I am considering buying a boat half way up Lake Michigan and bringing it back to Erie by going around the top and through Huron. May weather on Erie isn't too bad, but it's not a sure thing. What are conditions like around the fingertips of the glove in May?
North coast weather
- Thread starter T37 Phil
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Bad weather
Md?? Is that some lost province of southern Canada? Recently we had 45kts and 18+ ft of slop on Lake Erie. I'd call that a bad day. Then too, variable from dangerous to just plain cold and miserable isn't the same thing as variable from damp and breezy to sunny and calm. Surely you have seasons there in Perryville.
Md?? Is that some lost province of southern Canada? Recently we had 45kts and 18+ ft of slop on Lake Erie. I'd call that a bad day. Then too, variable from dangerous to just plain cold and miserable isn't the same thing as variable from damp and breezy to sunny and calm. Surely you have seasons there in Perryville.
Depends on the boat
I wouldn't make that trip in a 25 footer but I'd consider it in a 32 or 34. It also depends on your experience and how much time you have. That's a trip of several weeks (at least) duration. If you're on a schedule, put it on a trailer and ship it. Your "Geneva" address tells me you're on the east end of Lake Erie. So, you're talking about a trip of 600++ miles. You planning on doing this over the course of the entire summer season? You can probably ship it for less than the trip will cost you in transient fees, etc.
I wouldn't make that trip in a 25 footer but I'd consider it in a 32 or 34. It also depends on your experience and how much time you have. That's a trip of several weeks (at least) duration. If you're on a schedule, put it on a trailer and ship it. Your "Geneva" address tells me you're on the east end of Lake Erie. So, you're talking about a trip of 600++ miles. You planning on doing this over the course of the entire summer season? You can probably ship it for less than the trip will cost you in transient fees, etc.
Awww Phil, I have not had a bad day in my entire
life. I admit to a few that I have no desire to repeat but anytime you wake up you have had a good day. People have far too much of a tendency to remember to gales and to forget the balmy days with soft winds. When the wind threatens to pipe up stay in a sheltered anchorage and read a book. 600 mile you should be able to do in a month and a half and not do batle with wind over 15 and perhaps not even that. The link show May weather(temperatures) for Detroit.
life. I admit to a few that I have no desire to repeat but anytime you wake up you have had a good day. People have far too much of a tendency to remember to gales and to forget the balmy days with soft winds. When the wind threatens to pipe up stay in a sheltered anchorage and read a book. 600 mile you should be able to do in a month and a half and not do batle with wind over 15 and perhaps not even that. The link show May weather(temperatures) for Detroit.
Get some crew and go 24/7
I have never sailed on Lake Huron but I have spent several summers on an island in Georgian Bay. Every few days a squall line comes down from the North. You have about 30 minutes from when you hear the distant thunder til when you get hit. The prevailing winds are from the NW. The shallow areas get a lot of disorganized chop so even if you are running with the wind, you'll still get a lot of wave action. In Sept. I brought a 40' ketch up from San Diego to SF Bay. I had 2 crew and we did several 24 and 36 Hr. passages. There was a great weather window and besides seeing a lot of whales, dolphins (none of those in Huron), and otters (you may see some of them in Huron), there was a lot of flat water. It took 10 days total, with 6 overnight stops. Having 1 or 2 crew can really help on a long passage, even if you don't do any 24 Hr passages. The advantage of going 24/7 is you can take advantage of a weather window, as I did.
I have never sailed on Lake Huron but I have spent several summers on an island in Georgian Bay. Every few days a squall line comes down from the North. You have about 30 minutes from when you hear the distant thunder til when you get hit. The prevailing winds are from the NW. The shallow areas get a lot of disorganized chop so even if you are running with the wind, you'll still get a lot of wave action. In Sept. I brought a 40' ketch up from San Diego to SF Bay. I had 2 crew and we did several 24 and 36 Hr. passages. There was a great weather window and besides seeing a lot of whales, dolphins (none of those in Huron), and otters (you may see some of them in Huron), there was a lot of flat water. It took 10 days total, with 6 overnight stops. Having 1 or 2 crew can really help on a long passage, even if you don't do any 24 Hr passages. The advantage of going 24/7 is you can take advantage of a weather window, as I did.
