NMEA 0183 incompatibility \ any experts?

[Skipper]

Standard Horizon GX2150 w\AIS. Raymarine SPX-5. New Garmin 44DV chartplotter, replacing 76CSX.
The 44DV and 2150 only have 0183 for network. The 44DV can run at either 4800(STD) or 38400(HS). Has to be one or the other for all communication.
The AIS is only sent from the 2150 at 38400. Therefore, the 44DV has to be set to 38400.
--Garmin support has confirmed the above--

However, the AP can only receive GPS data at 4800.

This is a real pisser, because the 44DV is advertised as being able to receive and plot AIS and DCS, yet it only has one port to configure the baud.

I guess the real problem is the AP, which does not understand the data at 38400. I tried it. So, the radio and the plotter would work together at HS, but the AP would then be blind to GPS. Or I could have the radio and AP understand the GPS data at 4800, and even plot DCS, but the AIS wouldn't work, --and the AIS plotting was one of the selling points for the 44DV for me. Right now I use the RAM3 which is ok, but sure would be nice to see it on the larger, high res, color charts.

I know a multi-plexer can be used to slow down the baud to the AP. That would logically make everything work. But they're as much $ as the chartplotter was :-0 so I'm hoping another person here has this equipment list, and has found another solution to post. This is current and common equipment, yet apparently incompatible on 0183.

 

[JamesG161]

Raymarine SPX-5.

Call Raymarine.

but the AP would then be blind to GPS

GPS is valuable for tracks and routes, but not a true course. On long cruises it is more valuable.
Jim...

 

[Meriachee]

Yep. Been there, installed that, with the exception of an a65 plotter. Wound up with an Actisense converter to do the translation. It's about the only one given any accreditation by all the manufacturers, and it's about $100.
It's a 'plug and configure and play' solution, but there's never been a blip (no pun intended) of trouble from it.

I wasn't none too happy about it either, but it was the only way the stuff would talk.

 

[Skipper]

Call Raymarine.

GPS is valuable for tracks and routes, but not a true course. On long cruises it is more valuable.
Jim...

Thank you for taking the time to respond.
However, doesn't answer my question.

Raymarine has no advice, except to send it 4800, or switch to 2000 or seatalk.

The value of GPS to AP is a different topic. Suffice to say I use it, and have used it for many years. And it is exceeeedingly valuable for true course. It's set to navigate by true North. Or it can be changed to magnetic. It takes leeway, current, heading, etc into consideration.
-or maybe I'm misreading what you meant-
Used for to-destination, back to harbor etc. mostly relaxing back to harbor from many miles out, including after dark in the winter. All I have to do is keep the sails right, which is easy with our steady winds and a good flashlight. I use it extensively for this, and am not going to change to other navigation/piloting protocols unless I have to. I like it the way it is.

 

[Skipper]

Yep. Been there, installed that, with the exception of an a65 plotter. Wound up with an Actisense converter to do the translation. It's about the only one given any accreditation by all the manufacturers, and it's about $100.
It's a 'plug and configure and play' solution, but there's never been a blip (no pun intended) of trouble from it.

I wasn't none too happy about it either, but it was the only way the stuff would talk.

Thank you, Meriachee.
Was the A65 a 0183 to 2000 conversion issue or does the Actisense change the baud on 0183 from 38400 to 4800?

 

[Meriachee]

The issue was getting the radio to talk STng. I have an itc5 to convert the older sensors to STng, and the Actisense only talks to the radio. The a65 is on the "Ray" network.
So, if you make yourself a little 0183 network with the Garmin and the Standard, (you may need a hub or something) running at 38.4, you connect that network to the Actisense version with an 0183 on one side and an STng on the other, and with the required Actisense STng adapter plug, you connect that to the "Ray" network. It should work just fine.

Of course, you'll not have the right plugs, and "T" fittings and cable lengths and all the usual nonsense that goes with it.

Have a look at the Actisense website, they were fantastic at replying to email, tell them what you have and they'll tell you what you need. I have no affiliation. I just needed to make it all work.

 

[JamesG161]

Raymarine has no advice, except to send it 4800, or switch to 2000 or seatalk.

RM makes a 0183 to SeaTalk® converter.
I understood your problem, clearly. I have a total Raymarine 2015 to ST"old" that does what you seek, I even have that 0183 converter, which I will add to my ICOM FM's 0183, to link DSC RM's SeaTalk®.

I use my Chart plotter to put waypoints, but depending on winds and tides, set the course using Magnetic Course standard and rarely use routes or tracks for the AP. Touch screen points gives me magnetic heading ( or COG which is current short term), distance, and ≈ETA.

Actisense converter to do the translation.

They have a bunch of conversion modules.
Jim...

PS: I hoped my post would lower the frustration level, while you looked.

