the boat sitting on the trailer with the mast up in the club yard. I had no bottom paint on the boat.
After that, I decided to bottom paint the boat and just leave it in the water.
One day I went to take the boat out of the water and while I was winching her on the trailer, the trailer frame bent in half. later on I looked under the trailer and discovered that the cross members were eaten away by rust. I aborted that attempt and put the boat back on the mooring and decided to bite the bullet and buy a new trailer.
I wanted to get away from rollers and go to a tandem axle bunk trailer. I went to a dealer in nearby RI and bought the Long Trailer. The trailer has an Aluminum frame is is good for 4600 LBS. It's built to carry a 23' boat. The dealer told me to buy a trailer that will take a longer boat of at least one foot, and I'll be able to float her on and off without swamping the towing vehicle. He was right. If you look close at the picture you can see the winch stanchion mounted on the tongue inside of the "A" frame and there's plenty of length on this trailer to float her off and on.
So I'm only using the trailer about twice a year.
This trailer by the way is a powerboat trailer that I converted for this boat. All I needed was the 24" bunk extension brackets and two pressure treated planks sandwiched together for the keel.
The Long Trailer Co. in NC went out of business several years ago. What a shame. I honestly believe that they built the best bunk extension brackets on the market today. I can't understand for the life of me why some manufacturer doesn't started building these brackets for the folks who have keel centerboard sloops. All that is needed is a powerboat trailer that is rated for the weight of the boat, the brackets, keel board, and Voila you have a sailboat trailer!:dance:
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