my take
Geneva is just east of us, in Ohio. About the middle of the lake. It might take a week to do the sail. Larry did his trip from the farthest reaches of Superior to Cleveland in less than 2. 18 footers this past week? I think not. If I remember from Dick Goddard, age 75 and still doing the weather in Cleveland, the only weatherman we sailors ever listen to (Jeff Tanchek is close, very close), LE can have maximum wave heights 14'-15' because of the depth (around Cleveland - 60'). There have been anomalies like the ONE 30'er in 1911, but that is an odd one. How big a boat? What kind? Sounds like fun. Better have a good motor as you will probably do that more than sail. Remember the freighters on Huron.
Geneva is just east of us, in Ohio. About the middle of the lake. It might take a week to do the sail. Larry did his trip from the farthest reaches of Superior to Cleveland in less than 2. 18 footers this past week? I think not. If I remember from Dick Goddard, age 75 and still doing the weather in Cleveland, the only weatherman we sailors ever listen to (Jeff Tanchek is close, very close), LE can have maximum wave heights 14'-15' because of the depth (around Cleveland - 60'). There have been anomalies like the ONE 30'er in 1911, but that is an odd one. How big a boat? What kind? Sounds like fun. Better have a good motor as you will probably do that more than sail. Remember the freighters on Huron.
24/7
24/7 with a few stops would be the plan. Two weeks, maybe three. Our Mar/Apr can be pretty unpredictable, with even feet of snow possible. If northern MI weather is 4-6 weeks behind us in spring, it could make for some uncomfortable delays or uncomfortable sailing. The boat is a Tartan 37, so I don't think that's the limitation. As for the 18 footers, I can assure you I wasn't out in the middle of the lake with a tape measure and an anemometer. I don't listen to the TV weather at all for lake weather (guess I'm not a sailor??). NOAA and wunderground reported something on the order of 18-24' as I recall. The waves crashes at Mentor Headlands were some of the worst I've seen in a long time. The winds were picking up beach and slinging it like a sand blaster into the treeline. About ten winters back I remember a noreaster slipping the gap at the east end of the Fairport breakwall and sending very large waves against the shore under the Harbortown Pointe restaurant (or whatever it's called). The waves appeared to be near topping the 10-15' or so of wall, occasionally crashing to send volumes of water another 10-15' up the side of the restaurant tower. It's always humorous to hear powerboaters come in from 10-15mi out fishing trips, white knuckled with stories about the 8-10 footers when it looks all of 3-5' or less from the deck of a sailboat. Out of curiousity, how are you arriving at your max wave height from max depth calculation? Guesstamation or formula? Letterman - what time of year did Larry make that trip? Bottom line, if it's not going to be a safe and enjoyable trip, we'd probably just go with land transport either to Toledo or the whole 9yds to Geneva. Ross - thanks, I need northern MI. I'll check your link for it.
24/7 with a few stops would be the plan. Two weeks, maybe three. Our Mar/Apr can be pretty unpredictable, with even feet of snow possible. If northern MI weather is 4-6 weeks behind us in spring, it could make for some uncomfortable delays or uncomfortable sailing. The boat is a Tartan 37, so I don't think that's the limitation. As for the 18 footers, I can assure you I wasn't out in the middle of the lake with a tape measure and an anemometer. I don't listen to the TV weather at all for lake weather (guess I'm not a sailor??). NOAA and wunderground reported something on the order of 18-24' as I recall. The waves crashes at Mentor Headlands were some of the worst I've seen in a long time. The winds were picking up beach and slinging it like a sand blaster into the treeline. About ten winters back I remember a noreaster slipping the gap at the east end of the Fairport breakwall and sending very large waves against the shore under the Harbortown Pointe restaurant (or whatever it's called). The waves appeared to be near topping the 10-15' or so of wall, occasionally crashing to send volumes of water another 10-15' up the side of the restaurant tower. It's always humorous to hear powerboaters come in from 10-15mi out fishing trips, white knuckled with stories about the 8-10 footers when it looks all of 3-5' or less from the deck of a sailboat. Out of curiousity, how are you arriving at your max wave height from max depth calculation? Guesstamation or formula? Letterman - what time of year did Larry make that trip? Bottom line, if it's not going to be a safe and enjoyable trip, we'd probably just go with land transport either to Toledo or the whole 9yds to Geneva. Ross - thanks, I need northern MI. I'll check your link for it.