 

[Meriachee]

RM makes a 0183 to SeaTalk® converter.

Careful. The SPX and i70 and p70 displays are STng.

SeaTalk and 0183 and 2000 and STng are different protocols.
Ray's 0183 to SeaTalk converter is just that, SeaTalk. The SPX wants STng, which is a whole lot closer to 2000, and not at all like SeaTalk.
There's been much discussion on this forum about getting them all to talk, and after all the discussion, I can't recall a single person ever coming back and saying that they "tied wires together" and made it work. The funny part in it all is that the sentence structure between them is almost exactly the same, but far enough different that SOME stuff wouldn't work. Far better to get the right stuff, even if it's another box (sigh) and be done with it.

 

[Skipper]

The issue was getting the radio to talk STng. I have an itc5 to convert the older sensors to STng, and the Actisense only talks to the radio. The a65 is on the "Ray" network.
So, if you make yourself a little 0183 network with the Garmin and the Standard, (you may need a hub or something) running at 38.4, you connect that network to the Actisense version with an 0183 on one side and an STng on the other, and with the required Actisense STng adapter plug, you connect that to the "Ray" network. It should work just fine.

Of course, you'll not have the right plugs, and "T" fittings and cable lengths and all the usual nonsense that goes with it.

Yep that would work (looks like). Most of the connections, including the wires from the radio at the nav station inside, come together near the AP computer in the sail locker next to the helm. Cables from the helm just go through the cockpit side wall. So your idea would not require much cabling, and I think I have extras anyway. Just need the module. I emailed Actisense. I saw their multiplexer is $300 :-O so I hope whatever box I need will be, well, less.
Thanks again.

 

[Skipper]

PS: I hoped my post would lower the frustration level, while you looked.

Thank you. They do these things on purpose I mean, how hard would it have been to include multiple ports on the Garmin, to allow one baud for output and another for input. Or to have the AP allow configuring the data input baud to 38400. Instead, I get to use up others' time, spend more $, and hook up numerous other things. And these are current-day modern electronics. $2,000 worth. Some say it's relative, but cheap and simple yet important functions like this should be included. If I bought a $2,000 component stereo, I'd expect it to have a headphone jack.
And I read the manual on the 44DV before I bought it. I missed the RM-AP-when-using-AIS-forcing-38400-baud-on-the-same-0183-network-but-the-RM-AP-only-allows-4800-baud....incompatibility.

 

[Meriachee]

It doesn't matter how much time you spend, there's always something that amounts to 'fine print' that you miss. I was thoroughly pissed when I found out that I needed the itc5 to connect all the legacy stuff to the STng, and just about livid when I got the p70 and found that the firmware required boxing it up and sending it to the coast to get updated. Hence, the a65, it allows firmware upgrades, but it's another component and something else to break....

 

[Bill Roosa]

Well they all have kids to send through college so what did you expect? If you want compatability just stick with one manufacturer or upgrade to NEMA 2000. I would note that SeaTalk NG (nest gen)(not SeaTalk HS (high speed)) IS compatable with NEMA 2000 with just a converter cable to address the plug shape differance. I realize that there is a lot of sunk cost for you with this solution so I'd recommend buy another GPS and run two circuits as the least cost solution.
Good luck

 

[Skipper]

I'd recommend buy another GPS and run two circuits as the least cost solution.
Good luck

That's not a terrible idea. I thought of doing just that with the old 76CSX. Use it as dedicated nav for the AP. Would just have to figure out where to put it. The helm is about full on the stbd side(pic-44dv is now where the 76 is in the pic - sorry dark it's all I have on this phone), and I don't want anything on the other side. I don't want it on the top because I grab there. Anyway getting long winded.
Might be the solution, thank you.

 

[kito]

I just received my new EV-100 autopilot. It has the 6 pin Seatalk ng connections. I have a SH CPF190i chartplotter/depth finder and a SH GX2150 vhf with built-in AIS that I want to hook into the autopilot. I was hoping it would be an easy install but after reading this thread, I am very concerned. The chartplotter and vhf is nmea 0183 and the schematic shows to just connect the yellow and green (common) to the autopilot. I sure hope it's that simple...........

 

[Skipper]

I just received my new EV-100 autopilot. It has the 6 pin Seatalk ng connections. I have a SH CPF190i chartplotter/depth finder and a SH GX2150 vhf with built-in AIS that I want to hook into the autopilot. I was hoping it would be an easy install but after reading this thread, I am very concerned. The chartplotter and vhf is nmea 0183 and the schematic shows to just connect the yellow and green (common) to the autopilot. I sure hope it's that simple...........

My complexity arises from my wanting to send AIS data to the chartplotter. If you're not doing this then yes your connections would be as simple as you describe, with a single baud rate (4800). If the EV-100 can accept NMEA 0183.