:(O.K. lets talk toilets

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sand sailor

sand sailor

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Sep 19, 2006
643
SCHOCK santana27' lake pleasant,az
this is what i removed when replacing the floor in my boat but no holding tank(not required when boat was built). should I, A: put it back the way it was B: put it in with a holding tank and plumb accordingly C: install new MSD unit D: cut hole in floor? ha ha ha!
 

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J

John

Sure, all of the above

Well, you could put it back in like it was but then, you just can't legally use it unless you're 3 miles or more off shore. Hard to do in Arizona. You could put it back with a holding tank and plumb accordingly but, other options might be better. It depends on the boat but maybe a porta-potti or a new marine head. It seems the general consensus is that it may be more cost effective to replace an antique head with a new one rather than trying to rebuild an old one.
 
Peggie Hall HeadMistress

Peggie Hall HeadMistress

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Dec 2, 1997
9,011
- - LIttle Rock
What size is the boat? And...

How old is the toilet? Where is the boat (I know YOU'RE in AZ, but that doesn't necessarily mean that's where the boat is)? I need to know all of the above before I can advise on the best answers for your boat.
 
S

Scott

Add a holding tank ...

Yours looks like a Wilcox Head Mate, and you can buy an exact replacement for it for less than $150. I bought the exact same model last year and replaced my old one with all the hoses (not a fun job - because of the hoses - the head went in easily because the bolts match exactly). Why does yours look so dirty? Does it work? Just do the plumbing for a holding tank if that's what you want. I assume you already have a thru hull for the discharge. All you need to do is add a wye valve and hosess for discharge to a holding tank. Or you can simply put in a porta potty, avoid the plumbing and close the thru hull. Your choice ...
 
NautiDuck

NautiDuck

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Jun 3, 2004
730
Catalina 250 Wing Keel Eugene, OR
MSD

We installed a MSD (porta-potti) with pumpout on our Catalina 250. All the benefits of a "real" marine toilet with much less water use and easier operation. I advise MSDs for anything under 30'
 
Peggie Hall HeadMistress

Peggie Hall HeadMistress

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Dec 2, 1997
9,011
- - LIttle Rock
That's what I'd do on a small boat

No plumbing except a vent and pumpout hose...no maintenance...and the 5-6 gal model holds as many flushes as a 15-18 gal. tank connected to a marine toilet. Btw, portapotty mfrs add the designation "MSD" to their model names and numbers to show that it's a version intended to be permanently installed and fitted for pumpout instead of a portable version...but "MSD" doesn't only apply to portapotties. Federal law defines an MSD as "any equipment for installation on board a vessel which is designed to receive, retain, treat, or discharge sewage, and any process to treat such sewage." So ALL toilets, tanks and treatment devices--including both portable AND permanently installed portapotties--are MSDs. So when searching portapotties, you don't want to search for "MSD"...that'll bring up every type of marine sanition device on the planet...make your search term specific to the type of MSD--manual marine toilets, electric marine toilets, holding tanks, portapotties etc. Thetford and SeaLand Technology are the brands you want to search for either type of portapotty.
 
S

SceptreSailor

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May 24, 2004
154
Catalina 310 Virginia Beach, VA
I vote for holding tank

A holding tank is the way to go. you should be able to install yourself to save $$$.
 
Ralph18414

Ralph18414

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Dec 11, 2005
74
Pearson 30 Wanderer NA
ElectraSan

For the most part, I love my electra-san head. It is completely legal where I am at (northern Alabama) and there is no holding tank to pump out. If you are on fresh water, however, there are two small draw-backs: 1) you have to keep a small saltwater tank filled; and 2) you have an extra valve to turn when pumping the head. Point 2 would go away if you installed an electric valve to open the saltwater tank when you push the flush button on the electra san console (oh--I forgot--you got to also push the button when flushing so there are 3 minor draw backs). The additional steps needed to flush the head will create anxiety for guests unless electric valves and an electric head are all wired to a single button.
 
sand sailor

sand sailor

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Sep 19, 2006
643
SCHOCK santana27' lake pleasant,az
i have little ones

so ease of use is atop the list along with odor control and weight i already have the through hull s for just about anything
 
Peggie Hall HeadMistress

Peggie Hall HeadMistress

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Dec 2, 1997
9,011
- - LIttle Rock
sandsailor, everything you've said...