May weather in Huron
From the perspective of Lake Huron - in May the water is cold and this has two effects 1. you would want an exposure suit in case you fall overboard (and to keep you warm when you get hit by spray) 2. on the Canadian side you occasionally get day long fog when warm moist air from the land passes over the cold lake - I expect that is true on the Michigan side as well. I haven't made a study of it, however in my experience the winds in May are on average lower than the winds in late August and September. Most days are good, however you may have a few days of strong winds 30 knots+ occasionally. That said, you know what is coming reasonably accurately a day ahead. There are enough ports along this part of the Great Lakes that that you can shelter in if you feel the need. That said, I am assuming you and the boat are seaworthy - what size of boat are you talking about? Regarding time for making the voyage - we brought our boat from Frenchman's Bay (east of Toronto) around to Kincardine in early June in 13 days (including a passage through the Welland Ship Canal, several layovers and a few short sailing days so that we could explore new places) - the distance was about the same as you are talking about. From a safety point of view, the key is to leave some slack in your schedule so that you can sit out days that you would rather not be on the water - and that you can use to enjoy a stop over. However, if you want to do it quickly and have some good help, you can do it in probably a week or a bit more with nightly stop overs (and if the weather co-operates). My suggestion would be take the time to enjoy the trip - there are good ports on Lake Huron - Kincardine being only one
From the perspective of Lake Huron - in May the water is cold and this has two effects 1. you would want an exposure suit in case you fall overboard (and to keep you warm when you get hit by spray) 2. on the Canadian side you occasionally get day long fog when warm moist air from the land passes over the cold lake - I expect that is true on the Michigan side as well. I haven't made a study of it, however in my experience the winds in May are on average lower than the winds in late August and September. Most days are good, however you may have a few days of strong winds 30 knots+ occasionally. That said, you know what is coming reasonably accurately a day ahead. There are enough ports along this part of the Great Lakes that that you can shelter in if you feel the need. That said, I am assuming you and the boat are seaworthy - what size of boat are you talking about? Regarding time for making the voyage - we brought our boat from Frenchman's Bay (east of Toronto) around to Kincardine in early June in 13 days (including a passage through the Welland Ship Canal, several layovers and a few short sailing days so that we could explore new places) - the distance was about the same as you are talking about. From a safety point of view, the key is to leave some slack in your schedule so that you can sit out days that you would rather not be on the water - and that you can use to enjoy a stop over. However, if you want to do it quickly and have some good help, you can do it in probably a week or a bit more with nightly stop overs (and if the weather co-operates). My suggestion would be take the time to enjoy the trip - there are good ports on Lake Huron - Kincardine being only one
Go by water
As long as you give yourself enough time, there is no reason to worry about 18 footers - or whatever they may have been. Waves like that don't just pop up unexpectedly on the Great lakes. Make sure you have time to lay over on bad days and you will be fine. I did the trip during mid June a couple of years ago and took the time to visit the North Channel and georgian Bay - highly recommended. Those two areas are as good as the BVI for cruising.
As long as you give yourself enough time, there is no reason to worry about 18 footers - or whatever they may have been. Waves like that don't just pop up unexpectedly on the Great lakes. Make sure you have time to lay over on bad days and you will be fine. I did the trip during mid June a couple of years ago and took the time to visit the North Channel and georgian Bay - highly recommended. Those two areas are as good as the BVI for cruising.
Great Loopers
You might want to check some of the literature on America's Great Loop. They go through that area and might have some insight.
You might want to check some of the literature on America's Great Loop. They go through that area and might have some insight.
can't believe I found it
Go near the bottom...Superior, Huron, Erie. Larry is a rocket scientist at NASA. Runs the department that studies flame in space. He is very introspective and the article shows it. It was in May that he did the trip.
Go near the bottom...Superior, Huron, Erie. Larry is a rocket scientist at NASA. Runs the department that studies flame in space. He is very introspective and the article shows it. It was in May that he did the trip.
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