Norfolk Virgina BULLYING

Scott T-Bird · Sep 1, 2011

Brina, don't be sensitive ... it was just a small joke. I don't really expect anybody to be sending money to the bloke.

Like I said, I don't have any compassion for this case (at least from what I have read), so I won't pretend that I do. It's an individual thing, I can't fault anybody for feeling compassion over anything they choose. I won't even argue that my conclusions are valid. I'm too far removed and I am not compelled to know any more than what has been produced in this forum for entertainment value. That sounds crass doesn't it?

I think compassion could be extended in many more places where it is more fully deserved. I know that we are a community of boat owners and it is natural to come to the defense of a fellow boat owner. I just don't always follow that mold.

Rick Webb · Sep 1, 2011

Word on the Street in Phoebus, VA is they are Raising Money

The goal is to raise enough money to put him and his boat on a trailer and send it and him somewhere else.

Anyone want to offer to put him up till he gets his boat fixed? I will put you in contact with the orchestrator of that movement.

Ross · Sep 1, 2011

Re: Good point Brina, We don't have the facts

First thing to keep in mind is due process of the law. No one may be deprived of their property without due process of the law. The DA knows this, the cops know this. If they break his boat without a court order they will end up buying him a ne boat.

Bad Obsession · Sep 1, 2011

The media can be right brutal. They have a knack for taking a story and creating a big deal out of it.

This being said, it is hard to defend someone who makes such bad decisions. None of us know the real story behind this and I would proffer that it will be entirely different from what the press reports are saying.

As for the three days, I would say that if Norfolk does this to the guy then it would be interesting to see what legal recourse the guy can have.

Does anyone know for sure if he has insurance or not? Does anyone personally know this guy or have they met him? I wonder what his thought process was for this event.

Mainesail is right in saying at sea you are the captain of your own boat and you make your destiny. That being said, we have all made some mistakes while at sea. I don't know if I feel sorry for this guy though.

I guess the part that gets me is seeing the boat washed up on the shore. Part of me feel sad for the boat. It is like watching someone's dreams being beaten apart in a lot of ways.

justsomeguy · Sep 1, 2011

Ross said:
First thing to keep in mind is due process of the law. No one may be deprived of their property without due process of the law. The DA knows this, the cops know this. If they break his boat without a court order they will end up buying him a ne boat.

Are you sure of this legal decision? I'd like to think that you're right.

Bad Obsession · Sep 1, 2011

One would like to believe that a person can't be deprived of life, liberty, or property without due process but this is a city government issuing this ultimatum. They are handling it like a neighbor that has grass that has grown up too high.

I am sure that there is a way to legally stall the city but he needs to get a lawyer and get a move on!

justsomeguy · Sep 1, 2011

Bad Obsession said:
The media can be right brutal. They have a knack for taking a story and creating a big deal out of it.

This being said, it is hard to defend someone who makes such bad decisions. None of us know the real story behind this and I would proffer that it will be entirely different from what the press reports are saying.

As for the three days, I would say that if Norfolk does this to the guy then it would be interesting to see what legal recourse the guy can have.

Does anyone know for sure if he has insurance or not? Does anyone personally know this guy or have they met him? I wonder what his thought process was for this event.

Mainesail is right in saying at sea you are the captain of your own boat and you make your destiny. That being said, we have all made some mistakes while at sea. I don't know if I feel sorry for this guy though.

I guess the part that gets me is seeing the boat washed up on the shore. Part of me feel sad for the boat. It is like watching someone's dreams being beaten apart in a lot of ways.

Good questions, but insurance usually won't cover you if you unsuccessfully try to navigate your boat through a named storm. But you can still feel sorry for him, even if you think he should be put through the wringer. That's okay.

Stu Jackson · Sep 2, 2011

Bad Obsession said:
One would like to believe that a person can't be deprived of life, liberty, or property without due process...

Uhm, how about CG boardings of your boat? They"supposedly" can't do that to you in your house, but if your boat is your house...

Just sayin'...

Kinda like the Supreme Court said last year that corporations are "people" and can contribute to political campaigns. Does that mean that since PG&E blew up a whole neighborhood and killed seven people that they can be tried as people, too, instead of getting away with murder?

Just askin'...

Scott B · Sep 2, 2011

c_witch said:
I have been watching the responses made to this post with interest. Lets get a few things sorted out here.

1) He was NOT arrested for intoxication ( after 2 beers nobody would be; however there are any number of laws to arrest him for)
2) His past issue of 'Skinny Dipping' is in the past PEOPLE get over it. Personally I think celebrating ones body is ANY thing but terrible.
3)CG claims the boat isn't seaworthy DUH they have to go with the strickest interprtation of the law ie broken rudder.
4) She doesn't appear to the holed and unless the CG person was able to lift her up on her keel to see the side heeled over then I doubt that they know either.
5) I see some people claiming the keel is broken?? Please explain this observation to me, as it appears to still be solidly fastened to the boat and not even bent or bent very very little, at least one of the wings is still on it and looks to be oriented correctly.
6) Who said the engine was and has been inoperative ?? as it sure looked to me as though they were under power and then lost it before being pushed over the breakwater. This might also explain why they have little diesel on board.
7) Waves washing and beating her now my god she is quite some distance from the water so I doubt she is taking any pounding now other then lookie loo's rumaging about on board.