reinforces my opinion that you should go with a self-contained system. 'Cuz with children aboard, you not only need the simplest system, but you're gonna need all the storage space you have...you don't need to lose 1/4-1/3 of it to a tank and all the plumbing...and you SURE don't need the maintenance required for a "real" marine toilet and holding tank...not to mention the repair problems that can be caused by a small child trying to flush something marine toilets can't swallow. Flushing a portapotty (portable AND "MSD" models) is easy: just pull the lever. Maintenance is easy: use a non-chemical tank product in the tank (PULEEEZE read the directions and follow 'em!)...pump it out...pull the lever and pour a bucket of water into it, pump that out. That's IT! If one of your kids puts something in the bowl they shouldn't have (I once had to get a fist-sized stuffed animal out of a system), it can't clog anything and recovery is easy, if not particularly fun. Ya gotta small boat...ya got small kids...you NEED simplicity!
 
J

jimq26

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Jun 5, 2004
860
- - -
Sandsailor - Peggie nailed it.

Get rid of all those through hulls that are not essential for draining grey water (I assume that is allowed where you sail). You sure as heck don't need a holding tank. There is no odour with a permanent mounted portapotty. Simple to maintain, and much easier for kids (talking from experience here on all counts).
 
sand sailor

sand sailor

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Sep 19, 2006
643
SCHOCK santana27' lake pleasant,az
thats kind of why

i took it out in the first place i was thinking msd porta but thought i should get some other opinions thanx;D
 
Aloha27

Aloha27

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Jun 12, 2004
26
Aloha Yachts Aloha 27 Barrachois Harbour (Tatamagouche) NS Canada
Wilcox-Crittenden Head Mate

Although ours isn't quite in as immaculate shape (grin) I recognize the head as a WC.
 
seadaddler

seadaddler

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Dec 19, 2006
5,832
Hunter 36 Punta Gorda
Raritan

I have that wilcox crittenden in my 2007 as others also do and I can tell you I have only used it for three months and i just called the factory for the second time for parts. I am wondering how after only using it for three month's so far and needed to repair it,what will happen in a few years. Nick
 
sand sailor

sand sailor

.
Sep 19, 2006
643
SCHOCK santana27' lake pleasant,az
i took it out to replace the floor

and i 'm not sure i want to put it back???
 
D

deryk

toilets

When my holding tank leaked for the 2nd time I pulled it all out and use the biggest thetford porta pottie they make... works great, easy to remove to dump it when I need to. Im thinking of going the electra san route to even more simplify things.
 
J

Jerry Artman

I think MSD might become the required future...

Sinc I sail in the North Channel of Lake Huron, we ar not allowed to have non-MSD units. Even PAP's mush be pump outs in Ontario, though not in Michigan. So I refitted my good old boat with one. The small one because the 6gal didn't fit under the v berth boards. The plumbing is not very hard. The straighter the line, the cheaper. Make sure the connections are tight. What I did learn was that it was cheaper to buy and non-MSD and then order an MSD bottom tank. Most common prices on the regular at sale was $6X. The MSD was $12X. I looked over the parts list and all were exactly the same other than the holding tank which has the pump/vent fittings. I was able to order the pump out version for $4x. So now I have both. Disconnection the pipe ( after good flushing out and you can revert the non MSD for short days or where not required. I recently read some noise on the USBOAT site that the US is considering requiring MSD's in more areas. Makes sense based on the clamoring that we are destroying the planet and such by doing anything. Also, as the number of rec boater increase the enrionment cannot handle the increased load as effectively. If you're at the place to refit, I think now is the time for convert.
 
Tom Spohn

Tom Spohn

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Jun 7, 2004
383
Schock 35 Seattle
This One

is the one we used for a three week trip on our 26' MacGregor into the BC Gulf Islands. We did not connect the pump out feature simply because there are so few pumpouts in British Columbia. It was easy to empty into campground or marina toilets. We made a similar trip this year on a 35' keelboat with a 20 gal. tank which required about the same no. of pumpouts. The electric flush is really nice. It only pumps while you hold the button and it really swirls into the bowl cleaning it. If depositing liquids one or two quick pushes will clean the bowl without using much water. This model also has a 6 gal. holding tank which I liked for the capacity, but also it sits a little higher which is better for me. (I am 6+' tall) http://www.sportsmansguide.com/cb/cb.asp?a=34937
 
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