Ok the guy made a really stupid mistake to leave his anchorage (or maybe not). It appears that this cascaded into a near catastrophic event. It sounds like a cash flow issue for him at the moment although I also suspect he is not particularly wealthy.

OH yeah I have seem some refer to him as an alcoholic and I have yet to see that anywhere.

Perhaps some should really try and put themselves in his shoes ( those who are god excepted ) and try and get a grip on what it would be like.

Brina

1. He said "They had a nice meal and relaxed, and Calabrese said he drank a couple of beers." A couple of beers to someone that has been "Calabrese has been charged with alcohol-related offenses several times in Hampton Roads." a couple could easily be several. "Calabrese was “nasty (cursing everyone) and very argumentative.” sounds more like intoxication.

2. skinny dipping is jumping off the back of your boat in an anchorage or a semi- secluded beach ..... taking a swim naked & intoxicated..... could depend on where he was swimming and if the police were involved sounds too public to doing so.

3 & 5 check the pictures..... http://forums.hunter.sailboatowners.com/showthread.php?t=133358

6, He did..... "They had to move under sail power because the diesel engines were disabled, he said."

http://hamptonroads.com/2011/08/boater-rescued-during-irene-has-trouble-land

Sounds like a lot of very stupid mistakes.....

Ross · Sep 2, 2011

The usual procedure for a common nuisance is to levy a daily fine until the problem is taken care of . If it goes on long enough then the jusidiction with petion the courts to allow them to seize the property.

Buck420 · Sep 2, 2011

Gentlemen,

If you are still interested in this situation, and would like to see the (approximate) actual site where the boat is beached, Google Earth ...
928 West Ocean View Ave., Norfolk, Va. 23503

The boat lies about half way up on the beach behind one of the rock groins showing in the overhead view.

Having personally walked down the beach and looked at the boat... and, having talked to others in the local sailing community, there is, as you might expect, more to this story than what has been written in the press.

Perhaps it might be best to simply say that the captain would probable agree that he exercised poor judgement, before, during, and after the storm with respect to the ownership and handling of his boat.

How this "situation" becomes resolved, remains to be seen.

MrBill_FLL · Sep 2, 2011

I'd say that engine hasn't worked in some time, based on the barnacles on the prop and shaft:

http://www.sailcheers.com/images/Aug 11/IMG_0144-sm.jpg

(Initially, I figured it was disabled by sludge in the tank becoming dislodged, but that photo changes my mind.)

I see a lot of derelict vessels, and that didn't look like one.... initially. but does anyone allow that type of growth on their props?

(OTOH, that rode is wrapped around like the shaft WAS spinning..) :stirthepot:

-and the city of Norfolk is taking a page out of almost any Florida city 5 years ago, regarding mooring. A lot of Florida cities passed laws (now judged unlawful) to force vessels out of nice anchorages, with weathy land owners...

The City just wants it moved, and the 3 day limit was just to start accumulating fees... just like a tow truck lot...

at this point, its a stop loss situation. how can he minimize the loss.

IMHO, the best bet is make a deal with a salvage operator. get what he can while he can.

Sometime a persons purpose in life is, to be a warning to others...

But, I am glad he and his crew was safe.

Gary_H · Sep 2, 2011

My thoughts are that if he is as broke as everyone thinks he is ..then he will end up loosing his boat any way. His only hope may be to work out some deal with a salvage company whereby he turns the boat over to them for a minimal amount of money and an opportunity to salvage some belongings. A salvage company may do the job if they believe the boats value would cover their fee plus profit. They would put a lien on the boat. If it was me I would rather see the boat go to a salvage company than chopped up and trashed by the city. The owners options a very limited as is time apparently.

MrBill_FLL · Sep 2, 2011

someone on sailnet had a good point.

its private property above the Mean High Water Mark... city might have a case after all.

justsomeguy · Sep 2, 2011

The rest of the photos.

Oops. I see this link has already been posted on the other thread. The Department of Redundancy Department in action.

Gunni · Sep 2, 2011

Rick Webb said:
The goal is to raise enough money to put him and his boat on a trailer and send it and him somewhere else.

Anyone want to offer to put him up till he gets his boat fixed? I will put you in contact with the orchestrator of that movement.

Rick;
Do we have a POC for this effort to get the guy off the beach?

Maybe the lot of you armchair quarterbacks with a touch of sympathy could email the DA, Mayor and City Manager and politely request that they back off. Their POC email is up thread. That would be useful.

Ross · Sep 2, 2011

can we be sure that these two men are not related? http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/1645749...t/us-sailor-rescued-chile-headed-toward-land/

Mike Turner · Sep 2, 2011

"Barnes said he did not regret attempting to become the first American to circumnavigate the globe solo."

Seems to me Joshua Slocum gets to claim that honor. Maybe Barnes meant to say "non-stop" - would he have been the first US citizen to do that?

redhead78 · Sep 2, 2011

It is a shame he is being dumped on because he is nobody...I would probably had a few drinks if I lost everything. And as far as the pr*cks that want to prosecute him, boy do they have shot memories, I seem to remember a family from Hyanisport, that dropped a car, in Chappaquidick, not only with "OMG" gas in it, but a person also, a nephew who flew a fully gassed plane into the water. I don,t recall them being treated anything like this..... And a history of alcohol...please...Its bull*hit and privlidge.....Sorry I should not sugar coat it....Red